Cotto vs. Judah: strengths, weaknesses, opportunities

[Double L]

When this fight was first announced, it seemed like a no-brainer. And in many ways it still is. Afterall, Judah couldn't handle the pressure and power of Baldomir, how's he going to do it against Cotto, who is quicker than Carlos, hits harder, and is every bit as aggressive and determined?

So for those picking Judah, or even those thinking he has a chance, I think you have some explaining to do. :lol:

Shouldn't Cotto get some heat for taking this match-up? Isn't Judah just a left-over at this point? Especially at 147 where he's only had one meaningful win.

I would've liked to see Cotto/Clottey, or Cotto/Cintron. But I guess that's my opinion because the case could be made that Judah is better than both those guys, although I'd disagree.

Why is Judah a perceived threat? What has he done ever to suggest he can beat Cotto?

I think Cotto will have some early difficulty dealing with Judah's speed, but once he gets used to it, he will take the necessary risks to get inside and basically beat the fight out of Judah, the same way Baldomir and PBF did, and to a lesser extent Pineda.

[dymipepel]

Cotto, who is quicker than Carlos, hits harder, and is every bit as aggressive and determined?


Are you picking Mayweather to shut out Cotto by that sentence?

[dymipepel]

Shouldn't Cotto get some heat for taking this match-up? Isn't Judah just a left-over at this point? Especially at 147 where he's only had one meaningful win.


Well, Judah had 0 meaningful wins at 140, so Cotto should get some credit for taking on Judah.

[Double L]

Well, Judah had 0 meaningful wins at 140, so Cotto should get some credit for taking on Baldomir.

I realize I mention PBF in the thread, but can we leave him out of it?

[dymipepel]

I realize I mention PBF in the thread, but can we leave him out of it?

Sure, if you insist, I corrected my initial post.
But back to the point......Defeating Spinks at 147 is the biggest achievement of Judah's career, such as it is. Therefore, Cotto should get all credit in the world for beating Judah at 147, the division where Judah achieved his biggest success.

[slystaff]

When this fight was first announced, it seemed like a no-brainer. And in many ways it still is. Afterall, Judah couldn't handle the pressure and power of Baldomir, how's he going to do it against Cotto, who is quicker than Carlos, hits harder, and is every bit as aggressive and determined?

So for those picking Judah, or even those thinking he has a chance, I think you have some explaining to do. :lol:

Shouldn't Cotto get some heat for taking this match-up? Isn't Judah just a left-over at this point? Especially at 147 where he's only had one meaningful win.

I would've liked to see Cotto/Clottey, or Cotto/Cintron. But I guess that's my opinion because the case could be made that Judah is better than both those guys, although I'd disagree.

Why is Judah a perceived threat? What has he done ever to suggest he can beat Cotto?

I think Cotto will have some early difficulty dealing with Judah's speed, but once he gets used to it, he will take the necessary risks to get inside and basically beat the fight out of Judah, the same way Baldomir and PBF did, and to a lesser extent Pineda.

Agreed that Cotto should win. Disagree with your sentiment that Judah has little to no chance. Judah hits HARD and is very fast, and is a southpaw. Cotto has been shaken up before (BADLY by Corely).

[Hex-One]

Agreed that Cotto should win. Disagree with your sentiment that Judah has little to no chance. Judah hits HARD and is very fast, and is a southpaw. Cotto has been shaken up before (BADLY by Corely).

Agreed!

[dymipepel]

I'm actually somewhat disappointed in Cotto. Fighting Judah after defeating Urkal? What kind of crap is that? Fighting 2 bums like that in a row is unacceptable! What is he going to do next? Beat up on Sharmba Mitchell? What self-respecting fighter would take that route??

[Antwuan Maxx]

I'm actually somewhat disappointed in Cotto. Fighting Judah after defeating Urkal? What kind of crap is that? Fighting 2 bums like that in a row is unacceptable! What is he going to do next? Beat up on Sharmba Mitchell? What self-respecting fighter would take that route??

Who would you have rather seen him fight this June? Margarito? No, he turned the fight down to fight Williams. Clottey? No, he just fought in April. Cintron? Nope. Promoter issues. Mosley? Nah, promoter beef. Who does that leave?

[ILLUMINATI]

Agreed that Cotto should win. Disagree with your sentiment that Judah has little to no chance. Judah hits HARD and is very fast, and is a southpaw. Cotto has been shaken up before (BADLY by Corely).
thats it.

He was hurt against Corley...and Judah does every Corley can do..just alot better....Cotto should still brutalize him.

[?H?L?QU?L?$]

thats it.

He was hurt against Corley...and Judah does every Corley can do..just alot better....Cotto should still brutalize him.
He got caught with a strange shot. Other than that, he didn't have too much trouble with Corley. He shouldn't have too much trouble with Judah as well.

[ILLUMINATI]

He got caught with a strange shot. Other than that, he didn't have too much trouble with Corley. He shouldn't have too much trouble with Judah as well.

Unless Judah lands a right hook to the temple of Cotto..if it happen Cotto should survive and still KOJUDAHTFO..

[Maj]

Anyone wanna meet me in Bets and Wagers? I've got $25 on Judah.

I foresee Cotto catching a huge surprise when he digs in to the body against the powerful southpaw in Judah. Judah has had many an opportunity to learn the ills of his ways, and this fight will prove that the boy is serious about his craft. I do believe he's been distracted and downright dumb in fights, but he knows this is do or die for him. Say what you want about Judah, but he is still Cotto's biggest fight ever.

For those crediting Cotto with his vics over ???, remember this is the guy that went 12 with Malignaggi. One sided it was, but Paulie was still standing. Judah is no Paulie.

[ILLUMINATI]

Anyone wanna meet me in Bets and Wagers? I've got $25 on Judah.

I foresee Cotto catching a huge surprise when he digs in to the body against the powerful southpaw in Judah. Judah has had many an opportunity to learn the ills of his ways, and this fight will prove that the boy is serious about his craft. I do believe he's been distracted and downright dumb in fights, but he knows this is do or die for him. Say what you want about Judah, but he is still Cotto's biggest fight ever.

For those crediting Cotto with his vics over ???, remember this is the guy that went 12 with Malignaggi. One sided it was, but Paulie was still standing. Judah is no Paulie.

I WILL.....:cheer:

[Maj]

I WILL.....:cheer:

Its good!! See you there for confirmation.

[ILLUMINATI]

Its good!! See you there for confirmation.

:lol:

what is the password...? do you know..

[Maj]

:lol:

what is the password...? do you know..

I just pm'ed you.

[ILLUMINATI]

I just pm'ed you.

AND I got the pm..i nknew that was the password..but i stil can't log into that forum...or the smacktalk forum....and i know the password for both..

[ILLUMINATI]

but it's ON!!!

[Double L]

I'm still not convinced this is anything but a one-sided beat down. Sure, Judah will handle himself early on and land some eye-catching counters, like he always does. But he's not gonna knock Cotto out, even if he hurts him.

Thing is, the only way he's gonna hurt Cotto is by trading with him. And there's virtually no way Judah will be able to trade with Cotto without getting hurt himself.

So there you have it. Judah has a chance to make it interesting. Even a chance to hurt Cotto. What he has NO chance of doing is stopping Cotto or beating him by decision - he's shown more than three times that he can't stay in the game in the long haul.

And yet, Cotto has proven that even if he's hurt, he will not be stopped and more importantly he will not be discouraged.

To me, this is kind of a bitch move by Cotto who hasn't faced a top tier opponent his whole career. To me, this is an easy way out, the same way it was for PBF - avoid the really dangerous guys at 147: Margarito, Cintron, Williams and Clottey, and instead, take on a guy who is a proven choke.

[Alabama_Man]

The only real question here is whether Judah is going to do a tap dance when the glass in his jaw shatters. It's going to sound like an errant baseball through some old woman's window.

[Free Ike]

I'm still not convinced this is anything but a one-sided beat down. Sure, Judah will handle himself early on and land some eye-catching counters, like he always does. But he's not gonna knock Cotto out, even if he hurts him.

Thing is, the only way he's gonna hurt Cotto is by trading with him. And there's virtually no way Judah will be able to trade with Cotto without getting hurt himself.

So there you have it. Judah has a chance to make it interesting. Even a chance to hurt Cotto. What he has NO chance of doing is stopping Cotto or beating him by decision - he's shown more than three times that he can't stay in the game in the long haul.

And yet, Cotto has proven that even if he's hurt, he will not be stopped and more importantly he will not be discouraged.

To me, this is kind of a bitch move by Cotto who hasn't faced a top tier opponent his whole career. To me, this is an easy way out, the same way it was for PBF - avoid the really dangerous guys at 147: Margarito, Cintron, Williams and Clottey, and instead, take on a guy who is a proven choke.
:bears: :bears:

[Double L]

The only real question here is whether Judah is going to do a tap dance when the glass in his jaw shatters. It's going to sound like an errant baseball through some old woman's window.


:lol:

exactly. Cotto is exactly the type of fighter Judah will never beat. Never.

Judah could "possibly" beat a guy like PBF. he did beat a guy like Spinks. and he beat a guy like Corley and Witter.

but a rugged guy like Cotto? with power, talent, aggression and determination? never.

[Rubio MHS]

I'm picking Judah because Double L is picking Cotto, and he's always wrong.

[Double L]

I'm picking Judah because Double L is picking Cotto, and he's always wrong.

at least i record my picks. and more often than not, they're right. but it suits your know-it-all fragile psyche more to pretend they're not.

who were your picks on saturday by the way? didn't see em listed.

[Rubio MHS]

I picked Taylor. I didn't give a shit about the other fights.

You are always wrong, even on the easiest of picks, like Mayweather-Baldomir. What the fuck were you thinking?!?!?!?

[Double L]

I picked Taylor. I didn't give a shit about the other fights.

You are always wrong, even on the easiest of picks, like Mayweather-Baldomir. What the fuck were you thinking?!?!?!?

awe, fk you. :lol: i explained myself thoroughly concerning that pick, both before the fight, and after. you've already stolen too much of my time discussing it.

"I didn't give a shit about the other fights."

translation: "I didn't make a pick for fear of being wrong. This way, I can remain up on my high horse and pretend I never ever make a wrong pick."

[Rubio MHS]

I simply am not into obsessively picking fights. If I don't care about a fight, and I'm not betting on it, what's the point?

[KaukipRrr]

:nono: Agreed with Double L, Baldomir does everything bad, so the one required attribute you need to beat Judah's arse is a little bit of resilience early, just a little bit, and most are qualified including a vast array of journeyman. Cotto has never been knocked out, Baldomir has, so we can't even assume Carlos has the better trait in remaining upright. Cotto, like most top fighters, is in everyway superior to Baldomir, like someone said, better skills, better power, better offense, better defense, better footwork....just everything....simply everything.. Zab's gettin' fucked, mental deficiencies DONT GO AWAY, they didn't go away with Golota, and they didn't go away with Tyson, just because people can't see Zab's psychological disconnection like as if it was a glass chin (which he has anyway) people don't consider it, it doesn't register,..and when he's disgraced himself once again, he'll STILL be overrated, he can be whored out to the titlists and get away with it because people seem to go "ooooooooooooooooooo" at the sight of handspeed,.. that's also why so many gave Clottey too much credit in the Margarito fight, he'd land a quick explosive 3 punch combo and that apparently negated the 15 bodyshots and 10 headshots Margarito landed consecutively proceeding it,..."oooooooooooooo!" :nono: those of you picking the proven loser should wake up to yourselves, this fight is a no brainer. :nono: and Maj, that Spaniard's about to take your money,..:nono:

[Hex-One]

I can't believe everyone is calling Judah a bum:dunno: Damn everyone is a bum these days. Just to refresh some memories here Judah had Mayweather beat for the first 5 rounds in my book. He scored a clean knockdown and was out landing Mayweather. I challenge anyone who dosent think Judah didnt score a clean knockdown. This is going to be a very dangerous fight the first half of the fight. You guys are already making Cotto's win look irrelevant if he does win.:nono: I think this fight will prove alot, Judah is the best opponent thus far.

[ILLUMINATI]

I can't believe everyone is calling Judah a bum:dunno: Damn everyone is a bum these days. Just to refresh some memories here Judah had Mayweather beat for the first 5 rounds in my book. He scored a clean knockdown and was out landing Mayweather. I challenge anyone who dosent think Judah didnt score a clean knockdown. This is going to be a very dangerous fight the first half of the fight. You guys are already making Cotto's win look irrelevant if he does win.:nono: I think this fight will prove alot, Judah is the best opponent thus far.
well thats the whole point...for some Castillo is a bum cause he had some early career defeats..yet Margarito has had 3-4 defeats and hasn't accomplish half of what JLC has, but he is a proven warrior king tough and determine fighter cause he beat Kermit...while Castillo is a skilless bum.

[TKO]

I can't believe everyone is calling Judah a bum:dunno: Damn everyone is a bum these days. Just to refresh some memories here Judah had Mayweather beat for the first 5 rounds in my book. He scored a clean knockdown and was out landing Mayweather. I challenge anyone who dosent think Judah didnt score a clean knockdown. This is going to be a very dangerous fight the first half of the fight. You guys are already making Cotto's win look irrelevant if he does win.:nono: I think this fight will prove alot, Judah is the best opponent thus far.

Button it ya bum!!

But seriously I agree I think Zab is a good fighter that had the Great Mayweather on the back foot.

[Hex-One]

well thats the whole point...for some Castillo is a bum cause he had some early career defeats..yet Margarito has had 3-4 defeats and hasn't accomplish half of what JLC has, but he is a proven warrior king tough and determine fighter cause he beat Kermit...while Castillo is a skilless bum. I agree and Castillo beat Mayweather in the first fight, but yet he is a bum?:dunno:



:lol:

[ILLUMINATI]

I agree and Castillo beat Mayweather in the first fight, but yet he is a bum?:dunno:



:lol: Mayweather, Casamayor, Lazcano, Corrales, maybe soon Hatton...yet he is a bum. Margarito Kermit, Clottey and maybe another Cintronish in WILLIAMS in a few weeks.....maybe...

[Double L]

I can't believe everyone is calling Judah a bum:dunno: Damn everyone is a bum these days. Just to refresh some memories here Judah had Mayweather beat for the first 5 rounds in my book. He scored a clean knockdown and was out landing Mayweather. I challenge anyone who dosent think Judah didnt score a clean knockdown. This is going to be a very dangerous fight the first half of the fight. You guys are already making Cotto's win look irrelevant if he does win.:nono: I think this fight will prove alot, Judah is the best opponent thus far.

Judah is always ahead after 5 rounds. And after 12, if he makes it that far, he always loses.

Nobody is saying Judah is a bum. But facts are facts. The guy hasn't beaten anyone.

Maybe if this were a stay-busy fight on regular HBO it wouldn't be so bad. But billed as some sort of major challenge for Cotto? It's B.S.

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

To me, this is kind of a bitch move by Cotto who hasn't faced a top tier opponent his whole career. To me, this is an easy way out, the same way it was for PBF - avoid the really dangerous guys at 147: Margarito, Cintron, Williams and Clottey, and instead, take on a guy who is a proven choke.
Maxx already told you why this fight is happening.

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

well thats the whole point...for some Castillo is a bum cause he had some early career defeats..yet Margarito has had 3-4 defeats and hasn't accomplish half of what JLC has, but he is a proven warrior king tough and determine fighter cause he beat Kermit...while Castillo is a skilless bum.
Margorito is a monster because Floyd didn't fight him. If Floyd did fight him you know he would be nothing :lol:

[Double L]

Maxx already told you why this fight is happening.

why is it again?

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

why is it again?Go to page 1 of this thread :lol:

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

Who would you have rather seen him fight this June? Margarito? No, he turned the fight down to fight Williams. Clottey? No, he just fought in April. Cintron? Nope. Promoter issues. Mosley? Nah, promoter beef. Who does that leave?there you go LL.

[dymipepel]

there you go LL.

He could've rematched Abdullaev. I hear Abdula has grown a pair since their last fight.

[az cat]

I think Judah has a great chance to win this fight. Like all fighters, speed bothers Cotto. And the Cotto that I have seen in recent fights seems to be settling into a steady, predictable rhythm in the ring-- not good when you are facing someone who outclasses you in the speed department.

At this point in his career, I think Judah is in touch enough with his limitations to avoid getting into a pissing contest with Cotto.

We have seen him string together impressive rounds against Mayweather so he can certainly hang in there with Cotto.

When Cotto throws his right hand to the body, he leaves it low and offers a fantastic counter chance for Zab. This is the punch I see Judah hurting Cotto with.

And if he does hurt Cotto, Zab is a FAR superior finisher to either Corley or Torres. Doubtful Miguel gets 2 minutes to run in place while no one hits him, like he did against Chop Chop.

[Double L]

I think Judah has a great chance to win this fight. Like all fighters, speed bothers Cotto. And the Cotto that I have seen in recent fights seems to be settling into a steady, predictable rhythm in the ring-- not good when you are facing someone who outclasses you in the speed department.

At this point in his career, I think Judah is in touch enough with his limitations to avoid getting into a pissing contest with Cotto.

We have seen him string together impressive rounds against Mayweather so he can certainly hang in there with Cotto.

When Cotto throws his right hand to the body, he leaves it low and offers a fantastic counter chance for Zab. This is the punch I see Judah hurting Cotto with.

And if he does hurt Cotto, Zab is a FAR superior finisher to either Corley or Torres. Doubtful Miguel gets 2 minutes to run in place while no one hits him, like he did against Chop Chop.

Torres and Corley both landed many sick shots on Cotto once he was hurt. To the body, to the chin, one after the other. They just couldn't get him out of there. It wasn't because they suck at finishing. It's because Cotto is a fucking truck!

I agree with you that Cotto's predictability makes him less effective than say, Baldomir was, who if nothing else was unpredictable. But thing is, Cotto hits way harder than him and way harder than PBF. No way does Judah avoid the incoming for 12 rounds. No way does Judah put Cotto away. No way does Judah sustain a lead for 12 rounds. It all adds up to a definite win for Cotto.

[slystaff]

Torres and Corley both landed many sick shots on Cotto once he was hurt. To the body, to the chin, one after the other. They just couldn't get him out of there. It wasn't because they suck at finishing. It's because Cotto is a fucking truck!
.

Sorry dude, but in the Corley fight in particular it was because Corley SUCKED at finishing. He basically let the man off the hook. He was just watching Cotto and throwing one punch at a time at the man's body...HIS BODY????

Judah would have gone crazy like an enraged Pitbull and thrown every punch PLUS the kitchen sink at Cotto's exposed noggin!

[ILLUMINATI]

Sorry dude, but in the Corley fight in particular it was because Corley SUCKED at finishing. He basically let the man off the hook. He was just watching Cotto and throwing one punch at a time at the man's body...HIS BODY????

Judah would have gone crazy like an enraged Pitbull and thrown every punch PLUS the kitchen sink at Cotto's exposed noggin!

He might get his chance in June 9...he goes nuts and tries for the KO, and he ends up in the canvas KOTFO...

[Free Ike]

Judah has about a 10% chance. Let's not bullshit. This is hardly a marquee Matchup, but we are talking about Miguel Cotto, the most protected fighter outside of Germany. Honestly, this should be ab easy, easy, easy, kayo win for him. If he doesn't dominate Judah like other fighters have, he is a stinking fraud. I write this for Illuminati.


I am not giving credit to Cotto for taking this BULLSHIT fight BEFORE the fight.

If he wins, like he should, Cotto deserves no credit for beating a guy who hasn't won in 2 years.

If he loses, :lol: :lol: . He won't this isn't even a 60/40 type of fight. Judah has little chance to win as he is a proven and repeated flop (literally) at the big or not so big level. He just isn't very good.

[ILLUMINATI]

Judah has about a 10% chance. Let's not bullshit. This is hardly a marquee Matchup, but we are talking about Miguel Cotto, the most protected fighter outside of Germany. Honestly, this should be ab easy, easy, easy, kayo win for him. If he doesn't dominate Judah like other fighters have, he is a stinking fraud. I write this for Illuminati.


I am not giving credit to Cotto for taking this BULLSHIT fight BEFORE the fight.

If he wins, like he should, Cotto deserves no credit for beating a guy who hasn't won in 2 years.

If he loses, :lol: :lol: . He won't this isn't even a 60/40 type of fight. Judah has little chance to win as he is a proven and repeated flop (literally) at the big or not so big level. He just isn't very good.

Ofcouse you won't give Cotto credit...never ever...even if he beats Margarita...you will say..ohh Margarito didn't look that good against Williams he might be a bit past his prime..or some other excuse not to give Cotto credit.....but then again you don't give any fighter credit unless it's Winky Wright...and everyone else is a bum...

[Free Ike]

Ofcouse you won't give Cotto credit...never ever...even if he beats Margarita...you will say..ohh Margarito didn't look that good against Williams he might be a bit past his prime..or some other excuse not to give Cotto credit.....but then again you don't give any fighter credit unless it's Winky Wright...and everyone else is a bum...
I already told you, I will give Joto credit if he beats Margarito.

[ILLUMINATI]

I already told you, I will give Joto credit if he beats Margarito.

Unless he looks questionable against Williams....you know the PROVEN welterweight Paul Williams...biggest win against an old Sharmba Mitchell. :cheer:

[Free Ike]

Unless he looks questionable against Williams....you know the PROVEN welterweight Paul Williams...biggest win against an old Sharmba Mitchell. :cheer:
Margarito is not very good, but he is a legit Welterweight unlike Judah who got an undeserved 2nd shot at Stinks after he was drubbed in the first fight. Judah is a little umpa lumpa. He is the more accomplished fighter, but Margarito isn't a proven bust like Judah is. He has some skill, but he is a small welter. Margarito is a legit Welter. He'd fuck up Judah easily as well.

[Alabama_Man]

Fagarito sucks.

I honestly think Fagarito is one of the worst chin-first fighters to be ever overrated by clueless shitheads like those on this board. I'd even argue he's not a legit welter. He cuts 50 pounds before every fight with daily enemas and drinking water and eating bread 12 days before the bout.

[Free Ike]

Fagarito sucks.

I honestly think Fagarito is one of the worst chin-first fighters to be ever overrated by clueless shitheads like those on this board. I'd even argue he's not a legit welter. He cuts 50 pounds before every fight with daily enemas and drinking water and eating bread 12 days before the bout.
That is what most 175 pound men do at Welter. Honestly, legit Welter means illegitimate welter really. Judah and Mayweather could probably just eat 3 square and train and be below 147. They are exceptions. Honestly, if you made a rule about percentage of weight lost. Just about every champion would move up 2 or 3 divisions with few exceptions. Of the top of my head, Judah, PBF and Pacman.

[Alabama_Man]

That is what most 175 pound men do at Welter. Honestly, legit Welter means illegitimate welter really. Judah and Mayweather could probably just eat 3 square and train and be below 147. They are exceptions. Honestly, if you made a rule about percentage of weight lost. Just about every champion would move up 2 or 3 divisions with few exceptions. Of the top of my head, Judah, PBF and Pacman.

That's true. I'm just kind of annoyed people hold Fagarito in such high regard. I don't think those people have even seen him fight.

[Free Ike]

That's true. I'm just kind of annoyed people hold Fagarito in such high regard. I don't think those people have even seen him fight.
I think he sucks but he is and would be difficult for most welters to beat. He is big strong and relentless and he is akward even worse than Baldomir. I think he'd smack Judah around and would get the decision over Stinks because he'd run like the wind. He is terrible in everyway but he has the size and the fury to make up for alot of it. I don't think anyone holds him in high regard. He isn't a P4P type of fighter but at 147 he is going to be a tough fight for anyone.

[KaukipRrr]

I think Judah has a great chance to win this fight. Like all fighters, speed bothers Cotto.

Not 'all' fighters,.. Tszyu for one, was the opposite,...he LOOOOOOOOVED fighting against speed,..he would use his right hand like a frog's tongue. It was the slow, slugging swarmers he'd struggle against.

[ILLUMINATI]

Not 'all' fighters,.. Tszyu for one, was the opposite,...he LOOOOOOOOVED fighting against speed,..he would use his right hand like a frog's tongue. It was the slow, slugging swarmers he'd struggle against.

:rolleyes: cause he QUIT against slugging swarmer Hatton he struggle against them..?

Yeah Vince Phillips was alos a slugging swarmer..with SHIT SPEED..:rolleyes::flip:

[KaukipRrr]

Unless he looks questionable against Williams....you know the PROVEN welterweight Paul Williams...biggest win against an old Sharmba Mitchell. :cheer:

I'm going to have to go and get those old posts of yours,..screaming, and screaming for Margarito to fight his mandatory while the prospect of a Cotto fight was in the works. :crafty: You've got to be more careful if your going to contradict yourself all the time my son,...

:nono: and by the way to the rest of you haters,..nobody says that Margarito has brilliant technical skills, but he does have a unique offensive ability to retain power in shots from unconventional angles that can penetrate even the best defences, he has shoulder sockets of iron, and 'bum welterweights' don't beat Cintron or Clottey, those two are near the top of the division, Top 5. If everyone fought with the will and heart of Margarito, the sport would be in great shape, he's one of boxing's saviours and should be appreciated, especially in an age out of sheer desperation people are clinging to Fraud Mayweather and celebrating him through trauma induced delusions. :nono:

[KaukipRrr]

:rolleyes: cause he QUIT against slugging swarmer Hatton he struggle against them..?

Yeah Vince Phillips was alos a slugging swarmer..with SHIT SPEED..:rolleyes::flip:

The reason why Sharmba Mitchell gave "Tszyu all he could handle" in the first fight was because Mitchell employed a similar tactic Hatton did, grab clutch, close the gap, Mitchell threw himself into the correct area accidentally, just out of fear of his power.

[ILLUMINATI]

The reason why Sharmba Mitchell gave "Tszyu all he could handle" in the first fight was because Mitchell employed a similar tactic Hatton did, grab clutch, close the gap, Mitchell threw himself into the correct area accidentally, just out of fear of his power.

and and don't forget that Mitchell had a fucked up leg in the first fight....:popcorn:

[ILLUMINATI]

I'm going to have to go and get those old posts of yours,..screaming, and screaming for Margarito to fight his mandatory while the prospect of a Cotto fight was in the works. :crafty: You've got to be more careful if your going to contradict yourself all the time my son,...

:nono: and by the way to the rest of you haters,..nobody says that Margarito has brilliant technical skills, but he does have a unique offensive ability to retain power in shots from unconventional angles that can penetrate even the best defences, he has shoulder sockets of iron, and 'bum welterweights' don't beat Cintron or Clottey, those two are near the top of the division, Top 5. If everyone fought with the will and heart of Margarito, the sport would be in great shape, he's one of boxing's saviours and should be appreciated, especially in an age out of sheer desperation people are clinging to Fraud Mayweather and celebrating him through trauma induced delusions. :nono:

Not shitting on Margarito vs. Williams..should be a good fight..while it last. Margarito doesn't want none of Miguel Cotto.....he could've fougth Williams in March..then Cotto in June..he decided not to..cause ARUM wasn't being FAIR with him.......Margarito a guy that has bitch and bitch about nobody wants to fight me...i'm broke as hell i need money please fight me Oscar..but has the audacity to refuse 1.5-6 million to fight MIGUEL COTTO....just cause it was there for June doesn't mean it will be there for September or October...:nono:

[KaukipRrr]

and and don't forget that Mitchell had a fucked up leg in the first fight....:popcorn:

Yeah, so he couldn't flutter around on the outside like he had wished,..Tszyu looooooooooves 'good footwork'...people HATED this about Tszyu, he looked stiff, one dimensional, somewhat slow and wide open, to be outboxed EASILY with a bit of flashy stuff from the outside, it never happenned, nor will it ever happen, Tszyu's timing, reflexes and accuracey were his GREAT attributes, he NEEDED you to run..

[KaukipRrr]

Not shitting on Margarito vs. Williams..should be a good fight..while it last. Margarito doesn't want none of Miguel Cotto.....he could've fougth Williams in March..then Cotto in June..he decided not to..cause ARUM wasn't being FAIR with him.......Margarito a guy that has bitch and bitch about nobody wants to fight me...i'm broke as hell i need money please fight me Oscar..but has the audacity to refuse 1.5-6 million to fight MIGUEL COTTO....just cause it was there for June doesn't mean it will be there for September or October...:nono:

No. he couldn't fight that early as he had a legitimate hand injury that Eaner confirmed was bothering him throughout his training camp that he re-injured in the fight, but he's a tough motherfucker so your not going to hear him bitch and squeal about his 'hurts' in the corner under any circumstances the way you heard Clottey crying about it, and the Cotto fight is still guaranteed for him according to Arum, and he's getting near 1.5 million to take care of his mandatory ...

"Stop running Margarito, Fight your mandatory!!!...fight your mandatory!!!!" - Fraud and Cotto fans,..

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

No. he couldn't fight that early as he had a legitimate hand injury that Eaner confirmed was bothering him throughout his training camp that he re-injured in the fight, but he's a tough motherfucker so your not going to hear him bitch and squeal about his 'hurts' in the corner under any circumstances the way you heard Clottey crying about it, and the Cotto fight is still guaranteed for him according to Arum, and he's getting near 1.5 million to take care of his mandatory ...

"Stop running Margarito, Fight your mandatory!!!...fight your mandatory!!!!" - Fraud and Cotto fans,..
Cotto was scheduled to fight Margorito. The Margorito decided to fight Williams instead.

[ILLUMINATI]

Cotto was scheduled to fight Margorito. The Margorito decided to fight Williams instead.

:bears:Margarito the most avoided boxer in the WORLD :rolleyes: is offer a million dollar fight..but say NO cause Arum wanted his soul..then takes 8-9 months to fight his mandatory....ohh yeah hand injury....he also mosta had a hand injury before the clottey fight

[az cat]

Torres and Corley both landed many sick shots on Cotto once he was hurt. To the body, to the chin, one after the other. They just couldn't get him out of there. It wasn't because they suck at finishing. It's because Cotto is a fucking truck!

I agree with you that Cotto's predictability makes him less effective than say, Baldomir was, who if nothing else was unpredictable. But thing is, Cotto hits way harder than him and way harder than PBF. No way does Judah avoid the incoming for 12 rounds. No way does Judah put Cotto away. No way does Judah sustain a lead for 12 rounds. It all adds up to a definite win for Cotto.

Come on Double, watch the Corley fight again. There were like 10-15 second stretches where Cotto was allowed to jog around the ring and shake out his legs. Corley was nowhere near a finisher in their fight.

I can't imagine that you actually think Judah won't finish Cotto off if he stuns him like Corley/Torres did.

[slystaff]

Come on Double, watch the Corley fight again. There were like 10-15 second stretches where Cotto was allowed to jog around the ring and shake out his legs. Corley was nowhere near a finisher in their fight.

I can't imagine that you actually think Judah won't finish Cotto off if he stuns him like Corley/Torres did.

word.

One thing though...Cotto punches like a Mule. He has very very heavy hands. Very few Welterweights can take his punches round after round, and Judah is no exception.

Either way I don't see this fight going the distance, or should I say, it's highly unlikely. Someone's getting badly hurt in there and stopped soon after.

[?H?L?QU?L?$]

I'll bet anyone Cotto crushes Judah.

Easy fight to predict.

[Orthodox Crusader]

I think Cotto has some choice weaknesses, a susceptebility to being hurt by temple shots, in particular.

But Judahs weaknesses faaaaaaar outumber those of Cotto, and this is going to make a difference.

Zab just doesn't have it upstairs.

Compare their responses to getting floored or badly hurt. Cotto has come on to win, Judah usually fades and crumbles.:nono:

[KaukipRrr]

:bears:Margarito the most avoided boxer in the WORLD :rolleyes: is offer a million dollar fight..but say NO cause Arum wanted his soul..then takes 8-9 months to fight his mandatory....ohh yeah hand injury....he also mosta had a hand injury before the clottey fight

:rolleyes:,.. he's getting around 200k less than he would have to fight Cotto in a 'super-fight',... Arum wanted to go down ''beggers can't be choosers avenue",..and Margarito's management rightfully said,...'get fucked' ..and that meant thank heavens, thank heavens for the hype surrounding Paul Williams as Fraud Mayweather's savior, I bet Margarito's management wanted to make an announcement,.. "Oh Thank you, thank you so much for making Margarito's mandatory purse more prosperous than we could have ever imagined it to be Fraud and Cotto groupies, we'll take it."

:crafty: You, and most of this messageboard got OWNED for contributing so wholesomely. Margarito's a happier man for it.

[Alabama_Man]

:.

Who did you lose the sig/avatar bet to? :dunno:

[KaukipRrr]

Who did you lose the sig/avatar bet to? :dunno:

I'm a fan, don't let the occasional criticism fool ya.

[ILLUMINATI]

:rolleyes:,.. he's getting around 200k less than he would have to fight Cotto in a 'super-fight',... Arum wanted to go down ''beggers can't be choosers avenue",..and Margarito's management rightfully said,...'get fucked' ..and that meant thank heavens, thank heavens for the hype surrounding Paul Williams as Fraud Mayweather's savior, I bet Margarito's management wanted to make an announcement,.. "Oh Thank you, thank you so much for making Margarito's mandatory purse more prosperous than we could have ever imagined it to be Fraud and Cotto groupies, we'll take it."

:crafty: You, and most of this messageboard got OWNED for contributing so wholesomely. Margarito's a happier man for it.


As long as Margarito doesn't bitch and cry after the Williams fight about nobody wanting to fight him...he should've fought COTTO when he had the chance....today doesn't guarantee tomorrow. Fight your little mandatory in a half empty arena....

[Orthodox Crusader]

Williams-Margarito is going to be an intriguing matchup and if its televised on non-PPV then you all fools are going to be watching it one way or the other. Don't act as if this is an insignificant fight:nono: in fact I reckon the winner of this could be facing off against the winner of Cotto-Judah. Unless Margarito wins that is.:tease:

[ILLUMINATI]

Williams-Margarito is going to be an intriguing matchup and if its televised on non-PPV then you all fools are going to be watching it one way or the other. Don't act as if this is an insignificant fight:nono: in fact I reckon the winner of this could be facing off against the winner of Cotto-Judah. Unless Margarito wins that is.:tease:

Margarito is after all the MOST avoided fighter in boxing....:rolleyes:..Winky called him out a few years ago after the Trinidad fight...but nah, Winky wasn't good enough to be in the same right as Margarito...the warrior king.

[puerto rock]

Judah is a better fighter, simple as that. Zab is faster, IMO more powerful, and has more skills. Unless if the layoff has too big an effect, I really think that Zab will take this one via KO.


I see Cotto getting hurt early, making a bit of a rally in the middle rounds but all along taking a nasty beating. Zab will score a couple of knockdowns in this fight and land enough shots to force a stoppage.


Too much speed and power from Judah will be Cotto's undoing I think.

[Father of Muzse]

After Zab shoots his load early, I don't see this as being any different than Chavez-Camacho.

[Orthodox Crusader]

Judah is a better fighter, simple as that. Zab is faster, IMO more powerful, and has more skills. Unless if the layoff has too big an effect, I really think that Zab will take this one via KO.


I see Cotto getting hurt early, making a bit of a rally in the middle rounds but all along taking a nasty beating. Zab will score a couple of knockdowns in this fight and land enough shots to force a stoppage.


Too much speed and power from Judah will be Cotto's undoing I think.

Cotto only has to land big a few times, and 1 of two things will happen

1. Judah gets on his bike and loses a decision.

2. Judah gets KO'd.

[KaukipRrr]

Margarito is after all the MOST avoided fighter in boxing....:rolleyes:..Winky called him out a few years ago after the Trinidad fight...but nah, Winky wasn't good enough to be in the same right as Margarito...the warrior king.

Whoops :shit: ,...Winky was the one who turned Margarito down actually while he was a free agent, then Ronald signed with Golden Boy because..I.....uh,...guess he thought negotiations would go smoothly for a Margarito fight then,..so to save face, De La Hoya cooperated to make a ridiculous offer designed to protect his pawns reputation, Arum acknowledged tactically what De La Hoya was doing, and didn't even need to give Oscar an answer, nor did Oscar follow up on that offer through the media, they both probably just smiled as he sent through the fax machine, like 'yeah, good one smart arse'. In baseball terms Illuminati, that's whatcha call a 'slider' my son..:crafty:

[Matchup_Analyzer]

Zab Judah's right hook could spell a world of trouble for Miguel Cotto

[Father of Muzse]

Zab Judah's right hook could spell a world of trouble for Miguel Cotto

I think Cotto at 147 will handle Zab's punches just fine. If they fought at 140...I'd give Zab the edge.

I'm guessing Cotto's chin issues had more to do with his cutting weight and the added weight will help him.

Many forget that Oscar was knocked down early in a couple of his fights to get up and win by decision. The last time he was truly down and hurt was against Quartey and that was in 1999.

[Double L]

I think Cotto at 147 will handle Zab's punches just fine. If they fought at 140...I'd give Zab the edge.

I'm guessing Cotto's chin issues had more to do with his cutting weight and the added weight will help him.

Many forget that Oscar was knocked down early in a couple of his fights to get up and win by decision. The last time he was truly down and hurt was against Quartey and that was in 1999.

plus, Cotto's proven that even if he does get hurt, he has the presence of mind to keep going and not shut down.

he was somewhat hurt by N'dou, and badly by Corley and Torres. and none of them could put a cork in it fast enough to keep him from going on to win.

and i think if Cotto was gonna go on either of those occasions, he would've. Corley paused a little, but only so that Cotto wouldn't expect or see the shots coming. and since when is going to the body when your man is hurt a "bad" decision? it's exactly what you're supposed to do !!!

and Torres hit Cotto with several clean as can be shots after he had Cotto hurt, they just couldn't put him down.

I see Judah hurting Cotto maybe once or twice, then going ape-shit like he does (which in many people's minds apparently counts as "good finishing"), before Cotto ties him up and then recovers. This could happen 2-3 times and Judah will still lose the fight.

[jarhead]

the poster who wrote Judah will blow his load early and get fucked up is right on the money.

Round 1. Judah is on fire dog! He's putting his combinations together and the handspeed is just too much for Cotto. This won't last long. Cotto isn't doing shit.

Round 5. Its like night and day. Judah is definitely in retreat. Cotto has ripped him to the body the last several rounds. Judah just hasn't been the same since Cotto landed that big right in the third round.


give or take a round or two, this fight will resemble this so much y'all be callin me for my pyschic hotline number:tease:

[mikE]

Why is the media being so kind to the Judahs about Daddy sitting in for Zab for a phone interview? I don't see it as anything, but a fuck you to the media.

[jarhead]

Why is the media being so kind to the Judahs about Daddy sitting in for Zab for a phone interview? I don't see it as anything, but a fuck you to the media.

aGREED

[*Z*]

Many forget that Oscar was knocked down early in a couple of his fights to get up and win by decision. The last time he was truly down and hurt was against Quartey and that was in 1999.

Oscar was NEVER out on his feet like Cotto was though. Oscar got knocked down but got up on sturdy legs. Cotto came within and inch of being stopped by Torres and was basically out on his feet.

[Orthodox Crusader]

. give or take a round or two, this fight will resemble this so much y'all be callin me for my pyschic hotline number:tease:


How can we call you to ask for the number???:dunno: :dunno:

[Orthodox Crusader]

Oscar was NEVER out on his feet like Cotto was though. Oscar got knocked down but got up on sturdy legs. Cotto came within and inch of being stopped by Torres and was basically out on his feet.


"EL KNOCKDOWN NO FUE PRODUCTO DE UN GOLPE"

In otherwords, Torres pushed him down.

[Neil]

I think Cotto at 147 will handle Zab's punches just fine. If they fought at 140...I'd give Zab the edge.

I'm guessing Cotto's chin issues had more to do with his cutting weight and the added weight will help him.


I think that might be the case but it is hard to tell for sure. top rank has avoided matching him with anyone who can crack since the torres fight.

[Jake]

Why is the media being so kind to the Judahs about Daddy sitting in for Zab for a phone interview? I don't see it as anything, but a fuck you to the media.
I don't think very many people called in. I knew the moment the call started that it wasn't Zab. Too much bass in his voice and not once did he even come close to stuttering. I thought it was either Yoel, or another web-based boxing person imitating him.

the call only lasted about 20 minutes, and the moderator only allowed people to ask 1 question, having to get back in queue if they had follow ups. They played dumb after the fact, but methinks they knew prior to the call that Zab wasn't available and wanted to go on without rescheduling.

[Orthodox Crusader]

I don't think very many people called in. I knew the moment the call started that it wasn't Zab. Too much bass in his voice and not once did he even come close to stuttering. I thought it was either Yoel, or another web-based boxing person imitating him.

the call only lasted about 20 minutes, and the moderator only allowed people to ask 1 question, having to get back in queue if they had follow ups. They played dumb after the fact, but methinks they knew prior to the call that Zab wasn't available and wanted to go on without rescheduling.

Damn..they actually tried that?:laughing: :laughing:

[Jake]

Damn..they actually tried that?:laughing: :laughing:
they didn't try - they actually DID it! :lol:

[ILLUMINATI]

Whoops :shit: ,...Winky was the one who turned Margarito down actually while he was a free agent, then Ronald signed with Golden Boy because..I.....uh,...guess he thought negotiations would go smoothly for a Margarito fight then,..so to save face, De La Hoya cooperated to make a ridiculous offer designed to protect his pawns reputation, Arum acknowledged tactically what De La Hoya was doing, and didn't even need to give Oscar an answer, nor did Oscar follow up on that offer through the media, they both probably just smiled as he sent through the fax machine, like 'yeah, good one smart arse'. In baseball terms Illuminati, that's whatcha call a 'slider' my son..:crafty:
blah..blah...it all add up to MARGARITO refused another $1.5 Million offer from GBP for a fight against Winky Wright....:blobbox:...ANTONIO MARGARITO the most avoided fighter in boxing....has refused $3million dollars worth of fights in the last 2 years..:notallthere: Ishe, Ouma, Winky were are offered to Margarito.....at least he fought Clottey who is better than Ishe and probably a bit better than Ouma at this point in his career.

[jarhead]

I don't think very many people called in. I knew the moment the call started that it wasn't Zab. Too much bass in his voice and not once did he even come close to stuttering. I thought it was either Yoel, or another web-based boxing person imitating him.

the call only lasted about 20 minutes, and the moderator only allowed people to ask 1 question, having to get back in queue if they had follow ups. They played dumb after the fact, but methinks they knew prior to the call that Zab wasn't available and wanted to go on without rescheduling.

the no stuttering gave it away, huh:laughing:

Zab is a fucking moron, so is pops.:old:

[Orthodox Crusader]

they didn't try - they actually DID it! :lol:


When you won't even do proper press work....:nono: :nono: fuggetaboutit.....:dunno: :nono: