MARQUEZ vs. VASQUEZ III...

[REEDsART]

So What Happens N the Condom Match btwn these 2???:dunno: ...The 1st 2 Bouts were Sooooo DRASTICALLY Different that ANYTHING Could Transpire N the 3rd Bout...

Marquez was Pretty DOMINANT N the 1st Fight, Vasquez was Equally as Dominant N the RE & Appeared to B MUCH Stronger than he was from the 1st Bout...

WHO Wins the Last Bout & HOW does it Play Out???


REED:cool:

[joony]

i'm going w/ vasquez via stoppage. i could be wrong, but i think the first two fights might have taken rafael's legs out.

[ArturoGatti]

vASQUEZ BY ud.

[Double L]

So What Happens N the Condom Match btwn these 2???:dunno: ...The 1st 2 Bouts were Sooooo DRASTICALLY Different that ANYTHING Could Transpire N the 3rd Bout...

Marquez was Pretty DOMINANT N the 1st Fight, Vasquez was Equally as Dominant N the RE & Appeared to B MUCH Stronger than he was from the 1st Bout...

WHO Wins the Last Bout & HOW does it Play Out???


REED:cool:

i wouldn't say Marquez was dominant in the first fight. he landed some really good shots, and had Vazquez timed pretty well in spots, but he was absorbing his share of punishment too.

and if you compare Vazquez's victory to Marquez's, Vazquez's was 5 times more convincing. seems like you have to favor Vazquez to win the third one, barring some major adjustment on the part of Marquez.

what i find interesting is that i can't quite put my finger on what Vazquez did differently in the second fight to have had so much more success. i seem to recall his getting closer to Marquez in the second fight, smothering Marquez's punches somewhat, but it was definitely subtle.

i also think he threw the left uppercut less, mixing in the regular hook more than he did in the first, and i think this took away a lot of the countering opportunities that Marquez had had in their first fight. but again, it was subtle.

it's hard to believe that Vazquez turned it around as much as he did, without making any glaring adjustments.

did anyone notice any fundamental or major adjustments on the part of Vazquez? that could explain the great success he had in the second fight, compared to the first?

[Arben]

Vazquez by KO in 8. I think Marquez is done.

I can't seem to find me a link to view their second fight. Can anyone help?

[joony]

Vazquez by KO in 8. I think Marquez is done.

I can't seem to find me a link to view their second fight. Can anyone help?

take the train from Costco to find the time machine.

[Haymaker]

The battle of the 'roided midgets

I think Vazquez wins via Winstrol, HGH and Stanozol :blobbox:

[Barristan]

I think Berstain and Marquez come with a revamped gameplan and win by UD...I have no doubt that Marquez is the better boxer. He needs to obviously establish distance with the jab and really place his shots without staying inside too long. I beleive if he boxes and ties Vasquez up inside he can win. Marquez really needs to keep his right hand up this time also and stay off the ropes. Rafael Marquez UD.

[Explosivo]

I think Berstain and Marquez come with a revamped gameplan and win by UD...I have no doubt that Marquez is the better boxer. He needs to obviously establish distance with the jab and really place his shots without staying inside too long. I beleive if he boxes and ties Vasquez up inside he can win. Marquez really needs to keep his right hand up this time also and stay off the ropes. Rafael Marquez UD.

I too think that it is obvious that at their respective bests....Rafael wins this fight.

I think he was overconfident the last time, and Vazquez felt he had something to prove.

This time, I predict that the better fighter wins. And that imo is Rafael Marquez.

[valdosta]

The better fighter will win and that is Israel Vasquez.

[Andrew]

vASQUEZ BY ud.

Noway this goes the distance. Give me Vazquez TKO6

[valdosta]

Noway this goes the distance. Give me Vazquez TKO6

I agree there is no way this will go 12. people are acting like Marquez is some kind of great pure boxer. While he doe have great offensive boxing skills he is way to easy to hit. When Israel is agressive Rafael has no choice but to fight. Israel isn't just some dumb plodder who has no skill. He works his way in well.

[whiskey]

You have to favor Vazquez, but i think if Raf can avoid a fire fight he can win. He stays in the pocket too long.

If Marquez fires his shots and makes some movement to avoid the return fire i think he can win it.

[Barristan]

I agree there is no way this will go 12. people are acting like Marquez is some kind of great pure boxer. While he doe have great offensive boxing skills he is way to easy to hit. When Israel is agressive Rafael has no choice but to fight. Israel isn't just some dumb plodder who has no skill. He works his way in well.
Good points, although Marquez definitely didn't use his jab enough the last fight. He needs to not let Vasquez force the fight like he did so well last time. I think he can calm the pace down by using his superior outside game then pick his shots like Jony Gonzalez was early in their fight.

[Outlander]

I think Marquez would actually be served by trying to hurt Vasquez as much as possible as early as possible. In a war of attrition, Marquez simply comes up short against Vasquez. Marquez is just a bit smaller naturally I think and has more of a boxer's frame. As the fight wears on, barring a cuts stoppage, Marquez will slowly get worn down and will lose over time.

However, I think when the 2 are fresh, Marquez is a bit faster, hits harder in a one-punch sense, and has the ability to move enough to muster some defense.

If Marquez does not put the hurt on Vasquez in the first 3 rounds of the fight, I think his odds of coming out with a W go way, way down. You have to assume the fight will end by stoppage one way or another before round 8, so then fight like that. Fight like you are going to be in a 6 or 7 round war and put it all out there right away. Do not wait and then realize in round 4 your jaw hurts, you have double vision and you're dizzy, by then it's too late.

Marquez KO 5 Vasquez.

[LATIN KING]

The better fighter will win and that is Israel Vasquez.better fighter?:lol:

they each managed to stop the other once that's why this is a rubber match. Stop acting like VAzquez is superior.

I think it's a toss up fight and even if the winner is declared the winner of the trilogy they are still pretty evenly matched.

[valdosta]

better fighter?:lol:

they each managed to stop the other once that's why this is a rubber match. Stop acting like VAzquez is superior.

I think it's a toss up fight and even if the winner is declared the winner of the trilogy they are still pretty evenly matched.

Why laugh? yes Vasquez is the better fighter. Marquez a bit more skilled but Vasquez being the better fighter makes up for it. After he beats Marquez in this fight it will be proven for good.

[LATIN KING]

Why laugh? yes Vasquez is the better fighter. Marquez a bit more skilled but Vasquez being the better fighter makes up for it. After he beats Marquez in this fight it will be proven for good.they are 1-1 both stopping each other. The results are what count right?

until the third fight happens you can't say one is above the other. you act like VAzquez is 2-0 so far :dunno:

[valdosta]

they are 1-1 both stopping each other. The results are what count right?

until the third fight happens you can't say one is above the other. you act like VAzquez is 2-0 so far :dunno:

Do you know how to read? I said Vasquez is a better fighter, Marquez is a little more skilled. I can pretty much say whatever I want to. I think Vasquez wins the 3rd fight because he is the better fighter, not more skilled. Marquez is going to get knocked the fuck out.

[LATIN KING]

Do you know how to read? I said Vasquez is a better fighter, Marquez is a little more skilled. I can pretty much say whatever I want to. I think Vasquez wins the 3rd fight because he is the better fighter, not more skilled. Marquez is going to get knocked the fuck out.so all of a sudden skills matter in your arguments?:laughing:

your still so full of shit. I remember your arguments were always about "fuck the talent" it's all bout meaningfull wins.

These guys are 1-1 so who cares who is supposed to be the better fighter? :dunno:

Point is that it hasn't determined who won each fight. Like I said they are pretty even on power and skill.

regardless of how you wanna spin it you act like Vazquez is superior without proving it. It's fucking stupid.

I guess the Marquez names still stings you. :lol:

[mexican wedding shirt]

I agree Vazquez is the better fighter. He's a lethal puncher and has a classic crouch Mexican style. Marquez' slight advantage in skill and jab is not enough to make him a better overall fighter.

I foolishly picked Marquez in the rematch, mainly because of the way Israel bowed out of the first fight.

Now it's clear he really did have a problem with his nose, and it wasn't just a quitjob.

[ElTerriblee]

I agree Vazquez is the better fighter. He's a lethal puncher and has a classic crouch Mexican style. Marquez' slight advantage in skill and jab is not enough to make him a better overall fighter.

I foolishly picked Marquez in the rematch, mainly because of the way Israel bowed out of the first fight.

Now it's clear he really did have a problem with his nose, and it wasn't just a quitjob.

Ah please. Vasquez was bledding out of every hole in the rematch, and Rafa even added a few extra holes from whom Vasquez could bleed. I´m sure if LOK got into his trunks he´d have drawn blood as well. Vasquez was on the brink of getting stopped on cuts, if it goes two more rounds.

The rubbermatch comes down to Rafa´s attitude. If he goes toe to toe with the naturally bigger and more compact fighter again, he´ll likely lose, although you can never completely count out his power. If he is smart, he´ll bust Vasquez up and force a cut stoppage. I hope Nacho keeps his machismo in check.

I won´t complain anyway since I like both guys and I hope they make a good amount of money.

[ArturoGatti]

Ah please. Vasquez was bledding out of every hole in the rematch, and Rafa even added a few extra holes from whom Vasquez could bleed. I´m sure if LOK got into his trunks he´d have drawn blood as well. Vasquez was on the brink of getting stopped on cuts, if it goes two more rounds.

The rubbermatch comes down to Rafa´s attitude. If he goes toe to toe with the naturally bigger and more compact fighter again, he´ll likely lose, although you can never completely count out his power. If he is smart, he´ll bust Vasquez up and force a cut stoppage. I hope Nacho keeps his machismo in check.

I won´t complain anyway since I like both guys and I hope they make a good amount of money.:bears:

[Double L]

Vazquez's win in second fight > Marquez's win in first fight

In the first fight, people forget, Vazquez knocked Marquez down and hurt him badly. And people were surprised when Vazquez quit. Why were they surprised? They were surprised because the fight was being fought on fairly even terms, and it was hardly the case that Vazquez was out of the fight, or looked like a beaten man.

The myth that seems to be out there is that Marquez won the first fight in dominant fashion, whereas Vazquez won the second. Not true. Not in the least. People need to stop imagining and oversimplifying shit.

[joony]

Vazquez's win in second fight > Marquez's win in first fight

In the first fight, people forget, Vazquez knocked Marquez down and hurt him badly. And people were surprised when Vazquez quit. Why were they surprised? They were surprised because the fight was being fought on fairly even terms, and it was hardly the case that Vazquez was out of the fight, or looked like a beaten man.

The myth that seems to be out there is that Marquez won the first fight in dominant fashion, whereas Vazquez won the second. Not true. Not in the least. People need to stop imagining and oversimplifying shit.

marquez fucked the guy's nose up and made it so that the dude could not breathe therefore was unable to continue. that sounds pretty damn decisive if you ask me.

[Double L]

marquez fucked the guy's nose up and made it so that the dude could not breathe therefore was unable to continue. that sounds pretty damn decisive if you ask me.

oh please. it was a freak thing.

[ElTerriblee]

oh please. it was a freak thing.

Yes. Indeed. Rafael Marquez is not known for busting people up. When he was done with Mabuza the South African looked like he had Ebola for christ´s sake. Just look at the Vasquez´ face after the rematch. :doh:

[Double L]

Yes. Indeed. Rafael Marquez is not known for busting people up. When he was done with Mabuza the South African looked like he had Ebola for christ´s sake. Just look at the Vasquez´ face after the rematch. :doh:

i'm not saying Marquez didn't win the fight. or that he didn't deserve credit for the win. i'm simply arguing that Vazquez's win was much more impressive than Marquez's. do you dispute that?

[REEDsART]

Vazquez's win in second fight > Marquez's win in first fight

In the first fight, people forget, Vazquez knocked Marquez down and hurt him badly. And people were surprised when Vazquez quit. Why were they surprised? They were surprised because the fight was being fought on fairly even terms, and it was hardly the case that Vazquez was out of the fight, or looked like a beaten man.

The myth that seems to be out there is that Marquez won the first fight in dominant fashion, whereas Vazquez won the second. Not true. Not in the least. People need to stop imagining and oversimplifying shit.Vasquez was COMPETITVE N the 1st Fight, but @ NO Point did REED Get the Feeling he was Gonna BEAT Marquez...

BOTH Bouts were 1-Sided "Action" Fights N REED's Opinion, w/the RE Being even MORE 1-Sided...


REED:cool:

[Double L]

Vasquez was COMPETITVE N the 1st Fight, but @ NO Point did REED Get the Feeling he was Gonna BEAT Marquez...

BOTH Bouts were 1-Sided "Action" Fights N REED's Opinion, w/the RE Being even MORE 1-Sided...


REED:cool:

you didn't get the "Feeling" Vazquez might win when he layed Marquez out with a left hook? :laughing:

[REEDsART]

you didn't get the "Feeling" Vazquez might win when he layed Marquez out with a left hook? :laughing:"Layed Out"???:dunno:


If REED Isn't Mistaken, Vasquez Dropped Marquez on the Seat of his Trunks, Right???...

It WASN'T Exactly some DEVASTATING Knockdown that had Marquez Flat on his Back, on the Brink of Being STOPPED...

But THANKS for EXAGGERATING...

REED:cool:

[Double L]

"Layed Out"???:dunno:


If REED Isn't Mistaken, Vasquez Dropped Marquez on the Seat of his Trunks, Right???...

It WASN'T Exactly some DEVASTATING Knockdown that had Marquez Flat on his Back, on the Brink of Being STOPPED...

But THANKS for EXAGGERATING...

REED:cool:

ok. so your confidence in Raffy wasn't shaken one bit when he was put on his azz by a perfect combination to the chin? :dunno:

[REEDsART]

ok. so your confidence in Raffy wasn't shaken one bit when he was put on his azz by a perfect combination to the chin? :dunno:Not Really...

Marquez HURT Vasquez N EVERY Round, PRIOR to the Knockdown & AFTER...KNOWING Marquez has a SUSPECT Chin, it Didn't Surprise REED @ All that he Got DROPPED...

So Getting DROPPED by Vasquez DIDN'T Really Bring Any Doubt N 2 REED's Head, N Terms of the Outcome...

By the Same Token, REED had that Feeling N the RE, N Vasquez's Favor...@ NO Point did it Look like Marquez was a THREAT To WIN...



REED:cool:

[joony]

oh please. it was a freak thing.

this would be an appropriate time for karl to come in here and say 'how would you know if you've never been in the ring?'

although a bit ironic considering karl called vasquez a quitter. :lol:

regardless, no such thing as a freak accident when you get your nose smashed in by one of the best punchers in the game

[whiskey]

regardless, no such thing as a freak accident when you get your nose smashed in by one of the best punchers in the game

Agreed. Vitali's cut against Lewis could moreso be called a "freak accident" as he was lacerated by the tape on the glove, and not buy a direct blow.

That's still part of the game though. Marquez smashing your nose in is no accident. He's quite deliberate in trying to do that to opponents. :lol:

[ArturoGatti]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJ5i4_l1vDg

that fight rocks! :bears:

[Neil]

i'm simply arguing that Vazquez's win was much more impressive than Marquez's. do you dispute that?

I do

[valdosta]

so all of a sudden skills matter in your arguments?:laughing:

your still so full of shit. I remember your arguments were always about "fuck the talent" it's all bout meaningfull wins.

These guys are 1-1 so who cares who is supposed to be the better fighter? :dunno:

Point is that it hasn't determined who won each fight. Like I said they are pretty even on power and skill.

regardless of how you wanna spin it you act like Vazquez is superior without proving it. It's fucking stupid.

I guess the Marquez names still stings you. :lol:

Wow, I can't believe how unbelievably hard headed you are. For 1 I actually like Rafael. My argument isn't all that complicated. Vasquez is the better fighter. While Marquez is a little more skilled it's irrelevant because Vasquez can walk him down and make him fight. Both guys won 1 fight, great. I pick Vasquez to win the 3rd fight because he is the better fighter. That was my point from the beginning. I am sorry if you are to slow to understand that. YOU ACT LIKE I AM NOT ALLOWED TO MAKE A PREDICTION ON THE 3RD FIGHT!!:flip: :flip:

[Double L]

I do

having provided no basis for doing so. typical.

[Neil]

having provided no basis for doing so. typical.

neither guy was knocked unconscious or counted out in either fight. at the point when each bout concluded, one guy wanted to continue fighting and the other didn't.

[mexican wedding shirt]

Ah please. Vasquez was bledding out of every hole in the rematch, and Rafa even added a few extra holes from whom Vasquez could bleed. I´m sure if LOK got into his trunks he´d have drawn blood as well. Vasquez was on the brink of getting stopped on cuts, if it goes two more rounds.

The rubbermatch comes down to Rafa´s attitude. If he goes toe to toe with the naturally bigger and more compact fighter again, he´ll likely lose, although you can never completely count out his power. If he is smart, he´ll bust Vasquez up and force a cut stoppage. I hope Nacho keeps his machismo in check.

I won´t complain anyway since I like both guys and I hope they make a good amount of money.

Um, who gives a shit how cut up Vazquez was, that was a fairly 1 sided fight in favour of Vazquez. Good scrap, good action fight, but Vazquez won most of the rounds and always looked the more dangerous fighter.

[LATIN KING]

Wow, I can't believe how unbelievably hard headed you are. For 1 I actually like Rafael. My argument isn't all that complicated. Vasquez is the better fighter. While Marquez is a little more skilled it's irrelevant because Vasquez can walk him down and make him fight. Both guys won 1 fight, great. I pick Vasquez to win the 3rd fight because he is the better fighter. That was my point from the beginning. I am sorry if you are to slow to understand that. YOU ACT LIKE I AM NOT ALLOWED TO MAKE A PREDICTION ON THE 3RD FIGHT!!:flip: :flip:stop crying dude i'm just fucking with you :lol:

I told you twice that I get your point.

My question is why do you consider VAzquez the better fighter? I'm not saying Vazquez cannot be considered better. I'm just wondering why you so confident consider him the better fighter. When he hasn't proven he is head to head:dunno:

[valdosta]

Your question shows that you don't get my point.

[Explosivo]

IMO, Raffy has some of the sickest one shot power, P4P, in boxing.

Vazquez has looked better overall in their past two fights.


Vazquez is more physical, Raffy more skilled and more powerful.


Anyone's guess.


I'm picking Marquez.

[Andrew]

they are 1-1 both stopping each other. The results are what count right?

until the third fight happens you can't say one is above the other. you act like VAzquez is 2-0 so far :dunno:

Of course you can, are you retarded? So every two fighters that have fought twice and won one each are even fighters? Please.

[Tam Tam]

Tough, tough fight to peg. Both guys can end the other's night (as has happened already) and that makes it incredibly tough to feel confident either way.

I do think Marquez assert's his jab early on this time out though and that might be the difference.

[LATIN KING]

Of course you can, are you retarded? So every two fighters that have fought twice and won one each are even fighters? Please.they are even right now you fucking idiot.

sure you can like one better than the other but the reason its' rubber match is because they have stoped each other. They are both almost equally poweful. They are both skilled fighter. really they are evenly matched.

Stop acting like one is superior.

[Tam Tam]

they are even right now you fucking idiot.

sure you can like one better than the other but the reason its' rubber match is because they have stoped each other. They are both almost equally poweful. They are both skilled fighter. really they are evenly matched.

Stop acting like one is superior.
Nothing is ever equal.

Barring a draw in this fight, one of them is going to prove their superiority in taking the fight.

I think Vasquez is the superior fighter at this point in time. Afterall, he was the one who took the last fight.

[LATIN KING]

Your question shows that you don't get my point.you said the better fighter who is vazquez will win the fight.

that is hardly explaining it. :dunno:

It's cool if you don't wanna elaborate, just stop acting like you did and avoiding a simple question with silly comments.

[LATIN KING]

Nothing is ever equal.

Barring a draw in this fight, one of them is going to prove their superiority in taking the fight.

I think Vasquez is the superior fighter at this point in time. Afterall, he was the one who took the last fight.They are 1-1 right now so all Vazquez did with the last fight is even up the score.

I just don't overreact with who won last.

when Marquez won the first fight some called VAzquez a quitter and though Marquez would stop him again with ease.

now it's the other way around. Because Vazquez stoped him all of a sudden he is better than him?:dunno:

to me the thirs fight is a toss up because both have proven they can stop the other showing skill and power.

I just don't see one being superior to the other. as of right now they are 1-1

when the third fight is over than one can brag about winning the trilogy.

[osfan]

they are even right now you fucking idiot.

sure you can like one better than the other but the reason its' rubber match is because they have stoped each other. They are both almost equally poweful. They are both skilled fighter. really they are evenly matched.

Stop acting like one is superior.


:nono: That's no way to address your fellow poster, apologize or else !

[ArturoGatti]

:nono: That's no way to address your fellow poster, apologize or else !:bears:

It makes me feel good knowing that you dislike the latin john goodman more than you dislik eme.

[valdosta]

They are 1-1 right now so all Vazquez did with the last fight is even up the score.

I just don't overreact with who won last.

when Marquez won the first fight some called VAzquez a quitter and though Marquez would stop him again with ease.

now it's the other way around. Because Vazquez stoped him all of a sudden he is better than him?:dunno:

to me the thirs fight is a toss up because both have proven they can stop the other showing skill and power.

I just don't see one being superior to the other. as of right now they are 1-1

when the third fight is over than one can brag about winning the trilogy.

So what exactly is your purpose in this thread? Apparently you aren't confident enough to make a pick on who wins the fight. I think Vasquez is the better fighter so he wins while apparently you don't think at all.

[LATIN KING]

So what exactly is your purpose in this thread? Apparently you aren't confident enough to make a pick on who wins the fight. I think Vasquez is the better fighter so he wins while apparently you don't think at all.I'ts not about confidence. I don't claim to be more of a fan of either guy. I'm a fan of both actually. Have been for years.

The reality is that both are pretty much the same level. Not just because each won a fight. But they are pretty evenly matched. That's a good thing because it makes for an awesome fight and it's the reason they are going for the 3rd straight.

my point was that I don't see where either guy has proven to be better than the other.

I know you usually put money on fights. Maybe that's why you see this fight different. Maybe your hoping Vazquez wins :dunno:

even if I pick one guy over the other I know both have a big chance of stopping the other. It's that simple. :popcorn:

[LATIN KING]

:bears:

It makes me feel good knowing that you dislike the latin john goodman more than you dislik eme.latin John goodman? the fuck? :laughing:

are you the serbian Roseanne? :dunno:

[osfan]

latin John goodman? the fuck? :laughing:

are you the serbian Roseanne? :dunno:

:lol: :lol:

[ArturoGatti]

latin John goodman? the fuck? :laughing:

are you the serbian Roseanne? :dunno:that's how o's fan described you. :dunno:

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

oh please. it was a freak thing.Vasquez is one of the toughest fighters out there. Making him quit is damn impressive. Marquez was in control of the first fight when Israel gave up/ couldn't continue.

[valdosta]

Marquez was ahead but I am not sure how in control he was. I thought Vasquez won the round then quit.

[LATIN KING]

Marquez was ahead but I am not sure how in control he was. I thought Vasquez won the round then quit.change that sig already man! :nono:

[ArturoGatti]

change that sig already man! :nono:I agree, JMM is the better fighter, even though they are 0-0-1. I don't think you'll argue about that. :lol:

[LATIN KING]

I agree, JMM is the better fighter, even though they are 0-0-1. I don't think you'll argue about that. :lol: Yes I do, however it should be 1-0 JMM

Think Manny will be wearing the proper socks this time? :lol:

[Tam Tam]

Can't wait to hear all the "Marquez is shot!!" excuses after Pacquiao plants him early, again....only this time finishes the job.

[ArturoGatti]

Yes I do, however it should be 1-0 JMM

Think Manny will be wearing the proper socks this time? :lol::laughing:

and some people actually acted as if that was a legit excuse.

[LATIN KING]

Can't wait to hear all the "Marquez is shot!!" excuses after Pacquiao plants him early, again....only this time finishes the job.really how?

my bad, I forgot he can box like Ali now. :lol:

He also got a right hand and JMM is used to fighting one handed fighters. :doh:

[LATIN KING]

:laughing:

and some people actually acted as if that was a legit excuse.the guy had silly excuses and somehow they were legit just because :laughing:

[valdosta]

Better fighter based on what exactly? He's not the better fighter based off results. He's not better off of head to head, he's not rated higher PFP, so how exactly is JMM "better"? If he wins the rematch you have a case, otherwise there isn't 1. Oh and quit the crying about the first decision if anything JMM should be 0-1.

[REEDsART]

Yes I do, however it should be 1-0 JMM

Think Manny will be wearing the proper socks this time? :lol::lol:

[Beyond the Grave]

I get the feeling if JMM loses next month Latin King will hang himself...............seriously:eeeek:

[az cat]

I agree with Double L that Vasquez has looked to be the better fighter of the two over the first two fights. I think we can fairly easily say that Vasquez's win was far more impressive.

Although I am a fan of Raffy and will be pulling for him, I can't possibly give him the edge here. I think Vasquez will have a HUGE confidence advantage heading into the fight. And that might play in to the outcome because this one will likely be fought at a very heated pace.

Vasquez has put Marquez on the floor in each fight, and there is NO reason to think Marquez can make many adjustments to stop it from happening again. Raffy's best chance is to fight fire with fire and try to hurt Vasquez before he gets clipped himself.

It makes for a perfect matchup, which is why these fights will always be gerat. But Marquez can only win by bombing Vasquez out. Vasquez has more options, and has had the better of the action over the first two fight... which is why he'll win again. I like him by stoppage right about the 8th round.

[LATIN KING]

Better fighter based on what exactly? He's not the better fighter based off results. He's not better off of head to head, he's not rated higher PFP, so how exactly is JMM "better"? If he wins the rematch you have a case, otherwise there isn't 1. Oh and quit the crying about the first decision if anything JMM should be 0-1.JMM is just the better fighter you can tell if your not blind.

hell not to long ago Freddy Roach was celebrating the fact that Manny can throw a right hand. :lol:

I just hope there is no excuses this time from your boy. :doh:

[LATIN KING]

I get the feeling if JMM loses next month Latin King will hang himself...............seriously:eeeek:well he won't lose for one.

somehow I get the feeling that there will be plenty of excuses from Manny and his fans regardless of his performance.

The moment that fucker leaves to Manila in the middle of training camp all hell breaks loose and there you go. :doh:

[mexican wedding shirt]

I have always liked both these guys, and Rafael is infinitely more likeable than Juan Manual.

But his power is overrated. Even in the first fight, Vazquez' left hook seemed harder than anything Marquez through, primarily his right hand.

Vazquez has the heavier hands, as well as an edge in chin.

[valdosta]

JMM is just the better fighter you can tell if your not blind.

hell not to long ago Freddy Roach was celebrating the fact that Manny can throw a right hand. :lol:

I just hope there is no excuses this time from your boy. :doh:

Talent is part of being a fighter. Pacquiao is more established,more talented and better than JMM. He's better than Pacquiao based off you biasedness? Oh yeah I get it now.:laughing:

[Beyond the Grave]

well he won't lose for one.

somehow I get the feeling that there will be plenty of excuses from Manny and his fans regardless of his performance.

The moment that fucker leaves to Manila in the middle of training camp all hell breaks loose and there you go. :doh:

He hasn't been in Manila in awhile ,he's had a great camp so far.I don't expect any excuses if he loses both fighters will be at there best

[LATIN KING]

Talent is part of being a fighter. Pacquiao is more established,more talented and better than JMM. He's better than Pacquiao based off you biasedness? Oh yeah I get it now.:laughing:pacquiao hasn't fought a real champion in his division since the last time he fought JMM, enough said. :dunno:

[LATIN KING]

He hasn't been in Manila in awhile ,he's had a great camp so far.I don't expect any excuses if he loses both fighters will be at there bestthat's good! I guess Roach finally locked his ass down.

However before their first fight there were no distractions and he still had a shitload of excuses. :popcorn:

[valdosta]

What is Marquez's best win again? Oh yeah MAB who Pacquiao beat worse. Pacquiao's resume is better than JMM's so why bother going that route? :laughing:

[LATIN KING]

What is Marquez's best win again? Oh yeah MAB who Pacquiao beat worse. Pacquiao's resume is better than JMM's so why bother going that route? :laughing:well he should have gotten a decision over pacquiao. head to head he made him look like an amateur.

hard for you to grasp since your biased as hell. Since then Pacquiao's best wins were guys coming of losses. Again, pacquiao hasn't fought a champion since he fought JMM.

to me that's what counts the most. Pacquiao can fight MOrales again this year and it will mean as much as the last time. :dunno:

pacquiao is severely overrated because of how exciting he fights. Not to long ago there was an argument of who was pfp better him or Floyd. Seriously if that's not overrated I don't know what is. :eeeek: :laughing:

[Double L]

pacquiao would beat john's azz.

[valdosta]

well he should have gotten a decision over pacquiao. head to head he made him look like an amateur.

hard for you to grasp since your biased as hell. Since then Pacquiao's best wins were guys coming of losses. Again, pacquiao hasn't fought a champion since he fought JMM.

to me that's what counts the most. Pacquiao can fight MOrales again this year and it will mean as much as the last time. :dunno:

pacquiao is severely overrated because of how exciting he fights. Not to long ago there was an argument of who was pfp better him or Floyd. Seriously if that's not overrated I don't know what is. :eeeek: :laughing:

Titles mean jack shit. The fact is in pacquiao's career he has beaten a higher level of competition than JMM has. Oh and no, if round 1 is scored correctly JMM walks away with a loss. he schooled pacquiao blah,blah,blah whatever. In the end Pac got screwed by a judge. You can continue on here but it just shows how biased you are. Pacquiao has beaten better fighters than JMM. 1 biased as hell opinion don't change that.

[LATIN KING]

Titles mean jack shit. The fact is in pacquiao's career he has beaten a higher level of competition than JMM has. Oh and no, if round 1 is scored correctly JMM walks away with a loss. he schooled pacquiao blah,blah,blah whatever. In the end Pac got screwed by a judge. You can continue on here but it just shows how biased you are. Pacquiao has beaten better fighters than JMM. 1 biased as hell opinion don't change that.your sig shows how much in denial you are :lol:

sure Pacquiao has a better carreer. doesn't change how overrated he is. Not to mention how one dimensional JMM made him look. He is fighting JMM so that's why I bring that up.

Tittles don't mean shit? yet Manny spent the last few years paying sanctioning fees for some toy belt from the wbc? :laughing:

fact is he tried pulling that shit to not fight JMM because of the belt. But he has to if he wants to be the best at 130 just like the first time he wanted to be the best at 126.

fighting JMM is not for some vacant belt is because both are considered 1 and 2 at 130, if you can't see that shit than you are just ridiculous.

[valdosta]

Pacquiao was already regarded as #1 at 126 when he beat JMM the first time they met (oops I mean draw). The truth is if he didn't want to fight JMM, he don't have to. Unlike JMM, Pacquiao is an attraction and has plenty of options. Oh I forgot JMM has options to. Maybe he can head back over to Indonesia for 30k again. :laughing: Don't try to pretend like Pacquiao was EVER ducking Marquez because it was JMM who overvalued himself in the first place. he finally got around to be realistic and now the fight is made.

Good to see you realize who has had the better career though. At least you can get that much right. :bears:

[LATIN KING]

Pacquiao was already regarded as #1 at 126 when he beat JMM the first time they met (oops I mean draw). The truth is if he didn't want to fight JMM, he don't have to. Unlike JMM, Pacquiao is an attraction and has plenty of options. Oh I forgot JMM has options to. Maybe he can head back over to Indonesia for 30k again. :laughing: Don't try to pretend like Pacquiao was EVER ducking Marquez because it was JMM who overvalued himself in the first place. he finally got around to be realistic and now the fight is made.

Good to see you realize who has had the better career though. At least you can get that much right. :bears:get the fuck out of here with that! everyone knows arum and pacquiao wanted no part of JMM this time around. I won't call manny a coward because that would be silly.

but damn near every boxing fan, and boxing writer called for this rematch and Arum had to make it.

who cares about being an attraction? as a fan I wanna see the best fight that can be made. Unless you get a cut from Manny's purse it's stupid to brag on his behalf regarding his draw.

ARum tried not to make a fight with JMM that is no secret. Everyone ripped pacquiao and Arum for even considering David Diaz rather than JMM.

Hell, this fight should have happened when JMM beat MAB, again Pacquiao fighting another guy coming of a loss.

you seem to think fighting a respected champion and a guy coming of a loss is the same thing. there is a big difference dude :dunno:

[Double L]

JMM has always been an avoided fighter. it's a miracle MAB finally faced him - we have GBP to thank for that. hamed shamelessly ducked him. it's a testament to pacquiao's confidence that he faced him.

JMM has made a conscious effort to be more exciting (and has taken more punishment as a result). he deserves credit for that.

[LATIN KING]

JMM has always been an avoided fighter. it's a miracle MAB finally faced him - we have GBP to thank for that. hamed shamelessly ducked him. it's a testament to pacquiao's confidence that he faced him.

JMM has made a conscious effort to be more exciting (and has taken more punishment as a result). he deserves credit for that.agreed!:bears:

especially about him fighting more agressive lately. People say he has slipped but I think he just opens up more. He still has the skills to counterpunch anybody but he engages more now.

[valdosta]

get the fuck out of here with that! everyone knows arum and pacquiao wanted no part of JMM this time around. I won't call manny a coward because that would be silly.

but damn near every boxing fan, and boxing writer called for this rematch and Arum had to make it.

who cares about being an attraction? as a fan I wanna see the best fight that can be made. Unless you get a cut from Manny's purse it's stupid to brag on his behalf regarding his draw.

ARum tried not to make a fight with JMM that is no secret. Everyone ripped pacquiao and Arum for even considering David Diaz rather than JMM.

Hell, this fight should have happened when JMM beat MAB, again Pacquiao fighting another guy coming of a loss.

you seem to think fighting a respected champion and a guy coming of a loss is the same thing. there is a big difference dude :dunno:

It's part of boxing bussiness. Who the hell would have complained if Pacquiao moved up to 135 and then fought David Diaz followed by Juan Diaz? Nobody. Manny has options and didn't have to do shit. Oh and this fight should have happened after Manny beat JMM the first time (oops I mean draw). Instead someone tried to get greedy and instead ended up getting raped for 30k in indonesia. :laughing:

BTW-Pacquiao never had any issues fighting JMM. He had already fought him once and the offer was there for it to happen again, wasn't his fault JMM priced himself out. Then JMM goes over to Indonesia and losses:cheer:

[Double L]

jmm's mistake was listening to berinstein.

[valdosta]

jmm's mistake was listening to berinstein.

No doubt, that shit was bone headed. indonesia is 1 of the last places I am taking my fighter to fight.

[LATIN KING]

It's part of boxing bussiness. Who the hell would have complained if Pacquiao moved up to 135 and then fought David Diaz followed by Juan Diaz? Nobody. Manny has options and didn't have to do shit. Oh and this fight should have happened after Manny beat JMM the first time (oops I mean draw). Instead someone tried to get greedy and instead ended up getting raped for 30k in indonesia. :laughing:

BTW-Pacquiao never had any issues fighting JMM. He had already fought him once and the offer was there for it to happen again, wasn't his fault JMM priced himself out. Then JMM goes over to Indonesia and losses:cheer:alot of people had and have issues with Manny moving up to 135 for two reasons.

One - he hasn't fought the best at 130 which are JMM and Guzman. O yah I forgot they are not exciting and can't draw so they dont' get to fight him -ARum

Two - moving up to 135 would be for DAvid Diaz and that's it. Arum won't put him in there with Juan Diaz and has given plenty of excuses from schedules, to contracts and dealing with KIng, to waiting for Juan to become a bigger star :laughing:

All this after Juan called him out after a fight on HBO. I don't knock Manny for not figting him cause it's not his division. But let's not pretend it was gonna happen.

Somehow ARum thinks David Diaz is the man at 135 just like his other boy Margarito is the man at 147 :lol:

Manny beat Morales and BArrera at 130 but neither were the best at 130 at the time. It's tha simple. JMM and Guzman are. I"m glad the JMM is made. But Arum already told Guzman he won't land the Pacquiao fight.

[valdosta]

Actually Juan Diaz has had issues with his people that is a fact. :dunno: In the end Manny is fighting the best as he typically does. period. he is taking pity upon JMM and giving him a big fight. No need for him to become a complete charity case and giving boring ass Guzman a shot to. When Manny beat MAB and Morales they were still top guys in that division. Maybe not the best but in the top few.

[LATIN KING]

Actually Juan Diaz has had issues with his people that is a fact. :dunno: In the end Manny is fighting the best as he typically does. period. he is taking pity upon JMM and giving him a big fight. No need for him to become a complete charity case and giving boring ass Guzman a shot to. When Manny beat MAB and Morales they were still top guys in that division. Maybe not the best but in the top few.pity?

JMM and Manny are 1 and 2 at 130 and most have JMM in the top pfp list along with Manny.


stop acting like Manny is fighting 3k battery or velasquez or one of them bums he was fighting a while back. :lol:

[valdosta]

I would pick Velasquez over a Terdsak while we are on the topic of bums. Yes pity, if Pac don't fight JMM what is he going to do? A Terdsak rematch?

[LATIN KING]

I would pick Velasquez over a Terdsak while we are on the topic of bums. Yes pity, if Pac don't fight JMM what is he going to do? A Terdsak rematch?your missing the point. your using pacquiao's options as an excuse not to fight the best.

He is fighting JMM because he is the best at 130 and of the best boxers period.


and no Velasquez wouldn't beat Terdsak. Velasquez is a fucking stiff. :lol:

[valdosta]

Velasquez has a pretty good win recently over Santiago. A much bigger win than anything Terdsak has done. My point is if you think Manny is fighting bums, JMM has fought plenty as well. My other point of course was he can fight the best without bothering with JMM. Why? Because he has those options. Not that it matters he's fighting JMM anyways. Not sure why because personally the way JMM ran his mouth I wouldn't have given him the payday. You came into this thread saying JMM is better than Pacquiao with nothing to back it up. That is where this whole debate came from in the first place.

[LATIN KING]

Velasquez has a pretty good win recently over Santiago. A much bigger win than anything Terdsak has done. My point is if you think Manny is fighting bums, JMM has fought plenty as well. My other point of course was he can fight the best without bothering with JMM. Why? Because he has those options. Not that it matters he's fighting JMM anyways. Not sure why because personally the way JMM ran his mouth I wouldn't have given him the payday. You came into this thread saying JMM is better than Pacquiao with nothing to back it up. That is where this whole debate came from in the first place.I do think he is better. You asked me based on what? competition or head to head? I told you already told you how I saw their first fight go and comparing the skill wise.

You made it a point to compare carreers. I have never said JMM's carrer is better than Mannys. :dunno:

but he has gotten overrated the last two years and there is a big difference in fighting the best in your division to Prove your the best then to beat older guys who used to be the best.

Now you go to the extreme acting like this JMM rematch is some other shitty tune up for Manny when you know how most people see this long awaited rematch.

you disklike JMM so much that you think he still hasn't accomplished shit. If that was the case people wouldn't be screaming for this rematch all of these years.

[valdosta]

Screaming for this rematch? I don't think I would go that far. I don't make JMM out to be a bum. He's a good fighter but the truth is for him to get paid well he needs to fight other big names. That is why he wanted to fight Pacquiao afterall. You point out skills, I point out talent. manny has more talent and a better career I am not sure how that makes JMM "better". The first fight certainly didn't prove him to be better he was lucky to escape with the draw as it was.

BTW- Isn't 1 of those "old guys" JMM's best win in his career? :dunno: In fact if you think JMM is the champion at 130, how did he get that distinction? Wasn;t it by beating 1 of those "old guys"?

[The Cuban Hawk]

what i find interesting is that i can't quite put my finger on what Vazquez did differently in the second fight to have had so much more success. i seem to recall his getting closer to Marquez in the second fight, smothering Marquez's punches somewhat, but it was definitely subtle.

i also think he threw the left uppercut less, mixing in the regular hook more than he did in the first, and i think this took away a lot of the countering opportunities that Marquez had had in their first fight. but again, it was subtle.

it's hard to believe that Vazquez turned it around as much as he did, without making any glaring adjustments.

did anyone notice any fundamental or major adjustments on the part of Vazquez? that could explain the great success he had in the second fight, compared to the first?

I just saw the two fights for the first time (yes, it's true), and I'd say there very much was a difference between the way Vazquez fought.

In the first fight, Vazquez tried to shuffle and maneuver his way onto the inside, allowing Marquez the chance to step around him and beat him to the punch.

In the rematch, Vazquez basically charged in behind his jab and rushed Marquez into close quarters, with almost reckless abandon, before Marquez had a chance to step around or get off. It was a riskier way to fight (and resulted in those cuts around Vazquez's eyes), but it paid off because Marquez wasn't ready for it and really didn't have an answer for it.

It also looked to me like maybe Marquez wasn't in the same shape as in the first fight (his punches looked a bit slower and less sharp IMO, and he looked a little chunky around the middle IMO), which would also explain why he fell apart so quickly. In fact, I think BOTH fighters were surprised by how the other guy fought in those fights... I think Vazquez was surprised that Marquez was able to keep up a long range boxing match for as long as he did in the first fight, and Marquez was surprised by Vazquez's sudden, bull-rushing attack in the second.

[REEDsART]

Oooooops!!!...


REED:cool:

[Double L]

Pacquiao would destroy Guzman anyways. It might take a helluva an effort on his part, but he wouldn't be denied. He'd punish him on the ropes and possibly afflict permanent damage because he'd find himself in a position of possibly losing after about 5 rounds, at which point he'd lose grasp of his sanity and go homicidal on the poor Dominican.

[Explosivo]

Marquez wins this rubbermatch because he is the better, more versatile and more well rounded fighter.

Rafael Marquez TKO 10 Vazquez in a fight that is just as exciting as the first two....leaving fans calling for a fourth one.:bears:

[ArturoGatti]

Vasquez wins this rubbermatch because he is the better, more versatile and more well rounded fighter.

Israel Vasquez TKO 10 Marquez in a fight that is just as exciting as the first two....leaving fans calling for a fourth one.:bears:

[meetthefeebles]

I'll take Vasquez by mid-late stoppage, though I do so with little conviction, to be honest. This is one of those where the more I think about it, the more I cannot decide who I favour and why... :dunno:

[Joe King]

Vasquez UD

[LATIN KING]

Honestly this fight is a toss up. Both guys can pop and both guys can box. Both have stopped each other already.

I guess most believe that VAzquez has the momentum as his should. I think Marquez will turn it around and stop Vazquez again. either way it will be an awesome fight.

Marquez UD!


IN a few weeks I will make the same prediction :blobbox:

[valdosta]

Vasquez KO 9 knocking Marquez into his brothers lap.

[LATIN KING]

Vasquez KO 9 knocking Marquez into his brothers lap.the Marquez brothers never go to each other's fights :nono:

[valdosta]

the Marquez brothers never go to each other's fights :nono:

That's the great part about it.

BTW- I am pretty sure they fought on the same card before so that's not true..

[LATIN KING]

That's the great part about it.

BTW- I am pretty sure they fought on the same card before so that's not true..I meant they don't go watch each other by choice. when they fought on the same card they had to watch each other.


who do you give more of a chance at the upset? JMM or Rafa? against Vazquez and Pacquiao :popcorn:

[valdosta]

I meant they don't go watch each other by choice. when they fought on the same card they had to watch each other.


who do you give more of a chance at the upset? JMM or Rafa? against Vazquez and Pacquiao :popcorn:

Well, look at my bet thread. I am sure you can figure it out :tease: I pick Juan Marquez to win, I don't pick his brother. Although to be fair Rafa has a chance with the scar tissue all over Vasquez's face. Still, he took a pretty good pounding at points in the rematch and his legs didn't recover right. Can't pick Rafa this fight although I am not saying he has no chance. Vasquez is the clear favorite though.

[LATIN KING]

Well, look at my bet thread. I am sure you can figure it out :tease: I pick Juan Marquez to win, I don't pick his brother. Although to be fair Rafa has a chance with the scar tissue all over Vasquez's face. Still, he took a pretty good pounding at points in the rematch and his legs didn't recover right. Can't pick Rafa this fight although I am not saying he has no chance. Vasquez is the clear favorite though.you picked JMM against Pacquiao the first time and ended up hating him.:lol:

you spent the next 4 years trashing him and saying how Manny would stretch him in a rematch.

now you pick JMM against Manny again? go figure:dunno: :lol:

whatever happened to the theory that Manny got better over the years and JMM just got older? :popcorn:

[valdosta]

you picked JMM against Pacquiao the first time and ended up hating him.:lol:

you spent the next 4 years trashing him and saying how Manny would stretch him in a rematch.


I've always hated JMM big deal:dunno: As someone who gambles that never gets in the way of what I bet. As for me saying Pacquiao would bash JMM in a rematch? When? I have said I thought Pacquiao won the first fight, I have said I think Pacquiao has had the better career. What I never said is that he would bash JMM in a rematch.

[Rabid Kimba]

The better fighter will win and that is Israel Vasquez.

Agreed.

:popcorn:

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

I want Raf to win but ima go with Vasquez. Usually the guy who wins the second fight of the trilogy wins the 3rd.

[mexican wedding shirt]

Vazquez KO 9

LATIN KING - I'm not sure about Val, but I maintained for a good while that Pacman got overconfident and left hand happy in the first fight, that's he's only improved since then, and would KO Marquez in the rematch.

However I have changed my mind due to the fact that Pacman has quite simply lost his hunger. I don't think he is REALLY into boxing like he was before, and you've seen in his last few fights, he's not the same hungry whirlwind beast he was before.

Especially with all the politician, lawyer bullshit, and the Barrera rematch he was content to just let it be a sparring session. That's not the Pacman of old, the Pacman that made me a fan.

But anyway, I tentatively pick Pacman by decision. But I would not be in the least bit surprised if Marquez won.

[Donnybrook]

Vazquez TKO 10 or 11.

It's not that Vazquez is bigger...Rafa has always been a very big bantamweight and looks great at 122.

It's that Vazquez is just too determined, too powerful and too precise with his short shots. He just comes forward with too much pressure and that will grind down, wear down and eventually stop Rafael; who really is an offensive machine and is boxing well - but doesn't move his head and whose body is there to be hit.

Plus, I think Vazquez is the more "mentally relentless" of the two...I don't think Israel will accept defeat on this one (unless it's by cuts).

I think Marquez will box brilliantly and really stick his jab and use his legs, look to counter and keep distance.

It will be tit-for-tat in the early and middle rounds.

Israel won't be far behind, because he has become more saavy in his recent fights, especially under Rudy Perez's guidance. His jab is more of a factor (and he can reach Rafa with it); he is moving his head more, weaving, parrying and countering.

So Rafa may have a slight edge and may have some great rounds, but I expect Isra to be "coming on" with that sense of inevitability. Even if he gets rocked.

I think Vazquez will really target the body early and often - and when he finally gets Rafa to fight his short, heavy, sharp shots inside will be doing alot of damage even though Rafa's will be more obvious and "dazzling."

By the 8th or 9th Rafa's legs and body will start to tell.

TKO late in the 10th or 11th.

Peace.

[ElTerriblee]

Vazquez TKO 10 or 11.

It's not that Vazquez is bigger...Rafa has always been a very big bantamweight and looks great at 122.

It's that Vazquez is just too determined, too powerful and too precise with his short shots. He just comes forward with too much pressure and that will grind down, wear down and eventually stop Rafael; who really is an offensive machine and is boxing well - but doesn't move his head and whose body is there to be hit.

Plus, I think Vazquez is the more "mentally relentless" of the two...I don't think Israel will accept defeat on this one (unless it's by cuts).

I think Marquez will box brilliantly and really stick his jab and use his legs, look to counter and keep distance.

It will be tit-for-tat in the early and middle rounds.

Israel won't be far behind, because he has become more saavy in his recent fights, especially under Rudy Perez's guidance. His jab is more of a factor (and he can reach Rafa with it); he is moving his head more, weaving, parrying and countering.

So Rafa may have a slight edge and may have some great rounds, but I expect Isra to be "coming on" with that sense of inevitability. Even if he gets rocked.

I think Vazquez will really target the body early and often - and when he finally gets Rafa to fight his short, heavy, sharp shots inside will be doing alot of damage even though Rafa's will be more obvious and "dazzling."

By the 8th or 9th Rafa's legs and body will start to tell.

TKO late in the 10th or 11th.

Peace.

Vazquez´face doesn´t last that long. I think that will be what it comes down to. His face was a bloody bloody mess in the rematch, that lasted what? Six or seven rounds? No way it holds up against Marquez for 11 rounds. Of course it will depend on the doctor/referee a bit.

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

Vazquez´face doesn´t last that long. I think that will be what it comes down to. His face was a bloody bloody mess in the rematch, that lasted what? Six or seven rounds? No way it holds up against Marquez for 11 rounds. Of course it will depend on the doctor/referee a bit.Thats one of the reasons i wanna pic Raf. He is gonna hit Israel for sure he is the better defensive fighter and his face cuts pretty easy. Problem is is that Israel is a bigger puncher.

[ElTerriblee]

Thats one of the reasons i wanna pic Raf. He is gonna hit Israel for sure he is the better defensive fighter and his face cuts pretty easy. Problem is is that Israel is a bigger puncher.

I´m not sure who to pick, slightly favour the stronger, fresher and arguably bigger puncher in Vazquez, but the 3.8 for 1 on Rafa by KO are very tempting, simply because Marquez always has a chance to flat out KO any guy or force a cut stoppage.

[Trplsec]

I´m not sure who to pick, slightly favour the stronger, fresher and arguably bigger puncher in Vazquez, but the 3.8 for 1 on Rafa by KO are very tempting, simply because Marquez always has a chance to flat out KO any guy or force a cut stoppage.


I bet Vasquez for one reason. In their previous fights I don't know that Marquez ever really stunned Israel with a punch. Obviously the nose deal in the first fight led to Vasquez quiting, but I don't know that Isreal has actually been dazed or clearly stunned by Marquez.

On the other hand, Vasquez knocked Marquez down in the first fight and stunned him on several other occasions. And in the 2nd fight Vasquez was able to hurt him bad enough to force a stoppage.

I think through the first 2 fights we clearly know which guys punch has the most effect on the other. I'd be shocked if that didn't happen in the third fight as well.

All that being said, if Israel gets all cut and busted up to the point of being stopped, then I'm out $100.

[Double L]

I bet Vasquez for one reason. In their previous fights I don't know that Marquez ever really stunned Israel with a punch. Obviously the nose deal in the first fight led to Vasquez quiting, but I don't know that Isreal has actually been dazed or clearly stunned by Marquez.

On the other hand, Vasquez knocked Marquez down in the first fight and stunned him on several other occasions. And in the 2nd fight Vasquez was able to hurt him bad enough to force a stoppage.

I think through the first 2 fights we clearly know which guys punch has the most effect on the other. I'd be shocked if that didn't happen in the third fight as well.

All that being said, if Israel gets all cut and busted up to the point of being stopped, then I'm out $100.

israel was stunned by a right hand in the 1st round, but in general i agree with you. he seemed to have the ability to endure marquez's punishment, and was willing to in order to deliver his own, which matquez could not handle.

[REEDsART]

I want Raf to win but ima go with Vasquez. Usually the guy who wins the second fight of the trilogy wins the 3rd.This is EXACTLY how REED Feels about the Fight...REED Even Rolled w/Vasquez N his Article...

REED Would Looooooooooove to B WRONG on this Particular Prediction, but Vasquez is the SAFE Pick, UNDENIABLY....

By KO, No Less...


REED:cool:

[Donnybrook]

Vazquez´face doesn´t last that long. I think that will be what it comes down to. His face was a bloody bloody mess in the rematch, that lasted what? Six or seven rounds? No way it holds up against Marquez for 11 rounds. Of course it will depend on the doctor/referee a bit.

I thought about that when I picked and admittedly that part of my prediction isn't "safe."

But I think Vazquez will be just slick enough this time - and Rafa cautious enough (in "boxing mode") that they may indeed go later than anyone expects.

Vazquez will pound the body early and look to get inside quickly and re-test that chin again and again....if Rafa can take it long enough and keep moving, I think even a cut or two won't stop it going a bit later than expected.

Isra didn't get cut in the first fight, I believe. And he wasn't badly cut against Jhonny, who is a big puncher.

The 2nd fight was a bit of an abnormality, even for Isra.

Peace.

[Double L]

I thought about that when I picked and admittedly that part of my prediction isn't "safe."

But I think Vazquez will be just slick enough this time - and Rafa cautious enough (in "boxing mode") that they may indeed go later than anyone expects.

Vazquez will pound the body early and look to get inside quickly and re-test that chin again and again....if Rafa can take it long enough and keep moving, I think even a cut or two won't stop it going a bit later than expected.

Isra didn't get cut in the first fight, I believe. And he wasn't badly cut against Jhonny, who is a big puncher.

The 2nd fight was a bit of an abnormality, even for Isra.

Peace.

wait, so who is your pick? is anyone picking Raffy?

[ElTerriblee]

I thought about that when I picked and admittedly that part of my prediction isn't "safe."

But I think Vazquez will be just slick enough this time - and Rafa cautious enough (in "boxing mode") that they may indeed go later than anyone expects.

Vazquez will pound the body early and look to get inside quickly and re-test that chin again and again....if Rafa can take it long enough and keep moving, I think even a cut or two won't stop it going a bit later than expected.

Isra didn't get cut in the first fight, I believe. And he wasn't badly cut against Jhonny, who is a big puncher.

The 2nd fight was a bit of an abnormality, even for Isra.

Peace.

Well his nose was broken and bleeding. Does that count? :dunno: :lol:

It´s more like Rafa makes everybody bleed, if you dare to stay up long enough....not that Vazquez is easy to bust up. Most of the time Vazquez makes people bleed. I remember one of his very early fights around (3rd/4th fight), where he broke his opponents nose and the guy was bleeding so profusely the Red Cross put buckets around the ring looking for donations.

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

Pacquiao would destroy Guzman anyways. It might take a helluva an effort on his part, but he wouldn't be denied. He'd punish him on the ropes and possibly afflict permanent damage because he'd find himself in a position of possibly losing after about 5 rounds, at which point he'd lose grasp of his sanity and go homicidal on the poor Dominican.
Guzman would school Pac. Guzman is clearly Pacs biggest threat. Where Floyd gets blasted for not fighting Cotto nobody will say anything about Pac not fighting Guzman.

[valdosta]

Guzman would school Pac. Guzman is clearly Pacs biggest threat. Where Floyd gets blasted for not fighting Cotto nobody will say anything about Pac not fighting Guzman.

Pac is fighting his biggest threat and is going to lose. A guy who fights in spurts like Guzman is a very winnable fight for pacquiao. Guzman losses a lot of rounds just by getting outworked.

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

Pac is fighting his biggest threat and is going to lose. A guy who fights in spurts like Guzman is a very winnable fight for pacquiao. Guzman losses a lot of rounds just by getting outworked.Guzman is too fast and his chin is made of iron. He also has a big size advantage on Pac.

Only way i see Pac winning this fight is if the judges buy his flurries that won't be doing much.

[valdosta]

Guzman is too fast and his chin is made of iron. He also has a big size advantage on Pac.

Only way i see Pac winning this fight is if the judges buy his flurries that won't be doing much.

Pacquiao isn't going to lose to a spurt fighter. Guzman is to comfortable doing nothing for to long. Unlike a lot of the slow guys that Guzman has faced like Barrios and Soto, Pacquiao is quick enough to land more than they did.

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

Pacquiao isn't going to lose to a spurt fighter. Guzman is to comfortable doing nothing for to long. Unlike a lot of the slow guys that Guzman has faced like Barrios and Soto, Pacquiao is quick enough to land more than they did.Guzmans defence would make Pac throw less punches then he can get off against other fighters and so would his counter punches. Marquez is the best defencive fighter/counter puncher i have seen Pac fight and that was the lowest output i ever saw from Manny.

[valdosta]

Guzmans defence would make Pac throw less punches then he can get off against other fighters and so would his counter punches. Marquez is the best defencive fighter/counter puncher i have seen Pac fight and that was the lowest output i ever saw from Manny.

and you have never seen Guzman fight a fast fighter at all. JMM don't sit on the ropes like Guzman does either which would give Pacquiao plenty of chances to land hard shots.

[boxingnotboxers]

Official prediction: Vazquez TKO 7

Similar to the second fight, to be honest. Marquez will make it a good scrap, but I honestly felt that Vasquez hurts Marquez more than the other way around; even in the first fight (NO I don't think Vasquez was winning, but when he hurt Marquez, I thought he had a golden opportunity that slipped by.)

[mexican wedding shirt]

Guzman is insanely overrated. I can't believe how highly rated he seems to be.

Even this wannabe politician Pacman would thump Guzman.

Indeed gayboy Marquez is a tougher fight for Pacman.

[ArturoGatti]

Guzman is insanely overrated. I can't believe how highly rated he seems to be.

Even this wannabe politician Pacman would thump Guzman.

Indeed gayboy Marquez is a tougher fight for Pacman.who would have thought that a gift decision over Soto would get him all this hype. :rolleyes:

[Baron]

Sopcast?:dunno:

[Baron]

Who won in your opinions? I've only seen the last 3 rounds.

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

I think Vasquez won the fight. The last round surely won him the fight. I think he probably won 6 rounds at least which is what he needed to win the fight. Also the last round could have been a 10-7 round. Marquez took a terrible beating in round 12.

[LEGENDARY]

:clap: :clap: :popcorn: WHAT A GREAT SHOW EXACTLY WHAT WE AS FANS NEEDED WHO CARES WHO WON I LOVED THE FIGHT@@@@@@@@@

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

The huge 12th round won him the fight. What a performance to come out and fight the 12th like that after a brutal fight.

[LEGENDARY]

The huge 12th round won him the fight. What a performance to come out and fight the 12th like that after a brutal fight.
AGREED WITHOUT A 10-8 IN THE LST ROUND MAQUEZ WINS THE BELT WHAT A GREAT COME FROM BEHIND WIN.
I THOUGH IT WAS A DRAW OR MARQUEZ WIN BY 1 HE PUT ON A CLINIC EARLY.ALSO THAT LOW BLOW CALL WAS BS.

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

AGREED WITHOUT A 10-8 IN THE LST ROUND MAQUEZ WINS THE BELT WHAT A GREAT COME FROM BEHIND WIN.
I THOUGH IT WAS A DRAW OR MARQUEZ WIN BY 1 HE PUT ON A CLINIC EARLY.ALSO THAT LOW BLOW CALL WAS BS.It probably was but Raf should have had a point off earlier for low blows he had 3 warnings for them.

[joony]

one of the best fights i've ever seen. i thought vasquez won 113-112

[ElTerriblee]

Wlad and Ibragimov should be mandated to give 75% of their purses to those two real warriors. Straight to the HOF for both fighters. I knew the knockdown would make the difference.

[royyjonesjrp4pno1]

Wlad and Ibragimov should be mandated to give 75% of their purses to those two real warriors. :lol:

[Joe King]

Wlad and Ibragimov should be mandated to give 75% of their purses to those two real warriors. Straight to the HOF for both fighters. I knew the knockdown would make the difference.

:bears: :bears: :bears:

[mexican wedding shirt]

Wlad and Ibragimov should be mandated to give 75% of their purses to those two real warriors. Straight to the HOF for both fighters. I knew the knockdown would make the difference.

:lol: :bears:

[Donnybrook]

Pac is fighting his biggest threat and is going to lose. A guy who fights in spurts like Guzman is a very winnable fight for pacquiao. Guzman losses a lot of rounds just by getting outworked.

You think Pacquiao is going to lose to JMM? :eeeek: :eeeek:

ANd btw....agree that Pacquiao could beat Guzman.

[Joe King]

Vasquez UD

Almost:doh:

[holler]

Vasquez is a straight up warrior. The way he went after Marquez in round 12 is how a true warrior closes a show. These guys have 10x the heart any of those pussy heavyweights could ever have.

[Ugotabe Kidding]

Wlad and Ibragimov should be mandated to give 75% of their purses to those two real warriors. Straight to the HOF for both fighters. I knew the knockdown would make the difference.

Warriors = poor defense & little power :crafty:

[ArturoGatti]

how come there was no rbr for this fight?:dunno:

[Joe King]

how come there was no rbr for this fight?:dunno:

I was thinking about that too because I just saw the results afterward, but I guess everyone was too busy watching it. Awesome!

[mikE]

The cards:DeLuca, Kaczmarek, Jen Kin
R1 M x3
R2 V M V
R3 V M V
R4 M x3 (10-8)
R5 M V M
R6 V x3
R7 M x3
R8 V x3
R9 V M M
R10 M x3 (but - 1)
R11 V M V
R12 V x3 (10-8)

DeLuca: 114-111 V
Kacz: 114-111 M
Jen Kin: 113-112 V

Majority: 113-112 V

[Ugotabe Kidding]

I was thinking about that too because I just saw the results afterward, but I guess everyone was too busy watching it. Awesome!

Yeah, the same reason there wan't one for Chagaev-Skelton :bears:

[Octopus]

I thought Marquez won it!!:dunno: