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atomicdOGg34
03-13-2008, 06:23 PM
So he isn't a muslim now?

i never said he was

and if he is i dont really care

in fact i dont care what church he goes to, there is no religious test for office

"however", when someone who's had this much influence on your life goes beyond the pulpit and preaches racist messages, anti-US messages, and others, that goes beyond the religion

itd be the same for a muslim, i wouldnt care as long as the place wasnt preaching suicide bombing, anti-US sentiments, etc etc

I and I
03-13-2008, 06:25 PM
i never said he was

and if he is i dont really care

in fact i dont care what church he goes to, there is no religious test for office

"however", when someone who's had this much influence on your life goes beyond the pulpit and preaches racist messages, anti-US messages, and others, that goes beyond the religion

itd be the same for a muslim, i wouldnt care as long as the place wasnt preaching suicide bombing, anti-US sentiments, etc etc

So you know how much that guy has influenced obama? Please tell us how much, and how you know this. :popcorn:

atomicdOGg34
03-13-2008, 06:27 PM
So you know how much that guy has influenced obama? Please tell us how much, and how you know this. :popcorn:

the guys admitted it, just look up whats hes said, im not going to repeat it

hell, the man was the inspiration for the title of obamas book

I and I
03-13-2008, 06:31 PM
[QUOTE=atomicdOGg34]the guys admitted it, just look up whats hes said, im not going to repeat it

BULLSHIT.

who the hell is "inspired" by their pastor???

inspired to do what? and what do you mean inspire? get ideas from?

I like how the rightwingers say, we aren't judging him on his beliefs yet his beliefs are what he is being criticized for. :laughing: :laughing: BULLSHIT

atomicdOGg34
03-13-2008, 06:32 PM
[quote=atomicdOGg34]the guys admitted it, just look up whats hes said, im not going to repeat it

BULLSHIT.

who the hell is "inspired" by their pastor???

inspired to do what? and what do you mean inspire? get ideas from?

I like how the rightwingers say, we aren't judging him on his beliefs yet his beliefs are what he is being criticized for. :laughing: :laughing: BULLSHIT

www.google.com (http://www.google.com)

look it up

im not gonna get into a pissing match over it

I and I
03-13-2008, 06:32 PM
someone that has a picture of a war criminal on their avatar is complaining about what a pastor is saying.

FUCKIN JOKE

atomicdOGg34
03-13-2008, 06:33 PM
someone that has a picture of a war criminal on their avatar is complaining about what a pastor is saying.

FUCKIN JOKE

your schtick is old *yawn*

I and I
03-13-2008, 06:35 PM
FIrst they tried to say he was close to faraconn

then they tried to say he was a muslim, and then posts photos of him in africa with an african guy.

then they try to judge him for what his pastor(angry black guy) says


Not only are the people that do this racist, but they don't have the balls to admit that they are racist.

I and I
03-13-2008, 06:35 PM
your schtick is old *yawn*

sig bet: Ronal Reagan has done more harm to people than obamas pastor at the church he attends sometimes.

What the pussy back down. :popcorn:

atomicdOGg34
03-13-2008, 06:37 PM
FIrst they tried to say he was close to faraconn

then they tried to say he was a muslim, and then posts photos of him in africa with an african guy.

then they try to judge him for what his pastor(angry black guy) says


Not only are the people that do this racist, but they don't have the balls to admit that they are racist.

im not saying he is a racist

but it is a fact that his pastor inspired him

and im also saying, if you dont think what this man is saying is racist than your a hypocrite and probably a racist yourself

like i said, this fails the hypocrisy test miserably

atomicdOGg34
03-13-2008, 06:38 PM
sig bet: Ronal Reagan has done more harm to people than obamas pastor at the church he attends sometimes.

What the pussy back down. :popcorn:

:rolleyes:

and how would that prove that obamas pastor isnt a racist?

oh yeah, it wouldn't

I and I
03-13-2008, 06:43 PM
im not saying he is a racist

but it is a fact that his pastor inspired him

and im also saying, if you dont think what this man is saying is racist than your a hypocrite and probably a racist yourself

like i said, this fails the hypocrisy test miserably

Everything in your life and everyone you meet inspires you in some way dickhead.

I and I
03-13-2008, 06:43 PM
:rolleyes:

and how would that prove that obamas pastor isnt a racist?

oh yeah, it wouldn't


so you don't like obama because of his pastor?

I and I
03-13-2008, 06:45 PM
:rolleyes:

and how would that prove that obamas pastor isnt a racist?

oh yeah, it wouldn't

It would prove that you are full of shit when complaining about one guy who has done far less shit than reagan.

atomicdOGg34
03-13-2008, 06:46 PM
so you don't like obama because of his pastor?

i thought we were debating the hypocrisy of slystaff not thinking this is racist?

I and I
03-13-2008, 06:49 PM
i thought we were debating the hypocrisy of slystaff not thinking this is racist?

No, it's about you being full of shit. :popcorn:

slystaff
03-13-2008, 06:53 PM
:rolleyes:

and how would that prove that obamas pastor isnt a racist?

oh yeah, it wouldn'tAtomic Dogg YOU are a hypocrite!

I opened the Bombing hiroshima thread just for you to be honest. You said that two wrongs don't make a right when discussing blacks reacting to whites racism...or a man killing a person who killed his wife....stayed on this moral highround....and then predictably agreed with the US anniihilating hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians with Atomic bombs because of what Japan did.

Answer that young blood! :cool:

Black Market Baby
03-13-2008, 06:59 PM
People are grasping at ways to discredit Obama.

atomicdOGg34
03-13-2008, 07:04 PM
Atomic Dogg YOU are a hypocrite!

I opened the Bombing hiroshima thread just for you to be honest. You said that two wrongs don't make a right when discussing blacks reacting to whites racism...or a man killing a person who killed his wife....stayed on this moral highround....and then predictably agreed with the US anniihilating hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians with Atomic bombs because of what Japan did.

Answer that young blood! :cool:

im flattered you started a thread just for me

however, racism and dropping a bomb to end a war are 2 very different things

there is no moral justification for racism, none

so i dont see your point

Rock on
03-13-2008, 07:12 PM
When racists want to make white people afraid of obama at first they say that he is a muslim, now they say he goes to a church where they use the "be afraid of angrly black people" slant.

Racists :shit:

Word. :bears:

slystaff
03-13-2008, 07:18 PM
im flattered you started a thread just for me

however, racism and dropping a bomb to end a war are 2 very different things

there is no moral justification for racism, none

so i dont see your pointSo there;s moral justification for eradicating women children and other innocent civilians in two cities with Atom Bombs? Now I see why you call yourself Atomicdogg! :doh:

TFK
03-13-2008, 07:26 PM
<OBJECT height=355 width=425>

<embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/hAYe7MT5BxM&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></OBJECT></P>

You go Reverend! Praise Allaaahhhh Jesus!
http://johnstodderinexile.files.wordpress.com/2006/06/barack-obama.jpg



That's some sermon.

Has nothing to do with religion, and everything to do with bashing Hillary Clinton and whites in general though.

But who cares if his ideas inspire hate and a victim mentality. He's charasmatic and a good speaker. Maybe HE should be president.

TFK

I and I
03-13-2008, 07:31 PM
That's some sermon.

Has nothing to do with religion, and everything to do with bashing Hillary Clinton and whites in general though.

But who cares if his ideas inspire hate and a victim mentality. He's charasmatic and a good speaker. Maybe HE should be president.

TFK

"victim mentality"?? so it's not real, it's just a mentality?:popcorn:

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 07:37 PM
I'd love to investigate all of the groups, clubs, churches that Ron Paul was a member of at some point or another and scrutinize them. :cool:

Go for it .... You think someone already hasn't ?

They pulled all the dirt they could find on him ... had to go back 30 years to do it and it was someone elses dirt. :clap:

:lol:

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 07:38 PM
Hey Petre, is Obama a member of the Skull & Bones club to? Is he Illuminatti?

No .... but I bet you his handlers are.

TFK
03-13-2008, 07:39 PM
"victim mentality"?? so it's not real, it's just a mentality?:popcorn:

You're a retard. That's real.

TFK

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 07:42 PM
What's up with the sig you have Petre? Who's that white dude? :lol:

That's Larry Sinclair ... he says back in '99 he and Obama took a limo ride together in CHicago where Obama smoked crack while having Larry suck his cock. :lol:

He is suing Obama and his team for paying off an organization that was supposed to unbiasedly give him a lie detector on it. It was said $750,000 came out of the ole Obama Campaign fund to shut that one up.

:clap:

Seeing as how his connections with the Weathermen where the leader admits men did manly greek style mano a mano lovin ... I can believe it. :lol:

I and I
03-13-2008, 07:42 PM
You're a retard. That's real.

TFK

So being a victim of racism is a "mentality" and not real???

Keep running from the question bitch. :popcorn:

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 07:43 PM
People are grasping at ways to discredit Obama.

If by grasping you mean every time you turn a corner , there's more shit in your face on Obama ... yeah ... I've been grasping my ass off. :clap:

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 07:44 PM
yet if mccain went to a church that said blacks were the scourge of the earth they be off the wall going crazy :lol:

i think when it comes to racism things have to pass the hypocrisy test

this fails that test miserably :lol:

Phonetapout is desperately trying to find dirt on Paul to the point where he needs to ask me for info.

Notice a difference ? :laughing:

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 07:46 PM
So he isn't a muslim now?

Voting or not voting for someone because of what a pastor says=FUCKIN STUPID

as stupid as rightwingers voting for someone just because of what church they go to.

IandI it's not because of what the church says .... it's because it's the church Obama chooses to go to that says those things.

There IS a difference.

slystaff
03-13-2008, 07:47 PM
If by grasping you mean every time you turn a corner , there's more shit in your face on Obama ... yeah ... I've been grasping my ass off. :clap:Have some respect. One day and very soon, he'll be the President of the country that you love and will be representing all Americans with his black self! :cool:

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 07:48 PM
[quote=atomicdOGg34]the guys admitted it, just look up whats hes said, im not going to repeat it

BULLSHIT.

who the hell is "inspired" by their pastor???

inspired to do what? and what do you mean inspire? get ideas from?

I like how the rightwingers say, we aren't judging him on his beliefs yet his beliefs are what he is being criticized for. :laughing: :laughing: BULLSHIT

Seeing as you are not religious I don't expect you to understand the significance of this .... but rest assured , a man's faith for the faithful is extremely important.

You'll note , the other faithful here cannot defend going to this kind of church with any real conviction.

TFK
03-13-2008, 07:49 PM
So being a victim of racism is a "mentality" and not real???

Keep running from the question bitch. :popcorn:


That's not what I said. Dumbass.


TFK

Black Market Baby
03-13-2008, 07:49 PM
Seeing as how his connections with the Weathermen where the leader admits men did manly greek style mano a mano lovin ... I can believe it. :lol:

See it's shit like this that give you a serious LACK or credibility. Not the fact you posted it, but the fact you believe it.

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 07:51 PM
That's some sermon.

Has nothing to do with religion, and everything to do with bashing Hillary Clinton and whites in general though.

But who cares if his ideas inspire hate and a victim mentality. He's charasmatic and a good speaker. Maybe HE should be president.

TFK

And again ... when I look at THAT I have to say to myself ...

THAT is the CHURCH the potential President of the United States of America goes to ???

Not my fucking president!

Can people think the way they do in that church ? SURE . THis is America land of the "free" home of the brave ....

But THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA ???

NO FUCKING WAY!

Only an idiot or a liar cannot see the conflict here.

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 07:52 PM
See it's shit like this that give you a serious LACK or credibility. Not the fact you posted it, but the fact you believe it.

Look it up ... it came from the horses mouth .

TFK
03-13-2008, 07:53 PM
And again ... when I look at THAT I have to say to myself ...

THAT is the CHURCH the potential President of the United States of America goes to ???

Not my fucking president!

Can people think the way they do in that church ? SURE . THis is America land of the "free" home of the brave ....

But THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA ???

NO FUCKING WAY!

Only an idiot or a liar cannot see the conflict here.


But Petre! That pastor has charisma! He's inspiring! He's a good public speaker!

He'd make a perfect president.

TFK

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 07:53 PM
Have some respect. One day and very soon, he'll be the President of the country that you love and will be representing all Americans with his black self! :cool:

Be honest Sly ... God is watching.

What that church teaches is FUCKED UP! and you know it. :nono:

TFK
03-13-2008, 07:54 PM
Look it up ... it came from the horses mouth .

I gotta call bullshit on this one.

I didn't see Slystaff say anything like that.



TFK

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 07:54 PM
But Petre! That pastor has charisma! He's inspiring! He's a good public speaker!

He'd make a perfect president.

TFK

He could inspire a race war , that's for sure!

TFK
03-13-2008, 07:55 PM
He could inspire a race war , that's for sure!


Well, that would count as 'change', right?

Just another reason that guy should be president.


TFK

slystaff
03-13-2008, 08:00 PM
Well, that would count as 'change', right?

Just another reason that guy should be president.


TFK:rolleyes: You and Petre are getting ridiculous

Black Market Baby
03-13-2008, 08:01 PM
Look it up ... it came from the horses mouth .

You miss the point, I don't discount the reference...it's the connection you make with that information.

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 08:03 PM
Birds of a feather my friend.

Obama has a laudry list of cracked and crooked birds he hangs with ... but I'm sure he's ok.

:doh:

PetreTG
03-13-2008, 08:04 PM
:rolleyes: You and Petre are getting ridiculous

Sly ... how many white people do you think that reverend could give that "sermon" to that wouldn't walk out puking ?

Arben
03-13-2008, 08:24 PM
Anyone else find it funny that Petre constantly rags on the media for focusing on non-issues like gay marriage or campaign spots instead of the real issuses, yet he consistently brings up non-issues to disparage Obama?

slystaff
03-13-2008, 09:37 PM
Sly ... how many white people do you think that reverend could give that "sermon" to that wouldn't walk out puking ?Hey most black people would walk out puking as well. I've left BLACK churches in mid "sermon" because of sermons that were too political and/or black focussed instead of God focussed.

It's not a white or black thing.

But don't judge Obama by all the views of his pastor. Obama is an individual with his own views...and has a WHITE MOTHER (I seem to have to keep reminding people of that)...and so can't possibly hate white people.

TFK
03-13-2008, 09:44 PM
...and has a WHITE MOTHER (I seem to have to keep reminding people of that)...and so can't possibly hate white people.


Stupid post of the day.


TFK

Rabid Kimba
03-13-2008, 09:48 PM
Church of a President of the United States of America ? I don't think so .... :cool:

<object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/zWvxTUy47Fk&hl=en"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/zWvxTUy47Fk&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>

You go Reverend! Praise Allaaahhhh Jesus!
http://johnstodderinexile.files.wordpress.com/2006/06/barack-obama.jpg


That preacher speaks the truth.

I and I
03-13-2008, 10:05 PM
That's not what I said. Dumbass.


TFK


You mentioned "victim mentality" I questioned this phrase because it implies that racism isn't real and only a mentality. I asked you if this is what you meant, and you didn't answer like a pussy. :popcorn:

I and I
03-13-2008, 10:08 PM
IandI it's not because of what the church says .... it's because it's the church Obama chooses to go to that says those things.

There IS a difference.


So a guy that says those things in church you don't like, but you don't mind preachers talking about fish swallowing human beings, and reading out of a book that praises slavery and many other stupid things???

TFK
03-13-2008, 10:10 PM
You mentioned "victim mentality" I questioned this phrase because it implies that racism isn't real and only a mentality. I asked you if this is what you meant, and you didn't answer like a pussy. :popcorn:

It's no surprise that someone like InI, who is the biggest example of the victim mentality on this board, would completely fail to comprehend what I wrote, and try to make it sound like I said something I didn't.

TFK

I and I
03-13-2008, 10:32 PM
It's no surprise that someone like InI, who is the biggest example of the victim mentality on this board, would completely fail to comprehend what I wrote, and try to make it sound like I said something I didn't.

TFK

It's amazing how TFK can't explain his own logic. :laughing:

TFK
03-13-2008, 10:35 PM
It's amazing how TFK can't explain his own logic. :laughing:

Dumbass, what I said has nothing to do with racism. People of all colors have victim mentality. You're a perfect example.


TFK

I and I
03-13-2008, 11:49 PM
Dumbass, what I said has nothing to do with racism. People of all colors have victim mentality. You're a perfect example.


TFK

So is it real or a mentality???

TFK
03-13-2008, 11:55 PM
So is it real or a mentality???

Is 'what' real or a mentality?

TFK

I and I
03-13-2008, 11:57 PM
Is 'what' real or a mentality?

TFK

The pastors words, do the reflect a mentality or reality. Remember, your comment "victim mentality" was talking about what he said in that clip.

So is what he said real, or just a mentality? :popcorn:

TFK
03-14-2008, 12:05 AM
The pastors words, do the reflect a mentality or reality. Remember, your comment "victim mentality" was talking about what he said in that clip.

So is what he said real, or just a mentality? :popcorn:

A little bit from column A, a little bit from column B.

TFK

Trplsec
03-14-2008, 01:38 AM
Riiiight, it's Such a "Benefit", he's the 2nd Black Candidate w/a REAL Chance EVER:rolleyes: ...

It's a "Novelty" Cause it's BEEN America's Little "UNWRITTEN Rule" that a Black Man WON'T B President...& If U're Gonna Sit Here & Act like that HASN'T Been the Case, U're RESPECTFULLY Full of Shit, Dog....

Honestly, REED STILL ISN'T Optimistic about Obama WINNING the Presidency...REED STILL DOESN'T Think it'll Happen N his Lifetime...If Obama DOES Win, it'll B Probably THE Most SHOCKING Occurence of REED's lifetime...

REED Wishes the Brother Luck, but he ISN"T Holding his Breath EXPECTING him to Win or even Beat Hillary for that Matter...

REED:cool:


You won't get an argument from me on THAT point. For the better part of this country's history it wasn't an unwritten rule, but a strictly enforced rule in the sense that blacks weren't constitutionally allowed to vote until 1870.

But even after the 15th Amendment, blacks still weren't offered a fair shake in terms of voting. Realistically, it wasn't until the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Voting Rights Act of 1965 that African-Americans honestly had unabated legal ability to vote across the country.

Unfortunately all of those points only enhance, not diminish, the fact that Obama is riding a wave of novelty as the first African-American with a legitimate shot at becoming the President.

With that being said, I think the novelty will wear off before the election. At that point skin color, the thing that has helped Obama the most thus far in his campaign, will become a major obstacle to his getting elected as voters get back in touch with their 'inner racist' while standing in the voting booth.

Godfather
03-14-2008, 02:32 AM
Kerry and Gore got 88 and 90% of the black vote in the GENERAL election. Not in the primaries.

slystaff
03-14-2008, 03:01 AM
Kerry and Gore got 88 and 90% of the black vote in the GENERAL election. Not in the primaries.Did Al Sharpton consistently beat John Kerry for the black vote? Did Al Sharpton "sweep the south" the way Obama did? So what's your point?

Godfather
03-14-2008, 03:03 AM
Did Al Sharpton consistently beat John Kerry for the black vote? Did Al Sharpton "sweep the south" the way Obama did? So what's your point?My point was that Gore and Kerry won those votes in the General Election. :dunno: Not the primaries.

Rabid Kimba
03-14-2008, 03:20 AM
Blacks R Like 15-18% of the Nation,Dog...

39.9 million African Americans live in the United States, comprising 13.8 percent of the total population.

:popcorn:

TFK
03-14-2008, 09:02 AM
39.9 million African Americans live in the United States, comprising 13.8 percent of the total population.

:popcorn:


Just curious, what percentage of blacks are registered voters?


TFK

mexican wedding shirt
03-14-2008, 09:40 AM
it appears phonetap was off by a couple percentage points in regards to kerry, he only got 88 percent of the black vote in 2004. al gore received 90 percent back in 2000. the information is there just google it. trying to pinhole african-americans as simply voting black is ridiculous. if the african-american vote was that racially mindless, then al sharpton would have won comparibale percentages of the black vote back in 2004 as barack obama is doing now.


<!-- Inline toolbox --><!-- /Inline toolbox --><!-- Entry Footer & Comments -->

Fair enough, well that's almost 90 percent anyway.

Why did African Americans uniformly vote for those 2 candidates in particular?

phonetap
03-14-2008, 10:40 AM
My point was that Gore and Kerry won those votes in the General Election. :dunno: Not the primaries.

as if you have any clue what the primary numbers were...your point is moot.

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 12:09 PM
http://s.wsj.net/img/mainWSJlogoWhite.gif





Obama and the Minister

By RONALD KESSLER
March 14, 2008; Page A19


In a sermon delivered at Howard University, Barack Obama's longtime minister, friend and adviser blamed America for starting the AIDS virus, training professional killers, importing drugs and creating a racist society that would never elect a black candidate president.


The Rev. Jeremiah A. Wright Jr., pastor of Mr. Obama's Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago, gave the sermon at the school's Andrew Rankin Memorial Chapel in Washington on Jan. 15, 2006.


<table class="imglftbdy" align="left" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="257"> <tbody><tr><td>http://s.wsj.net/public/resources/images/OB-BD629_oj_kes_20080313201734.jpg</td></tr><tr><td class="medcrd">Trinity United Church of Christ/Religion News Service </td></tr><tr><td class="medcptcrd">Sen. Barack Obama and the Rev. Jeremiah Wright</td></tr></tbody></table> "We've got more black men in prison than there are in college," he began. "Racism is alive and well. Racism is how this country was founded and how this country is still run. No black man will ever be considered for president, no matter how hard you run Jesse [Jackson] and no black woman can ever be considered for anything outside what she can give with her body."


Mr. Wright thundered on: "America is still the No. 1 killer in the world. . . . We are deeply involved in the importing of drugs, the exporting of guns, and the training of professional killers . . . We bombed Cambodia, Iraq and Nicaragua, killing women and children while trying to get public opinion turned against Castro and Ghadhafi . . . We put [Nelson] Mandela in prison and supported apartheid the whole 27 years he was there. We believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God."


His voice rising, Mr. Wright said, "We supported Zionism shamelessly while ignoring the Palestinians and branding anybody who spoke out against it as being anti-Semitic. . . . We care nothing about human life if the end justifies the means. . . ."


Concluding, Mr. Wright said: "We started the AIDS virus . . . We are only able to maintain our level of living by making sure that Third World people live in grinding poverty. . . ."


Considering this view of America, it's not surprising that in December Mr. Wright's church gave an award to Louis Farrakhan for lifetime achievement. In the church magazine, Trumpet, Mr. Wright spoke glowingly of the Nation of Islam leader. "His depth on analysis [sic] when it comes to the racial ills of this nation is astounding and eye-opening," Mr. Wright said of Mr. Farrakhan. "He brings a perspective that is helpful and honest."


After Newsmax broke the story of the award to Farrakhan on Jan. 14, Mr. Obama issued a statement. However, Mr. Obama ignored the main point: that his minister and friend had spoken adoringly of Mr. Farrakhan, and that Mr. Wright's church was behind the award to the Nation of Islam leader.
Instead, Mr. Obama said, "I decry racism and anti-Semitism in every form and strongly condemn the anti-Semitic statements made by Minister Farrakhan. I assume that Trumpet magazine made its own decision to honor Farrakhan based on his efforts to rehabilitate ex-offenders, but it is not a decision with which I agree." Trumpet is owned and produced by Mr. Wright's church out of the church's offices, and Mr. Wright's daughters serve as publisher and executive editor.


Meeting with Jewish leaders in Cleveland on Feb. 24, Mr. Obama described Mr. Wright as being like "an old uncle who sometimes will say things that I don't agree with." He rarely mentions the points of disagreement.


Mr. Obama went on to explain Mr. Wright's anti-Zionist statements as being rooted in his anger over the Jewish state's support for South Africa under its previous policy of apartheid. As with his previous claim that his church gave the award to Mr. Farrakhan because of his work with ex-offenders, Mr. Obama appears to have made that up.


Neither the presentation of the award nor the Trumpet article about the award mentions ex-offenders, and Mr. Wright's statements denouncing Israel have not been qualified in any way. Mr. Obama nonetheless told the Jewish leaders that the award to Mr. Farrakhan "showed a lack of sensitivity to the Jewish community." That is an understatement.


As for Mr. Wright's repeated comments blaming America for the 9/11 attacks because of what Mr. Wright calls its racist and violent policies, Mr. Obama has said it sounds as if the minister was trying to be "provocative."
Hearing Mr. Wright's venomous and paranoid denunciations of this country, the vast majority of Americans would walk out. Instead, Mr. Obama and his wife Michelle have presumably sat through numerous similar sermons by Mr. Wright.


Indeed, Mr. Obama has described Mr. Wright as his "sounding board" during the two decades he has known him. Mr. Obama has said he found religion through the minister in the 1980s. He joined the church in 1991 and walked down the aisle in a formal commitment of faith.


The title of Mr. Obama's bestseller "The Audacity of Hope" comes from one of Wright's sermons. Mr. Wright is one of the first people Mr. Obama thanked after his election to the Senate in 2004. Mr. Obama consulted Mr. Wright before deciding to run for president. He prayed privately with Mr. Wright before announcing his candidacy last year.


Mr. Obama obviously would not choose to belong to Mr. Wright's church and seek his advice unless he agreed with at least some of his views. In light of Mr. Wright's perspective, Michelle Obama's comment that she feels proud of America for the first time in her adult life makes perfect sense.
Much as most of us would appreciate the symbolism of a black man ascending to the presidency, what we have in Barack Obama is a politician whose closeness to Mr. Wright underscores his radical record.


The media have largely ignored Mr. Obama's close association with Mr. Wright. This raises legitimate questions about Mr. Obama's fundamental beliefs about his country. Those questions deserve a clearer answer than Mr. Obama has provided so far.


Mr. Kessler, a former Wall Street Journal and Washington Post reporter, is chief Washington correspondent of Newsmax.com and the author of "The Terrorist Watch: Inside the Desperate Race to Stop the Next Attack" (Crown Forum, 2007).

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 12:10 PM
So a guy that says those things in church you don't like, but you don't mind preachers talking about fish swallowing human beings, and reading out of a book that praises slavery and many other stupid things???

No you're not getting the point.

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 12:19 PM
39.9 million African Americans live in the United States, comprising 13.8 percent of the total population.

:popcorn:

There's a shitload of kids in that figure.

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 12:28 PM
http://a.abcnews.com/images/Site/byline_abcnews.gif

http://a.abcnews.com/images/site/printlogo.jpg (http://abcnews.go.com/)


http://a.abcnews.com/images/Blotter/Obama_wright_080312_ms.jpg


Obama's Pastor: God Damn America, U.S. to Blame for 9/11

Obama's Pastor, Rev. Jeremiah Wright, Has a History of What Even Obama's Campaign Aides Say Is 'Inflammatory Rhetoric'

By BRIAN ROSS and REHAB EL-BURI

March 13, 2008—


Sen. Barack Obama's pastor says blacks should not sing "God Bless America" but "God damn America."
The Rev. Jeremiah Wright, Obama's pastor for the last 20 years at the Trinity United Church of Christ on Chicago's south side, has a long history of what even Obama's campaign aides concede is "inflammatory rhetoric," including the assertion that the United States brought on the 9/11 attacks with its own "terrorism."
In a campaign appearance earlier this month, Sen. Obama said, "I don't think my church is actually particularly controversial." He said Rev. Wright "is like an old uncle who says things I don't always agree with," telling a Jewish group that everyone has someone like that in their family.
Rev. Wright married Obama and his wife Michelle, baptized their two daughters and is credited by Obama for the title of his book, "The Audacity of Hope."
An ABC News review of dozens of Rev. Wright's sermons, offered for sale by the church, found repeated denunciations of the U.S. based on what he described as his reading of the Gospels and the treatment of black Americans.
"The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, God damn America, that's in the Bible for killing innocent people," he said in a 2003 sermon. "God damn America for treating our citizens as less than human. God damn America for as long as she acts like she is God and she is supreme."
In addition to damning America, he told his congregation on the Sunday after Sept. 11, 2001 that the United States had brought on al Qaeda's attacks because of its own terrorism.
"We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye," Rev. Wright said in a sermon on Sept. 16, 2001.
"We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back to our own front yards. America's chickens are coming home to roost," he told his congregation.
<!-- page -->Sen. Obama told the New York Times he was not at the church on the day of Rev. Wright's 9/11 sermon. "The violence of 9/11 was inexcusable and without justification," Obama said in a recent interview. "It sounds like he was trying to be provocative," Obama told the paper.
Rev. Wright, who announced his retirement last month, has built a large and loyal following at his church with his mesmerizing sermons, mixing traditional spiritual content and his views on contemporary issues.
"I wouldn't call it radical. I call it being black in America," said one congregation member outside the church last Sunday.
"He has impacted the life of Barack Obama so much so that he wants to portray that feeling he got from Rev. Wright onto the country because we all need something positive," said another member of the congregation.
Rev. Wright, who declined to be interviewed by ABC News, is considered one of the country's 10 most influential black pastors, according to members of the Obama campaign.
Obama has praised at least one aspect of Rev. Wright's approach, referring to his "social gospel" and his focus on Africa, "and I agree with him on that."
Sen. Obama declined to comment on Rev. Wright's denunciations of the United States, but a campaign religious adviser, Shaun Casey, appearing on "Good Morning America" Thursday, said Obama "had repudiated" those comments.
In a statement to ABCNews.com, Obama's press spokesman Bill Burton said, "Sen. Obama has said repeatedly that personal attacks such as this have no place in this campaign or our politics, whether they're offered from a platform at a rally or the pulpit of a church. Sen. Obama does not think of the pastor of his church in political terms. Like a member of his family, there are things he says with which Sen. Obama deeply disagrees. But now that he is retired, that doesn't detract from Sen. Obama's affection for Rev. Wright or his appreciation for the good works he has done."
Click Here for the Investigative Homepage. (http://abcnews.go.com/blotter)


Copyright © 2008 ABC News Internet Ventures

Trplsec
03-14-2008, 01:52 PM
I'm sorry, maybe I missed the Constitutional Amendment stating that Presidential candidates had to be from a particular church or religion and had to believe in Jesus.

What number was that?

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 02:32 PM
I'm sorry, maybe I missed the Constitutional Amendment stating that Presidential candidates had to be from a particular church or religion and had to believe in Jesus.

What number was that?

Who said that ? :dunno:

Arben
03-14-2008, 02:41 PM
Anyone else find it funny that Obama's preacher says the same stuff that Petre preaches?

US is to blame for being the biggest killers in the world.
US should be ashamed for supporting Israel in the way they have.


Oh wait, but he supports blacks, so that trumps everything he says.

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 02:43 PM
Anyone else find it funny that Obama's preacher says the same stuff that Petre preaches?

US is to blame for being the biggest killers in the world.
US should be ashamed for supporting Israel in the way they have.


Oh wait, but he supports blacks, so that trumps everything he says.

Not quite Andy ... :nono:

slystaff
03-14-2008, 02:57 PM
It's unfortunate the tactics that the establishment would resort to in order to diminish Obama...even looking at what his Pastor has preached.

OBAMA hasn't preached this, so why use this as a campaign tactic?

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 03:02 PM
It's unfortunate the tactics that the establishment would resort to in order to diminish Obama...even looking at what his Pastor has preached.

OBAMA hasn't preached this, so why use this as a campaign tactic?

Sly ... I know you're smarter than this.

Had Paul attended a predominantly white church with a "German white pride" agenda , had been married there and had his children baptized there ... your ass would have been all over Paul for it.

Don't be a hypocrite! :nono:

That church is WHACK! and that is where Obama feeds his soul. :stir:

phonetap
03-14-2008, 04:01 PM
Anyone else find it funny that Obama's preacher says the same stuff that Petre preaches?

US is to blame for being the biggest killers in the world.
US should be ashamed for supporting Israel in the way they have.


Oh wait, but he supports blacks, so that trumps everything he says.

pastre must think everyone here forgot all the 9/11 bullshit he has spewed over the years...this forums chief conspiracy theorist attacking another conspiracy theorist. phonetap is beginning to think there may be some truth to the charges of pastre's racial proclivities. not saying pastre is racist but a disturbing event is happening here. in all the years pastre has posted on these boxing forums has he EVER been this passionate against a political figure? phonetap doesn't think so. :dunno:

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 04:05 PM
pastre must think everyone here forgot all the 9/11 bullshit he has spewed over the years...this forums chief conspiracy theorist attacking another conspiracy theorist. phonetap is beginning to think there may be some truth to the charges of pastre's racial proclivities. not saying pastre is racist but a disturbing event is happening here. in all the years pastre has posted on these boxing forums has he EVER been this passionate against a political figure? phonetap doesn't think so. :dunno:

BUSH comes to mind ... :laughing:

God ... how easy can you possibly make it ? :lol:

slystaff
03-14-2008, 04:11 PM
Sly ... I know you're smarter than this.

Had Paul attended a predominantly white church with a "German white pride" agenda , had been married there and had his children baptized there ... your ass would have been all over Paul for it.

Don't be a hypocrite! :nono:

That church is WHACK! and that is where Obama feeds his soul. :stir:Paul's Newpaper spewed some terribly racist stuff, but I don't call Paul a racist. SURE...it should be mentioned but if Paul has distanced himself from some of the comments made in his name...and people accept that Obama should be given teh same grace in regards to his Pastor saying soe offensive stuff.

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 04:30 PM
Paul's Newpaper spewed some terribly racist stuff, but I don't call Paul a racist. SURE...it should be mentioned but if Paul has distanced himself from some of the comments made in his name...and people accept that Obama should be given teh same grace in regards to his Pastor saying soe offensive stuff.

Trying to compare the dirt on Obama to that of Paul is laughable. The proverbial mountain to a mole hill.

Paul .... 30 year old Questionably racist article written by someone else and a contribution by a white supremist named Black :lol:.

Obama ... His Church and it's racial sepratist agenda headed by Wright a guy that honored Racist Farrakhan with a lifetime achievement award , Rezko , Pritzker , Ayres , Dohrn ... we can also add Frank Marshall Davis to the list , (more on him later) and of course Obama's drug use and accusations by Larry Sinclair. Not to mention many very questionable campaign tactics and of course my biggest problem of all with Obama. Style with ZERO substance and a lot of lying.

Sorry ... no comparison my friend and you know it.

slystaff
03-14-2008, 05:14 PM
Trying to compare the dirt on Obama to that of Paul is laughable. The proverbial mountain to a mole hill.

Paul .... 30 year old Questionably racist article written by someone else and a contribution by a white supremist named Black :lol:.

Obama ... His Church and it's racial sepratist agenda headed by Wright a guy that honored Racist Farrakhan with a lifetime achievement award , Rezko , Pritzker , Ayres , Dohrn ... we can also add Frank Marshall Davis to the list , (more on him later) and of course Obama's drug use and accusations by Larry Sinclair. Not to mention many very questionable campaign tactics and of course my biggest problem of all with Obama. Style with ZERO substance and a lot of lying.

Sorry ... no comparison my friend and you know it.
hmmm....when you put it like that.......seems like You...PetreTG...are alot smarter than the 27 states that voted for Obama and the 200+ Superdelegates that are supporting him...compared with the ZERO states that Ron Paul won.

You being so smart, like I said before, you're wasting your talents arguing with me on this message board, you should be running for President with TFK as your running mate and Atomicdogg as your Secretary of State. :lol:

atomicdOGg34
03-14-2008, 05:27 PM
again this fails the hypocrisy test

phonetap
03-14-2008, 05:44 PM
BUSH comes to mind ... :laughing:

God ... how easy can you possibly make it ? :lol:

bush is too easy...any moron can attack bush. the fact of the matter is you weren't this anti-bush until he fucked up half a dozen times. with obama (and unlike mccain and clinton) you are manufacturing reasons to hate the guy...you cannot dance around that. you haven't been this obsessive since the 9/11 debates.

atomicdOGg34
03-14-2008, 05:44 PM
o cares how much of the overall population african americans make

its how big of a voting block they are that matters

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 06:02 PM
hmmm....when you put it like that.......seems like You...PetreTG...are alot smarter than the 27 states that voted for Obama and the 200+ Superdelegates that are supporting him...compared with the ZERO states that Ron Paul won.

You being so smart, like I said before, you're wasting your talents arguing with me on this message board, you should be running for President with TFK as your running mate and Atomicdogg as your Secretary of State. :lol:

This is true ... :clap:

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 06:08 PM
bush is too easy...any moron can attack bush. the fact of the matter is you weren't this anti-bush until he fucked up half a dozen times. with obama (and unlike mccain and clinton) you are manufacturing reasons to hate the guy...you cannot dance around that. you haven't been this obsessive since the 9/11 debates.
Trust me Ptapout , if it wasn't for the fact that Hillary was an Obvious evil whom I already bashed last year and who seems to be far too obvious a bad choice by just about everyone , she'd be getting the fine toothed comb too.

McCain , I'm praying simply goes insane before election time or breaks a hip or something and has to drop out leaving the only smart choice RON PAUL standing there to take up the fight.

Were Gore to have run I'd have bashed him all the way to the global warming summit in Kyoto Japan for the fraud that he is. He was smart enough to know better than to run .

Obama is the one under the microscope and I'm sorry to say , but a close look at him aint to pretty.

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 06:11 PM
again this fails the hypocrisy test

Yep ... but we're supposed to use different guidelines with anyone but whites ? :doh:

SO SORRY , this is for the highest office in the land , and even though it would seem any buffoon can win the job with the right connections and enough money , they still get put under the looking glass by anyone smart enough to not allow the same mistakes to happen over and over again.

Obama is a used car salesman with absolutely ZERO qualifications to be president , a lot of baggage and conflicts of interest.

atomicdOGg34
03-14-2008, 06:16 PM
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2007/03/22/obama_defends_votes_in_favor_of_iraq_funding/

:lol:

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 06:17 PM
Obama , you got some esplainin' to do ...


http://www.greatexpectations07.com/files/image/cu1satullo22a.JPG

:nono:


Sunday, February 24, 2008

Obama Had A Pattern Of Contacts With Weathermen Terrorists (http://sayanythingblog.com/entry/obama_had_a_pattern_of_contacts_with_weathermen_te rrorists/)

February 24, 2008 at 09:40 am
<!-- class="comment-link" -->
<!-- class="post-meta" --> Many have tried to dismiss Barack Obama’s connections to far-left Weathermen terrorists Willliam Ayres and Bernadine Dohrn as saying that it was a one-time meeting which took place more than a decade ago. But it turns out that it was more than one time, and has happened a lot more recently than 1995 (http://hotair.com/archives/2008/02/24/obamessiah-and-the-weathermen-more-recent-sightings/).
Since then some Hot Air commenters pointed me toward this 2002 conference website (http://www.uic.edu/classes/las/las400/conferencealt.htm), where Dohrn spoke and Ayres and Obama spoke on the same panel–”Intellectuals in Times of Crisis”.


There’s more: Rezkowatch (http://rezkowatch.blogspot.com/2008/02/rezkowatch-factchecker-weatherman-bill_14.html) links to this item (http://www.campus-watch.org/article/id/1590) to claim that Obama, Ayres and Dohrn all gave testimonials at a farewell dinner for Rashid Khalidi in 2005, although the exact date of the dinner isn’t clear from the article.


Now speaking on the same panel doesn’t mean Obama is sympathetic to their goals. It does suggest that there was no break with Ayres after the 1995 visits. Obama hasn’t distanced himself from these domestic terrorists, even after terrorism against the United States became a little…harder to ignore after September 11th, 2001. As did William Ayres himself, who had the laughably ill luck to spout off about how proud he was of his terrorism in an interview with the New York Times–an interview that ran in their September 11, 2001 edition (http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9F02E1DE1438F932A2575AC0A9679C8B 63&scp=1&sq=%93I+don%27t+regret+setting+bombs%3B+I+feel+we+ didn%27t+do+enough%2C%94&st=nyt).


Individually, these events aren’t much. Appearing on a panel with creepy people doesn’t mean you’re a creep. But taken together, these add up to a pattern of what is at best frightening tone-deafness toward terrorism, and a blithe ignorance of the evil and chaos these radicals represent.
I don’t think Obama gets to shrug this one off. Anyone involved in politics, particularly in the Chicago area, knows who William Ayres and Bernadette Dohrn are and agreeing to appear with them at events is a tacit endorsement of their radical politics. A politician would not appear in public with a notorious anti-Semite and holocaust denier like David Duke, so why would it be any better to appear in public with people who feel that bombs and violence are a proper form of political discourse?


There’s no excuse for this. Either Obama was unbelievably naive as to who these people are or he knew who they are and didn’t care.


Neither option looks good for Obama who himself is no mainstream politician but rather the farthest left of all US Senators (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fnj.nationaljournal.com%2Fvoterati ngs%2F&ei=o_29R4TxM4aMpwSqx_TgDQ&usg=AFQjCNEIN9m0y_Xkwi38P6hiEypsWk2how&sig2=_9zS5rcK_dMWrDXQLakndA).

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 06:20 PM
And wha' about this ???
http://www.greatexpectations07.com/files/image/cu1satullo22a.JPG

:nono:

Obama mentor identified as communist

Frank Marshall Davis 'discussed American imperialism, colonialism, exploitation'
Posted: February 19, 2008
9:27 pm Eastern

© 2008 WorldNetDaily

The mysterious "Frank" cited as a friend and adviser by Democratic president contender Barack Obama while he was growing up in Hawaii has been identified as Frank Marshall Davis, a member of the old Moscow-controlled Communist Party USA.

The identification comes from Cliff Kincaid in his column, "Obama's Communist Mentor," which was made available on the Accuracy in Media website.

"Let's challenge the liberal media to report on this," he wrote in his column. "Will they have the honesty and integrity to do so?"

Kincaid, who earlier reported on Obama's pending plan to ship $845 billion overseas to battle "global poverty" as evidence of his socialist leanings, said the newly revealed connection is even more worrisome.


"Obama's communist connection adds to mounting public concern about a candidate who has come out of virtually nowhere, with a brief U.S. Senate legislative record, to become the Democratic Party frontrunner for the U.S. presidency," he wrote.

In Obama's book, "Dreams From My Father," he repeatedly refers to his friend and adviser as "Frank."

"The reason is apparent: Davis was a known communist who belonged to a party subservient to the Soviet Union. In fact, the 1951 report of the Commission on Subversive Activities to the Legislature of the Territory of Hawaii identified him as a CPUSA member. What's more, anti-communist congressional committees, including the House Un-American Activities Committee (HUAC), accused Davis of involvement in several Communist front organizations," Kincaid said.

Kincaid noted Obama has admitted attending "social conferences" and seeing Marxist literature. "But he ridicules the charge of being a 'hard-core academic Marxist,' which was made by his colorful and outspoken 2004 U.S. Senate opponent, Republican Alan Keyes."

He described the link as "ominous."

"Decades ago, the CPUSA had tens of thousands of members, some of them covert agents who had penetrated the U.S. government. It received secret subsidies from the old Soviet Union," Kincaid wrote.

He noted even Obama describes "Frank" has having "some modest notoriety once."

Kincaid notes that a history professor in Houston reported that Davis "befriended" a family whose son was named Barack Obama, "who retracing the steps of Davis eventually decamped to Chicago."

"It was in Chicago that Obama became a 'community organizer' and came into contact with more far-left political forces, including the Democratic Socialists of America…," Kincaid wrote. "The SDS laid siege to college campuses across America in the 1960s, mostly in order to protest the Vietnam War, and spawned the terrorist Weather Underground organization."

He also reported Kathryn Takara, a professor of Interdisciplinary Studies at the University of Hawaii at Manoa, confirmed that Davis is the "Frank" in Obama's book.

She did her dissertation on Davis, and wrote that he brought, "an acute sense of race relations and class struggle throughout America and the world" and that he openly discussed subjects such as American imperialism, colonialism and exploitation, according to AIM.

Obama's campaign also, for the third straight day, declined to respond to WND requests for comment on the report of a Minnesota man who alleges he shared cocaine with Obama when Obama was a state lawmaker in Illinois.

WND has reported on claims made by Larry Sinclair, who claims he took cocaine in 1999 with Obama, and participated in homosexual acts with him.

Sinclair said his story was ignored by the news media, so he made his case last month in a YouTube video, which has now been viewed about 350,000 times.

When it still was ignored, Sinclair said, he filled a lawsuit in Minnesota District Court, alleging threats and intimidation by Obama's staff.

:lol:

PetreTG
03-14-2008, 06:26 PM
http://jasonsteckel.net/wp-content/images/skeletonsincloset.jpg

Godfather
03-15-2008, 12:08 AM
as if you have any clue what the primary numbers were...your point is moot.Whether i do or dont, still doesnt change the fact that the numbers you speak of are for the general election and not the primaries. I have no say either way in this little discussion. Dont go attacking me for clarifying the facts.

Rock on
03-15-2008, 01:40 PM
Talk about bigoted phobia of Obama.
<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p> </o:p>
Remains to be seen what this incessant and hysterical campaign of calumny against Obama would eventually do to his chances of becoming C-in-C.

Haymaker
03-15-2008, 02:54 PM
PetreTG, you're obsessive man. If he's not a rightwinger, he's a communist, if not, he's a terrorist, if not, he's a black supremacist. Let it go. I wanted Paul to win too, but let's face it, he didn't had the character to impress americans and win their vote. And by character I mean, the personality and the will to dare confront his opponents with courage and attitude. The pic in your sig is an obsessive one. Let the man fuck a goat if wants to, it's his life.

bigdawg
03-15-2008, 02:58 PM
I do not agree with everything that the pastor was saying but I do agree with some of his preachings. I mean when the statistics show that 1 out of 9 black males from the ages of 20-34 is in prison something is wrong. Now I'm not blaming society cause believe me we gotta take responsibility for our actions. But I honestly believe that this is modern day slavery. What better way to keep one race down then to incarcerate them. Especially since throughout US history that's been the case.

Now about the relationships with those folk. Hell eveyone got friends and family especially if you are black that is doing shit that they weren't supposed to do or possibly doing shit right now that they aren't supposed to be doing. Hell isn't Bush friends with the Bin Laden Family? I'll Holla 5000

Haymaker
03-15-2008, 03:16 PM
I do not agree with everything that the pastor was saying but I do agree with some of his preachings. I mean when the statistics show that 1 out of 9 black males from the ages of 20-34 is in prison something is wrong. Now I'm not blaming society cause believe me we gotta take responsibility for our actions. But I honestly believe that this is modern day slavery. What better way to keep one race down then to incarcerate them. Especially since throughout US history that's been the case.

Now about the relationships with those folk. Hell eveyone got friends and family especially if you are black that is doing shit that they weren't supposed to do or possibly doing shit right now that they aren't supposed to be doing. Hell isn't Bush friends with the Bin Laden Family? I'll Holla 5000

Also, I agree with him about the 9/11 remarks. The US has brought terrorism on itself by it's foreign actions. Even Ron Paul said the same thing and PetreTG can't agree with the pastor.

Nobleart
03-15-2008, 03:29 PM
And wha' about this ???
http://www.greatexpectations07.com/files/image/cu1satullo22a.JPG

:nono:

Obama mentor identified as communist

Frank Marshall Davis 'discussed American imperialism, colonialism, exploitation'
Posted: February 19, 2008
9:27 pm Eastern

© 2008 WorldNetDaily


WND has reported on claims made by Larry Sinclair, who claims he took cocaine in 1999 with Obama, and participated in homosexual acts with him.

Sinclair said his story was ignored by the news media, so he made his case last month in a YouTube video, which has now been viewed about 350,000 times.

When it still was ignored, Sinclair said, he filled a lawsuit in Minnesota District Court, alleging threats and intimidation by Obama's staff.

:lol:



:lol::laughing::lol:

What a bang up reporting job and witness this is. He files a lawsuit against Obama's staff because he is being "ignored" on YouTube.

:lol: Precious!!!

Tyler Durden
03-15-2008, 03:37 PM
So you know how much that guy has influenced obama? Please tell us how much, and how you know this. :popcorn:

<object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/70nMudv0ADY&hl=en"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/70nMudv0ADY&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>


:popcorn:

TFK
03-15-2008, 05:35 PM
I do not agree with everything that the pastor was saying but I do agree with some of his preachings. I mean when the statistics show that 1 out of 9 black males from the ages of 20-34 is in prison something is wrong. Now I'm not blaming society cause believe me we gotta take responsibility for our actions. But I honestly believe that this is modern day slavery. What better way to keep one race down then to incarcerate them. Especially since throughout US history that's been the case.

Now about the relationships with those folk. Hell eveyone got friends and family especially if you are black that is doing shit that they weren't supposed to do or possibly doing shit right now that they aren't supposed to be doing. Hell isn't Bush friends with the Bin Laden Family? I'll Holla 5000


Slavery? It's not like the white man is going around rounding up random black folk and throwing them in jail for being black. If they're in prison, it's because they commited a crime.

It's garbage like what that preacher was spewing that poisons the minds of his followers. How is blaming the white man 'inspiring'? Why not preach about taking responsibility for yourself and working hard to achieve your goals?

And I had to laugh when he brought up the whole 'cab drivers won't pick up black passengers' bit. Hell, the overwhelming majority of cabs I've been in have been driven by Africans or Middle Easterners. So it's not the white man's fault they can't get a ride.

It's a shame. I guess why work hard and take responsibility for yourself, when it's so much easier just to blame others for your situation.


TFK

Tyler Durden
03-15-2008, 06:48 PM
Slavery? It's not like the white man is going around rounding up random black folk and throwing them in jail for being black. If they're in prison, it's because they commited a crime.

It's garbage like what that preacher was spewing that poisons the minds of his followers. How is blaming the white man 'inspiring'? Why not preach about taking responsibility for yourself and working hard to achieve your goals?

And I had to laugh when he brought up the whole 'cab drivers won't pick up black passengers' bit. Hell, the overwhelming majority of cabs I've been in have been driven by Africans or Middle Easterners. So it's not the white man's fault they can't get a ride.

It's a shame. I guess why work hard and take responsibility for yourself, when it's so much easier just to blame others for your situation.


TFK

Good post :bears:

FourHooks
03-15-2008, 06:50 PM
I aint reading this whole fucking thread, but who gives a shit what religon he is??? So what if he is muslim.....this whole country is so rediculously crazy christian that he'll never be able to instill any muslim beliefs into our society anyways....dont see what all the fuss is about....fuck religon....only atheists and agnostics should be allowed in public office anyways

Rabid Kimba
03-15-2008, 06:54 PM
I aint reading this whole fucking thread, but who gives a shit what religon he is??? So what if he is muslim.....this whole country is so rediculously crazy christian that he'll never be able to instill any muslim beliefs into our society anyways....dont see what all the fuss is about....fuck religon....only atheists and agnostics should be allowed in public office anyways

Beautiful post, right on the money. I'm very proud of you.

:bears: :bears: :bears:

Tyler Durden
03-15-2008, 07:03 PM
I aint reading this whole fucking thread, but who gives a shit what religon he is??? So what if he is muslim.....this whole country is so rediculously crazy christian that he'll never be able to instill any muslim beliefs into our society anyways....dont see what all the fuss is about....fuck religon....only atheists and agnostics should be allowed in public office anyways

I use it as an excuse to upset the Christian folk, because we know how narrow minded they are :clap:

Rock on
03-16-2008, 10:52 AM
Daring To Hope: Candidate Poses Stark Turn For Perception Of Race In America


<DL class=byline>By MELANYE T. PRICE <DD>March 16, 2008 </DD></DL>Media pundits and supporters claim Barack Obama (http://www.courant.com/topic/politics/barack-obama-PEPLT007408.topic) is at his best when viewed in person, so I went to the recent Obama rally at the XL Center (http://www.courant.com/topic/arts-culture/xl-center-hpu18.topic) in Hartford to see for myself. Ultimately, I came away convinced that Obama actually could succeed. I found myself both embracing and eschewing the conflicting meanings of an Obama presidency.

The most audaciously hopeful aspect of an Obama rally has to be the attendees, who represent every demographic imaginable. Waiting with me were professors, white suburban mothers, Obama gear-clad teenagers, an older African American couple, and a group of young black and Latino men.

As we waited with thousands, we became unlikely allies, holding places for bathroom breaks, scouting the best entrance and seats and discussing Obama's appeal. Were we a "grand coalition for change" as Obama suggested? Moreover, could he translate our differing versions of change into coherent policies?




http://www.courant.com/news/opinion/editorials/hc-commentaryprice0316.artmar16,0,1670869.story

PetreTG
03-16-2008, 11:28 AM
This sunday at church , I'm gonna let my spiritual leader know he's causing trouble for my political campaign. :nono:
================================================== =====

Obama Decries Racial Rhetoric
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Mar 16, 5:11 AM (ET)

By TOM RAUM <table align="right" border="0" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" width="210"><tbody><tr><td align="center"><table border="1" bordercolor="#cbcbcd" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" width="150"><tbody><tr><td><table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr align="center"><td>http://ak.imgfarm.com/images/ap/thumbnails//Obama_2008.sff_INAB107_20080315145543.jpg (http://apnews.myway.com/image/20080315/Obama_2008.sff_INAB107_20080315145543.html?date=20 080316&docid=D8VEE9OO0)</td></tr><tr><td>(AP) Democratic presidential hopeful Sen. Barack Obama D-Ill., speaks at a town hall meeting at...
Full Image (http://apnews.myway.com/image/20080315/Obama_2008.sff_INAB107_20080315145543.html?date=20 080316&docid=D8VEE9OO0)</td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr><tr><td width="100%"> <script> if (NAV_NS&&NAV_VER<6) document.write("
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</td></tr></table></td></tr></table>
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</td></tr></tbody></table> PLAINFIELD, Ind. (AP) - Sen. Barack Obama on Saturday decried "the forces of division" over race that he said are intruding into the Democratic presidential nomination contest.
"We have to come together," he told a town-hall meeting at a high school.
He cited videos of inflammatory sermons given by his pastor that are now being used as political ammunition against him - remarks that Obama has denounced.
"If all I knew were those statements I saw on television, I would be shocked," Obama said.
<table align="left" border="0" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" width="210"><tbody><tr><td align="center"><table border="1" bordercolor="#cbcbcd" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" width="150"><tbody><tr><td><table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr align="center"><td>http://ak.imgfarm.com/images/ap/thumbnails//Obama_2008.sff_INAB106_20080315145523.jpg (http://apnews.myway.com/image/20080315/Obama_2008.sff_INAB106_20080315145523.html?date=20 080316&docid=D8VEE9OO0)</td></tr><tr><td>(AP) Democratic presidential hopeful Sen. Barack Obama D-Ill., speaks at a town hall meeting at...
Full Image (http://apnews.myway.com/image/20080315/Obama_2008.sff_INAB106_20080315145523.html?date=20 080316&docid=D8VEE9OO0)</td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table>Obama suggested that more and more is being made of racial divisions as his contest with Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton heats up.
"I noticed over the last several weeks that the forces of division have started to raise their ugly heads again. And I'm not here to cast blame or point fingers because everybody, you know, senses that there's been this shift," Obama said.
"It reminds me: We've got a tragic history when it comes to race in this country. We've got a lot of pent-up anger and bitterness and misunderstanding. ... This country wants to move beyond these kinds of things."
The Illinois senator's comments came a day after he denounced statements in videos appearing on television and on the Internet of sermons by the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, pastor of the Chicago church Obama joined nearly 20 years ago.
"Most recently, you heard some statements from my former pastor that were incendiary and that I completely reject, although I knew him and know him as somebody in my church who talked to me about Jesus and family and friendships."
<table align="right" border="0" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" width="210"><tbody><tr><td align="center"><table border="1" bordercolor="#cbcbcd" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" width="150"><tbody><tr><td><table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr align="center"><td>http://ak.imgfarm.com/images/ap/thumbnails//Obama_2008.sff_INAB104_20080315145629.jpg (http://apnews.myway.com/image/20080315/Obama_2008.sff_INAB104_20080315145629.html?date=20 080316&docid=D8VEE9OO0)</td></tr><tr><td>(AP) Democratic presidential hopeful Sen. Barack Obama D-Ill., walks through the door to enter a town...
Full Image (http://apnews.myway.com/image/20080315/Obama_2008.sff_INAB104_20080315145629.html?date=20 080316&docid=D8VEE9OO0)</td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table>Obama said that pointing out racial differences only makes it harder to "deliver on the big issues we face in this country," which he said include health care, the slumping economy, terrorism and caring better for veterans.
Obama, whose mother's family was from Kansas and his father from Kenya, said he was speaking "as someone who has little pieces of America all in me."
He said schools should do a better job of teaching all students African-American history "because that's part of American history," as well as women's struggle for equality, the history of unions, the role of Hispanics in U.S. and other matters that he suggested aren't given enough attention.
"I want us to have a broad-based history" taught in schools, he said, even including more on "the Holocaust as well as other issues of oppression" around the world.
Obama spoke in the gymnasium of Plainfield High School, near Indianapolis, as he directed his political attention at states beyond the critical April 22 Pennsylvania primary.
"We are going to be campaigning actively in Indiana," Obama said to cheers. Indiana and North Carolina have primaries on May 6, two weeks after Pennsylvania.

Caligula II
03-16-2008, 12:03 PM
A line in a recent rap I wrote:

"There are three things that stop me from voting Obama,
He's black, he's a fag, and his dad was Osama"

I defintely will vote for him if he wins the nomination though. It's just a line in a song. :dunno:

PetreTG
03-16-2008, 12:05 PM
Yes , as Sly said "Obama will bring about racial harmony in the USA" .... Sure he will. :doh:


And yet another associate chosen by Obama that is an obvious conflict of interest.

=======================================


A Presidet Barack Obama would force American taxpayers to compensate "victims of slavery"


2007-04-04 10:06:55 -Obama (http://www.pr-inside.com/print85048.htm#) quietly supports reparations for slavery; at least that is what his closest supporters believe

CONTRARIAN COMMENTARY FOR APRIL 4, 2007

BARACK OBAMA: IS AMERICA READY FOR REPARATIONS?

OBAMA'S SUPPORTERS SEE REPARATIONS IN THEIR FUTURE IF BARRY O IS ELECTED

READY TO PAY? OBAMA'S THE WAY

(CHICAGO)(April 4, 2007) Is America ready to pay reparations for slavery? What is that you say, "Doesn't Senator Barack Obama oppose reparations for slavery?" Well, no. He doesn't.

In fact the reparations crowd in Washington and Chicago is salivating at the prospect Obama might stumble into the White House and put them on track for a reparations gravy train for slavery which took place centuries ago.

To tackle the topic, first, a simple question: is Obama opposed to reparations? Indeed, the question is not so simple. Nothing is ever simple and straightforward where Barry Obama and words come together. Obama's pirouettes on the question of reparations would enchant any balletomane; his position always depends on who is asking and who is listening. And who is watching.

Prior to his election to the U.S. Senate in 2004 Obama opposed reparations for slavery. After his election, Obama subtly changed his view, stating he was against "just signing over checks to African-Americans," leaving open the possibility of other forms of reparations would be acceptable to him (Chicago Tribune 11/14/2004).

Second, whom does Barry O "hang" with? Well, Obama hangs with the reparations crowd. Now guilt by association is certainly unfair. But if you hang with the reparations crowd, they must see something in you they like. Indeed they do. U. S. Representative John Conyers, Chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, is reportedly waiting for Obama to be elected so Conyers can rush a reparations law through Congress. (The Hill, 3/13/ 2007) Hmmm. Does Conyers know something we don't?

Finally, the most telling indication that Obama has a secret addiction (http://www.pr-inside.com/print85048.htm#)to reparations is reflected in those who support him and those whom he supports: the most notorious race-baiter on the Chicago City Council, Alderwoman Dorothy Tillman.

Haven't heard of Dorothy Tillman? You better learn about Obama's #1 supporter. And fast. You really should know who she is. Tillman has almost single-handedly made a joke of the City of Chicago in the public finance industry over her preoccupation with slavery and reparations.

Tillman supports Obama and Obama supports Tillman.

Last week Obama endorsed Tillman for reelection. Tillman was forced into a runoff after her opponents failed to agree on a single candidate to oppose her. Tillman was an early supporter of Obama's in his rise to prominence over the past decade.

And Tillman is a disgrace. Her favorite pastime is abusing banks and institutions (http://www.pr-inside.com/print85048.htm#) that want to do business with the City of Chicago. A regular feature of council proceedings is Tillman flaying banks for "owning slaves" at some remote point in history over 150 years ago.

Using a 2002 "Slavery Era Disclosure Ordinance" that she authored, Tillman has accused Bank of America of having a predecessor bank that made "leg irons for slaves." Wachovia, J.P. Morgan Chase, LaSalle Bank, Lehman Brothers, American General and Nationwide Life Insurance were all brought before Tillman's mast and whipped for their ties to slavery, however remote, over 150 years ago.

Indeed, Tillman has been quoted as saying her goal is to "repair the damage of 400 years" of slavery. "America owes us," Tillman demands (Sun-Times 3/26/2007).

And yes, Obama has endorsed this carnival-style extortionist for reelection. So much for the audacity of Obama, so much for the "smallness" of politics in Chicago.

Tillman abuses and opposes anyone who thinks that slavery is not a major issue any more. When the City wanted to refinance $800 million debt (http://www.pr-inside.com/print85048.htm#), Tillman was there claiming slavery should be an issue. Last fall, the City tried to lease parking garages for over a half billion dollars: the deal hit a "slavery speed bump." Tillman filed suit because her slavery ordinance was brushed aside (Sun-Times 12/1/2006). "The whole world is watching us just disregard this law for black people'We're totally disrespected as a people...," (Sun-Times 10/31/06). On and on it goes. Sounds like the race card to me.

Tillman accused Morgan Stanley of "getting rich from investments (http://www.pr-inside.com/print85048.htm#) and profits in slavery," (Chicago Tribune, 10/30/ 2006). Morgan Stanley was formed in 1935.

[Full disclosure: My maternal ancestors arrived in the United States in the Twentieth Century. Unlike Obama's forebears, my grandparents (http://www.pr-inside.com/print85048.htm#) had nothing to do with slavery. Why should I pay for the earlier sins of others? Why should anyone pay for events that took place in history?]

When Obama's critics attack him for the sermons of his pastor (http://www.pr-inside.com/print85048.htm#) they are going too far, in my opinion. I am not responsible for what my minister says. Preachers get a lot of leeway in the pulpit.

But when a public official files a frivolous lawsuit against a half-billion dollar public finance deal, claiming that Blacks are being disrespected because of slavery, and Obama goes on to endorse that kind of nonsense, Obama should be charged with endorsing the antics of the reparations gang.

When confronted with the claims of some of his more controversial supporters President Reagan used to say, "They endorsed me; I didn't endorse them."

In the case of Barry Obama and Dorothy Tillman, he has endorsed her and her unseemly reparations crusade for slavery.

Only Obama doesn't want his national audience to know it. I seriously doubt that many of the tens of thousands of people who have succumbed to Obama's pleas for "hope" realize he "hopes" to force them to pay tax dollars to provide some form of compensation (http://www.pr-inside.com/print85048.htm#) to people who weren't alive from people who weren't alive, all for the evils of slavery. They have no idea who Dorothy Tillman is, or what she stands for, or the damage she continues to do to taxpayers (http://www.pr-inside.com/print85048.htm#) in Chicago. All in the name of slavery.

And yet ignorant suckers keep on giving, not knowing who Obama is and what he wants to accomplish if he should end up in the Oval office.

Psst. Ready to pay reparations for slavery? Obama's your man.

He just doesn't want you to know. Yet.

He's too busy working to reelect Dorothy Tillman in two weeks.

Pass it on.

TFK
03-16-2008, 12:18 PM
That last one is a bit of a stretch, Petre.

I think making a connection between Obama supporting some nutjob local politician, and equating that with Obama working to make reparations a reailty is very weak. Obama's got enough negative aspects to him to need something as stupid as this attack.

Besides, reperations for slavery is a ridiculous and completely unrealistic idea. My family didn't arrive in this country until long after slavery was over. I never owned a slave, never met a slave, never met anyone who owned a slave, etc, etc.

Hell, if you want to use the whole 'White people owned slaves, so they owe the blacks' argument, I present this counter argument: 'White people freed the slaves, so the blacks owe us.'

Let me know when my check is in the mail.


TFK

PetreTG
03-16-2008, 12:46 PM
I think anyone Obama decides to support is a check on Obama's charachter and beliefs. Obviously you do not support someone whom you do not believe in or who's stances you do not support.

Tillman's stances in chicago and abroad are legendary in their racial charge.

Obama is showing a pattern here.

Hell People want to give Paul a hard time for a donation made to him .... Obama has publicly supported this woman.

Do a little search on Obama and Tillman ... it's interesting stuff.

Here I'll start everyone off ...
-------------------------------
http://media.suntimes.com/images/cds/cst_logo_353_2.gif (http://www.suntimes.com/)
(http://www.suntimes.com/)

Will 3rd Ward politics affect Obama's presidential race?

<!-- Article Publsih Date -->
March 23, 2007
<!-- Article By Line --> BY RICH MILLER
<!-- Article's First Paragraph --><!-- BlogBurst ContentStart --><!--dropstart--> Fresh, independent-minded candidates, most helped by labor unions, forced 10 Machine aldermen into runoff elections this year. But now the "Empire" is striking back, and liberal icon Barack Obama is helping the Old Guard in at least one of those races.<!--dropend--> Obama is set to endorse the always controversial 3rd Ward Ald. Dorothy Tillman in her runoff against hard-charging independent Pat Dowell. Obama isn't alone. Almost every black political, religious and civil rights leader in the city is lending support to Tillman, who scored just 43 percent in the first round of voting, finishing a mere 400 votes ahead of Dowell.
About the only major political figure not backing Tillman right now is U.S. Rep. Jesse Jackson Jr., who just helped elect his wife, Sandi, to the City Council. Jackson said this week he plans to put at least 150 foot soldiers into the 3rd Ward come Election Day, but he tried to downplay the fact that this is the first time he and Obama have ever opposed each other in a local race.
To say Dowell's supporters are confident of victory would be an understatement. They have polling showing her leading Tillman by over 20 points -- and a whole lot more after voters are fed additional information.
Her blatant nepotism at the taxpayer-bankrolled Harold Washington Cultural Center (one daughter is the executive director, another is the "education coordinator" and a son is a former board member of a not-for-profit Tillman founded to oversee the facility) and Tillman's vote to give herself a pay raise are just two of the many poll questions that drive the alderman's support into the ground.
Tillman has redeveloped her once-destitute ward, an almost Herculean, decade-long task. She has always insisted on using African-American contractors, architects, etc., believing the revitalization of a black neighborhood ought to benefit black business people. Bronzeville's storied 43rd Street is springing back to life with a new entertainment district. Lots of new, more upscale people have moved in, but the pace of change has not kept up with high expectations. Also, Tillman's once-solid base among the ward's poorest residents has evaporated as those loyal voters were forced out by urban renewal.
Tillman's friends promise a hard-fought campaign, but even they realize that times have changed. Machine stalwart Bill Beavers found that out the hard way this month when he tried to install his daughter Darcel in his former City Council seat. Beavers thought his aging street organization and the old-style tactics that had served him so well over the years would carry the day. But Sandi Jackson used modern campaign techniques, battle-hardened foot soldiers and tons of well-produced direct mail to bury Ms. Beavers by more than 23 points.
A lot of the old-timers on the City Council still seem to believe fervently in the long-dead myth of their organizations' invulnerability. That hubris contributed to several first round setbacks, including downtown Ald. Burt Natarus' outright loss and 32nd Ward Ald. Ted Matlak's forced runoff. Tillman's more realistic friends are trying hard to convince the alderman's longtime advisers that she has to change course right now if she hopes to survive.
Bill Beavers is helping Tillman, and that's one reason Jackson has jumped into the race. Two of Jackson's oldest political nemeses, Bill and Bob Shaw, are also backing Tillman, providing even more incentive.
On the other side of the coin, Mayor Daley's organization is lending Tillman a hand, at least partly because Daley wants to make sure Jackson's influence doesn't spread any further than it already has.
Jackson says he understands why Sen. Obama would back Tillman. The alderman was one of Obama's earliest supporters in his U.S. Senate bid. But others are wondering how Obama's decision to back such a die-hard proponent of slavery reparations will play in Iowa and New Hampshire. They may have a point.

PetreTG
03-16-2008, 12:47 PM
Chicago Connections: Barack Obama, Dorothy Tillman and Tony Rezko

Mon Mar 03, 2008 at 01:42:28 PM
http://blogs.houstonpress.com/houstoned/mugshotdorothytillman.jpg

First, in December 2006, controversial Chicago alderwoman Dorothy Tillman was exposed by a community newspaper (http://www.hpherald.com/tillmanstory_12_13_27_07.pdf) for using a taxpayer-funded development project to steer contracts to family and friends and possibly cheat the IRS. Then, in April 2007 – despite being endorsed by Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama (http://www.houstonpress.com/2008-02-28/news/barack-obama-screamed-at-me/)– Tillman was booted from office after representing the historic black ward for more than two decades. Now, the 60-year-old Tillman has landed herself in jail.

Early yesterday morning, Tillman was arrested in her native Montgomery, Alabama and charged with criminal trespassing (http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-tillman-arrest-03-both_mar03,0,4647641.story) for tussling with local hospital administrators. Tillman says she was the victim of excessive force. She smiles in the mug shot photo – a rare picture in which she is without one of her trademark, wide-brimmed hats. “They knocked my hat off,” Tillman, referring to police, told the Chicago Tribune. “One of them put his knees on my spine and threatened to Taser me.”


Tillman, whose ward included the largest concentration of vacant lots in Chicago, has long been known for shady dealings and bombastic behavior, including once pulling out a gun and waving it around at a city council meeting. Obama’s support of Tillman angered many in his hometown but did not receive national attention. Media stories of Tillman’s arrest do not even mention Obama. But the same cannot be said for Tony Rezko, the indicted real-estate magnate and political donor linked to Obama and many other Illinois politicians. Jury selection for Rezko’s trial begins today (http://www.suntimes.com/news/metro/rezko/822363,CST-NWS-rezko03.article). –Todd Spivak

PetreTG
03-16-2008, 12:49 PM
chicagotribune.com

PART 8 SIDEBAR

Critics: Obama endorsements counter calls for clean government

By David Jackson and John McCormick
June 12, 2007


<noscript>http://ad.doubleclick.net/ad/trb.chicagotribune/news/politics;ptype=ps;slug=chi-obama_endorse_12jun12;rg=ur;ref=chicagotribunecom; pos=1;dcopt=ist;sz=300x250;tile=1;ord=18001375? (http://ad.doubleclick.net/jump/trb.chicagotribune/news/politics;ptype=ps;slug=chi-obama_endorse_12jun12;rg=ur;ref=chicagotribunecom; pos=1;sz=300x250;tile=1;ord=18001375?)</noscript>
There was little controversy earlier this year when Sen. Barack Obama endorsed Mayor Richard Daley over two black opponents for a sixth term, lending his star power to an inevitable rout.

But Obama's record of local endorsements -- one measure of how he has used his nascent political clout -- has drawn criticism from those who say it reflects his deference to Chicago's established political order and runs counter to his public calls for clean government.

In the 2006 Democratic primary, for example, Obama endorsed first-time candidate Alexi Giannoulias for state treasurer despite reports about loans Giannoulias' family-owned Broadway Bank made to crime figures. Records show Giannoulias and his family had given more than $10,000 to Obama's campaign, which banked at Broadway.

Obama endorsed former Ald. Dorothy Tillman (3rd), calling her "a very early supporter of my campaign." Tillman was then under fire for her stewardship of the scandal-plagued Harold Washington Cultural Center, where contracts benefited members of her family.

Obama rejected the notion that such endorsements conflict with his promotion of ethics reform in government.

"I have been very proud of my track record as a state legislator and as a U.S. senator in terms of maintaining highly ethical behavior throughout my public life," he said in a recent interview. "Dorothy Tillman and Alexi Giannoulias were strong supporters of mine. There were no allegations that they had done anything illegal. And it was not a conflict for me to show my support for them."

Obama supported the re-election of Gov. Rod Blagojevich, whose administration is embroiled in corruption probes.

And during the race for Cook County Board president, Obama predictably endorsed Todd Stroger over a Republican. But he was criticized for calling Stroger "a good progressive" despite allegations of job-rigging to favor members of Stroger's 8th Ward organization.

Such moves detract from Obama's political independence, according to observers such as James Shapiro, state chairman for the Independent Voters of Illinois-Independent Precinct Organization.

"I don't think these are principled endorsements, but rather are of political expedience," he said. "It may be understandable, but it's not justifiable."

Even so, many presidential voters may not care.

"Barack Obama is a political animal. That means supporting the people you went to the dance with," said Loyola University political science professor Alan Gitelson. "The bottom line is, I don't think it will have any impact one way or the other."

Copyright © 2008, Chicago Tribune (http://www.chicagotribune.com/)

Rock on
03-16-2008, 01:07 PM
So says Rev J Wright.

But when u look at the reasons for this speech, I couldn't agree more with this eloquent, intellectual pastor. :lol:

Nothing wrong with God (if he bloody well exist) damning a country which has brought profund injustice to its citizens and citizens of the world. :dunno:.

Should God bless a country for such evil? Of course NOT, DAMN IT I SAY!!!

Wright was so right on this occassion.

In fact, save for a few comments, Wright is a courageous man who is usually right on the money, calls it like it is and should be celebrated.

We need more Wrights in this world to attack the ills of this world in other injustice ridden nations across the globe.

Kudos to Rev Wright :bears: :blobbox:

Nobleart
03-16-2008, 01:11 PM
:lol:


Shit stirrer. :stir:

PetreTG
03-16-2008, 01:57 PM
So says Rev J Wright.

But when u look at the reasons for this speech, I couldn't agree more with this eloquent, intellectual pastor. :lol:

Nothing wrong with God (if he bloody well exist) damning a country which has brought profund injustice to its citizens and citizens of the world. :dunno:.

Should God bless a country for such evil? Of course NOT, DAMN IT I SAY!!!

Wright was so right on this occassion.

In fact, save for a few comments, Wright is a courageous man who is usually right on the money, calls it like it is and should be celebrated.

We need more Wrights in this world to attack the ills of this world in other injustice ridden nations across the globe.

Kudos to Rev Wright :bears: :blobbox:

This is already covered in another topic ... address it there.

lb 4 lb
03-16-2008, 02:18 PM
Slavery? It's not like the white man is going around rounding up random black folk and throwing them in jail for being black. If they're in prison, it's because they commited a crime.

It's garbage like what that preacher was spewing that poisons the minds of his followers. How is blaming the white man 'inspiring'? Why not preach about taking responsibility for yourself and working hard to achieve your goals?

And I had to laugh when he brought up the whole 'cab drivers won't pick up black passengers' bit. Hell, the overwhelming majority of cabs I've been in have been driven by Africans or Middle Easterners. So it's not the white man's fault they can't get a ride.

It's a shame. I guess why work hard and take responsibility for yourself, when it's so much easier just to blame others for your situation.


TFKIt's pretty obvious blacks don't get the same treatment by the government (for one) that other races do, be it in law, banking, employment, or even housing. It says something when the government has to make laws forcing people to employ us which should broaden the scope for you. I love it when other races think it's all in our heads. Occasionally the race card gets played when it's not justified but let's not pretend their isn't a difference in the way that we're treated that is still a hangover from slavery. But that's another argument for another day. You and TD can continue to deny this for the rest of your lives and I will continue to live with it for the rest of mine.

Baron
03-16-2008, 03:01 PM
Obama doesn't really appeal to me ideologically speaking but reading all this dirty work people are doing on him, all this dirty, counter productive propaganda, all these accusations that reeks of racism or xenophobia, would make me feel like voting for him if I was american. Just because I wouldn't want to stand with the people bringing up this shit, they make me sick.

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 03:37 PM
This sunday at church , I'm gonna let my spiritual leader know he's causing trouble for my political campaign. :nono:
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Obama Decries Racial Rhetoric
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Mar 16, 5:11 AM (ET)

By TOM RAUM <TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width=210 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=middle><TABLE borderColor=#cbcbcd cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width=150 border=1><TBODY><TR><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR align=middle><TD>http://ak.imgfarm.com/images/ap/thumbnails//Obama_2008.sff_INAB107_20080315145543.jpg (http://apnews.myway.com/image/20080315/Obama_2008.sff_INAB107_20080315145543.html?date=20 080316&docid=D8VEE9OO0)</TD></TR><TR><TD>(AP) Democratic presidential hopeful Sen. Barack Obama D-Ill., speaks at a town hall meeting at...
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</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>PLAINFIELD, Ind. (AP) - Sen. Barack Obama on Saturday decried "the forces of division" over race that he said are intruding into the Democratic presidential nomination contest.
"We have to come together," he told a town-hall meeting at a high school.
He cited videos of inflammatory sermons given by his pastor that are now being used as political ammunition against him - remarks that Obama has denounced.
"If all I knew were those statements I saw on television, I would be shocked," Obama said.
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width=210 align=left border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=middle><TABLE borderColor=#cbcbcd cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width=150 border=1><TBODY><TR><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR align=middle><TD>http://ak.imgfarm.com/images/ap/thumbnails//Obama_2008.sff_INAB106_20080315145523.jpg (http://apnews.myway.com/image/20080315/Obama_2008.sff_INAB106_20080315145523.html?date=20 080316&docid=D8VEE9OO0)</TD></TR><TR><TD>(AP) Democratic presidential hopeful Sen. Barack Obama D-Ill., speaks at a town hall meeting at...
Full Image (http://apnews.myway.com/image/20080315/Obama_2008.sff_INAB106_20080315145523.html?date=20 080316&docid=D8VEE9OO0)
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>Obama suggested that more and more is being made of racial divisions as his contest with Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton heats up.
"I noticed over the last several weeks that the forces of division have started to raise their ugly heads again. And I'm not here to cast blame or point fingers because everybody, you know, senses that there's been this shift," Obama said.
"It reminds me: We've got a tragic history when it comes to race in this country. We've got a lot of pent-up anger and bitterness and misunderstanding. ... This country wants to move beyond these kinds of things."
The Illinois senator's comments came a day after he denounced statements in videos appearing on television and on the Internet of sermons by the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, pastor of the Chicago church Obama joined nearly 20 years ago.
"Most recently, you heard some statements from my former pastor that were incendiary and that I completely reject, although I knew him and know him as somebody in my church who talked to me about Jesus and family and friendships."
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width=210 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=middle><TABLE borderColor=#cbcbcd cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width=150 border=1><TBODY><TR><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR align=middle><TD>http://ak.imgfarm.com/images/ap/thumbnails//Obama_2008.sff_INAB104_20080315145629.jpg (http://apnews.myway.com/image/20080315/Obama_2008.sff_INAB104_20080315145629.html?date=20 080316&docid=D8VEE9OO0)</TD></TR><TR><TD>(AP) Democratic presidential hopeful Sen. Barack Obama D-Ill., walks through the door to enter a town...
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</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>Obama said that pointing out racial differences only makes it harder to "deliver on the big issues we face in this country," which he said include health care, the slumping economy, terrorism and caring better for veterans.
Obama, whose mother's family was from Kansas and his father from Kenya, said he was speaking "as someone who has little pieces of America all in me."
He said schools should do a better job of teaching all students African-American history "because that's part of American history," as well as women's struggle for equality, the history of unions, the role of Hispanics in U.S. and other matters that he suggested aren't given enough attention.
"I want us to have a broad-based history" taught in schools, he said, even including more on "the Holocaust as well as other issues of oppression" around the world.
Obama spoke in the gymnasium of Plainfield High School, near Indianapolis, as he directed his political attention at states beyond the critical April 22 Pennsylvania primary.
"We are going to be campaigning actively in Indiana," Obama said to cheers. Indiana and North Carolina have primaries on May 6, two weeks after Pennsylvania.



Some people at my work said they were going, bringing their kids too and said: This is like going to see King in my day" :lol:

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 03:44 PM
It's pretty obvious blacks don't get the same treatment by the government (for one) that other races do, be it in law, banking, employment, or even housing. It says something when the government has to make laws forcing people to employ us which should broaden the scope for you. I love it when other races think it's all in our heads. Occasionally the race card gets played when it's not justified but let's not pretend their isn't a difference in the way that we're treated that is still a hangover from slavery. But that's another argument for another day. You and TD can continue to deny this for the rest of your lives and I will continue to live with it for the rest of mine.

You use my name? :warning: Explain....

slystaff
03-16-2008, 03:44 PM
Fuck you PetreTG


....on Political topics.....

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 03:47 PM
Fuck you PetreTG


....on Political topics.....

Lead by example :nono:

PetreTG
03-16-2008, 03:51 PM
Fuck you PetreTG


....on Political topics.....
:lol:

What's sad is , how easily Obama get's smacked down.

Nothing I've posted about these connections Obama has, is heresay ... it's all fact.

It's confict of interest. It's a bird of a feather and his friends and associates flocked together.

Don't get mad at me for pointing out the obvious even if you must refuse to acknowledge it.

We're it anyone in general , some of these things , though questionable , would be ... "OK" because it's America and we're supposedly free to think and say what we want so, if that's how you want to live your life, more power to ya.

But once again .... for the President of the United States of America ?

Sorry ... It's not OK.

And don't give me that line about how others had this or that in there backgrounds before becoming president.

I AGREE.

I'm telling you to learn a fucking lesson for a change instead of getting fooled into making the same mistake again. :clap:

Rock on
03-16-2008, 04:31 PM
Obama doesn't really appeal to me ideologically speaking but reading all this dirty work people are doing on him, all this dirty, counter productive propaganda, all these accusations that reeks of racism or xenophobia, would make me feel like voting for him if I was american. Just because I wouldn't want to stand with the people bringing up this shit, they make me sick.

It is the good old racial bigotry coming out. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Reminds of “The blacks are coming” phenomenon that Afrikaner leaders used successfully to scare the life out of Afrikaner folk back in the 50s and 60s. Here we see that same tactic … malicious & shameless character assassination, vicious rumour mongering etc, all because of fear. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
Of course as it is often the case, if ones mind is inherently positive and pure there wouldn’t anything to fear but that isn’t the case.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
It is hilarious to follow though.<o:p></o:p>

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 04:35 PM
Why does it have to be racial because there is a smear campaign in POLITICS :notallthere:

Just because it CAN be doesn't mean it always is :nono:

PetreTG
03-16-2008, 04:36 PM
This thread has no more to do with fear of blacks than it has to do with fear of clowns . Anyone that cannot see the obvious conflicts of interest for a leader of a country like the USA , is just plain stupid.

Rock on
03-16-2008, 04:39 PM
Why does it have to be racial because there is a smear campaign in POLITICS :notallthere:

Just because it CAN be doesn't mean it always is :nono:

You are right. Of course not all smear is racially based.

However, I have been here too long to decipher which is which based on the direction the arrows are coming from :cool:

We all know each other well by now in this asylum.

Baron
03-16-2008, 04:40 PM
Why does it have to be racial because there is a smear campaign in POLITICS :notallthere:

Just because it CAN be doesn't mean it always is :nono:Probably because Obama's race was brought up way too often for it to not be a factor in the smear campaign.

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 04:42 PM
Probably because Obama's race was brought up way too often for it to not be a factor in the smear campaign.

That's why he is doing good :dunno: A person making history and it's bound to be brought up....His religious affiliation is brought up more than his race :crafty:

Baron
03-16-2008, 04:45 PM
That's why he is doing good :dunno: A person making history and it's bound to be brought up....His religious affiliation is brought up more than his race :crafty:Well, don't you think saying that he's doing good because he's black isn't exactly what I'm talking about? That basically means "Without his skin color the guy is nothing". You could say this about any black candidate and it's far from being constructive criticism. If he was nothing without his skin color, you wouldn't need to bring up his race to show it, the facts would be speaking by themselves and he wouldn't be where he is right now.

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 04:45 PM
On a side note, I LOVE that he's not Christian, it's the first time Christians defended a person for believing in another religion :laughing: In politics of all places.....ppppfftftt. Another example of history making :popcorn:

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 04:47 PM
Well, don't you think saying that he's doing good because he's black isn't exactly what I'm talking about? That basically means "Without his skin color the guy is nothing". You could say this about any black candidate and it's far from being constructive criticism. If he was nothing without his skin color, you wouldn't need to bring up his race to show it, the facts would be speaking by themselves and he wouldn't be where he is right now.

I OBVIOUSLY do not think he's doing good on race alone, remember America is full of white rednecks :stir:

Baron
03-16-2008, 04:49 PM
I OBVIOUSLY do not think he's doing good on race alone, remember America is full of white rednecks :stir:I don't know what you think dude, I'm just clarifying my stance as you asked for.

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 04:52 PM
I don't know what you think dude, I'm just clarifying my stance as you asked for.

I can see why it was misleading, I was saying his race is not the reason he was doing good (can't be, blacks are minority)and reasons for it being brought up, there are other reasons besides being a bigot or a country full of them......

Baron
03-16-2008, 04:56 PM
I can see why it was misleading, I was saying his race is not the reason he was doing good (can't be, blacks are minority)and reasons for it being brought up, there are other reasons besides being a bigot or a country full of them......Fair enough.

atomicdOGg34
03-16-2008, 06:43 PM
Whether i do or dont, still doesnt change the fact that the numbers you speak of are for the general election and not the primaries. I have no say either way in this little discussion. Dont go attacking me for clarifying the facts.

:lol:

lb 4 lb
03-16-2008, 07:12 PM
You use my name? :warning: Explain....:lol: Sorry TD, but you agreed with TFK and normally tend to take that same stance on the racism issue.

TFK
03-16-2008, 07:45 PM
:lol: Sorry TD, but you agreed with TFK and normally tend to take that same stance on the racism issue.

Sorry, but I think it's the whole victim mentality more then any racism. Of course, racism does exist, but it's so easy to blame all of life's problem on racism, whether it be real or imagined, then it is to accept responsibility for your own actions.

I know lots of succesful minorities. Why is it they were able to overcome 'racism' and have succesful careers, where others were not? The succesful blacks have the same skin color as the unsuccesful blacks. The difference is the succesful ones took the initiative to better themselves and become succesful, rather then sit around and bitch about their lot in life, and blame everyone and everything but themselves for their own failures, rather then actually do something about it.

And don't get the misconception that the victim mentality is exclusive to minorities. As InI shows, there are whites out there who do the same exact thing.

I work in the ghetto's of Newark everyday. I'm in their schools. I see the victim mentality every single day. It's not the white man who is selling the drugs to the crackheads and junkies. It's not the white man who litters the entire city with graffiti, making it look like shit. It's not the white man who has vandalized the city, throwing trash all over the place and refusing to clean it up.

I work in the schools, and let me tell you, some of these new schools that have been built, like Science Park High School, 1st Ave, Belmont-Runyon...they are state of the art in every way. They have technology and tools that I've never seen in any other district, and I've worked all across the state. But unfortunately, the kids don't learn anything, because they are allowed to run wild, because they never learned respect and discipline at home, or because the teachers, having given up trying long ago, are just going through the motions, hoping to collect their paycheck without getting killed.

How is this the result of racism?

There are new homes and apartments being built all over the city. Nice ones too. And the people that are living there are paying next to nothing, because of government assistance. Meanwhile I work hard to pay my mortgage, pay my bills, pay my taxes. And these people are given places to live, and they destroy them. Homes that were brand new a few years ago are covered with graffiti, riddled with trash, and starting to fall apart already.

How is that the result of racism?

The bottom line is, you can take the easy road, and bitch and moan how it's racism, and it's everyone else's fault but your own, but that doesn't accomplish anything.

Or you can fight past all of that, take responsibility for yourself, work hard, educate yourself, make the right decisions, show some self respect and respect toward others, and you can make something out of yourself. It's funny how that attitude makes the effect of racism go away.

TFK

atomicdOGg34
03-16-2008, 07:50 PM
Sorry, but I think it's the whole victim mentality more then any racism. Of course, racism does exist, but it's so easy to blame all of life's problem on racism, whether it be real or imagined, then it is to accept responsibility for your own actions.

I know lots of succesful minorities. Why is it they were able to overcome 'racism' and have succesful careers, where others were not? The succesful blacks have the same skin color as the unsuccesful blacks. The difference is the succesful ones took the initiative to better themselves and become succesful, rather then sit around and bitch about their lot in life, and blame everyone and everything but themselves for their own failures, rather then actually do something about it.

And don't get the misconception that the victim mentality is exclusive to minorities. As InI shows, there are whites out there who do the same exact thing.

I work in the ghetto's of Newark everyday. I'm in their schools. I see the victim mentality every single day. It's not the white man who is selling the drugs to the crackheads and junkies. It's not the white man who litters the entire city with graffiti, making it look like shit. It's not the white man who has vandalized the city, throwing trash all over the place and refusing to clean it up.

I work in the schools, and let me tell you, some of these new schools that have been built, like Science Park High School, 1st Ave, Belmont-Runyon...they are state of the art in every way. They have technology and tools that I've never seen in any other district, and I've worked all across the state. But unfortunately, the kids don't learn anything, because they are allowed to run wild, because they never learned respect and discipline at home, or because the teachers, having given up trying long ago, are just going through the motions, hoping to collect their paycheck without getting killed.

How is this the result of racism?

There are new homes and apartments being built all over the city. Nice ones too. And the people that are living there are paying next to nothing, because of government assistance. Meanwhile I work hard to pay my mortgage, pay my bills, pay my taxes. And these people are given places to live, and they destroy them. Homes that were brand new a few years ago are covered with graffiti, riddled with trash, and starting to fall apart already.

How is that the result of racism?

The bottom line is, you can take the easy road, and bitch and moan how it's racism, and it's everyone else's fault but your own, but that doesn't accomplish anything.

Or you can fight past all of that, take responsibility for yourself, work hard, educate yourself, make the right decisions, show some self respect and respect toward others, and you can make something out of yourself. It's funny how that attitude makes the effect of racism go away.

TFK

:bears: :bears: :bears: :bears:

GREAT post

cant put it any better

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 07:51 PM
:lol: Sorry TD, but you agreed with TFK and normally tend to take that same stance on the racism issue.

You are going to have to elaborate :dunno: Everything I say is truth! :lol:

When I take a stand on an issue, it's based on logic. If you could tell me exactly what I said that you think is wrong.....I can correct you on how I was right :lol: Maybe you are assuming something?

If it's about jobs you were talking about, all other races will get picked last. If a minority is in charge, he would do the same respectively. It's the human condition to choose people like yourself, black people in this country are better off than other minorities, other cultures and races don't have laws to get chosen. And when black people are in place in the work environment, they are 10 times likely to not get fired than if it was a white male. Companies are scared to death to fire a minority in fear of getting sued for racial discrimination, so enjoy the benefit instead of trying to say you can't get a break :dunno: If you were not talking about that, then ....ooopps:lol:

lb 4 lb
03-16-2008, 08:03 PM
You are going to have to elaborate :dunno: Everything I say is truth! :lol:

When I take a stand on an issue, it's based on logic. If you could tell me exactly what I said that you think is wrong.....I can correct you on how I was right :lol: Maybe you are assuming something?

If it's about jobs you were talking about, all other races will get picked last. If a minority is in charge, he would do the same respectively. It's the human condition to choose people like yourself, black people in this country are better off than other minorities, other cultures and races don't have laws to get chosen. And when black people are in place in the work environment, they are 10 times likely to not get fired than if it was a white male. Companies are scared to death to fire a minority in fear of getting sued for racial discrimination, so enjoy the benefit instead of trying to say you can't get a break :dunno: If you were not talking about that, then ....ooopps:lol:Aren't you from another country?

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 08:10 PM
Aren't you from another country?

WHAT? :laughing:

:nono:

I from corn country....home of the flatlands:popcorn:

atomicdOGg34
03-16-2008, 08:12 PM
WHAT? :laughing:

:nono:

I from corn country....home of the flatlands:popcorn:

nebraska?

lb 4 lb
03-16-2008, 08:12 PM
WHAT? :laughing:

:nono:

I from corn country....home of the flatlands:popcorn:I don't know what that means. Where are you from, & presently living?

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 08:15 PM
nebraska?

Indiana :nono:

There is a commercial for Indiana Beach and it goes....."there is more than corn in Indiana, at Indiana beach...." Has a crow singing it too :lol: There's alot of cornfields here with no mountains or scenery to speak of :dunno:

atomicdOGg34
03-16-2008, 08:26 PM
Indiana :nono:

There is a commercial for Indiana Beach and it goes....."there is more than corn in Indiana, at Indiana beach...." Has a crow singing it too :lol: There's alot of cornfields here with no mountains or scenery to speak of :dunno:

oh

figured it might be nebraska, cornhuskers and all :lol:

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 08:32 PM
oh

figured it might be nebraska, cornhuskers and all :lol:

Definately could have been, but instead of telling you guys to look in the right corner of each of my posts....:doh:

I wonder why he thought I was from another country :dunno:

atomicdOGg34
03-16-2008, 08:43 PM
Definately could have been, but instead of telling you guys to look in the right corner of each of my posts....:doh:

I wonder why he thought I was from another country :dunno:


:laughing: :laughing:

sonovabitch

lb 4 lb
03-16-2008, 08:51 PM
Definately could have been, but instead of telling you guys to look in the right corner of each of my posts....:doh:

I wonder why he thought I was from another country :dunno:SHit I'll be damned. I guess just don't pay attention to every little piece of scribble on this site. Especially with Cupey getting as much as he can from asslube advertisements and such.

The reason I thought you were from another country is because I could have sworn you often would use Australian or British slang/terms not that that means you are. I'm either right that you do or I'm thinking of somebody else.

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 08:55 PM
SHit I'll be damned. I guess just don't pay attention to every little piece of scribble on this site. Especially with Cupey getting as much as he can from asslube advertisements and such.

The reason I thought you were from another country is because I could have sworn you often would use Australian or British slang/terms not that that means you are. I'm either right that you do or I'm thinking of somebody else.

So what exactly were you talking about me and my siding with racism :dunno:

TysonFan4Ever
03-16-2008, 11:50 PM
Whoever would base their vote on what a canidates pastor says or does is a fucking retard and should not be voting at all. This is just a smear campaign by the usual racist suspects.

TFK
03-16-2008, 11:52 PM
Now you know why his wife made that comment "this is the first time she's proud to be an American." It's the truth to them after being preached to over the years by this bozo.


TFK

Tyler Durden
03-16-2008, 11:52 PM
Whoever would base their vote on what a canidates pastor says or does is a fucking retard and should not be voting at all. This is just a smear campaign by the usual racist suspects.

Racism and religion go hand in hand :clap:

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 12:17 AM
Now you know why his wife made that comment "this is the first time she's proud to be an American." It's the truth to them after being preached to over the years by this bozo.


TFK

not only that but she said america was filled with slothful people and that america was mean

Godfather
03-17-2008, 01:35 AM
She didnt say it was the first time she was proud as an american.

She said

For the first time in her adult life, she was really proud of her country. I think thats bullshit, im sure she has been really proud before, but still, those comments arent that bad when you look it.

Azazel
03-17-2008, 01:52 AM
So says Rev J Wright.

But when u look at the reasons for this speech, I couldn't agree more with this eloquent, intellectual pastor. :lol:

Nothing wrong with God (if he bloody well exist) damning a country which has brought profund injustice to its citizens and citizens of the world. :dunno:.

Should God bless a country for such evil? Of course NOT, DAMN IT I SAY!!!

Wright was so right on this occassion.

In fact, save for a few comments, Wright is a courageous man who is usually right on the money, calls it like it is and should be celebrated.

We need more Wrights in this world to attack the ills of this world in other injustice ridden nations across the globe.

Kudos to Rev Wright :bears: :blobbox:
Exactly, from what I saw, Wright seems like the type of man who doesnt let bullshit cloud his jugement. If Obamma is indeed influenced by this man, he could do very good things.

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 02:54 AM
She didnt say it was the first time she was proud as an american.

She said

For the first time in her adult life, she was really proud of her country. I think thats bullshit, im sure she has been really proud before, but still, those comments arent that bad when you look it.

not very intelligent of her, for all the praise she gets

Rabid Kimba
03-17-2008, 04:46 AM
I'm proud of my country but not the current Bush administration.

:popcorn:

Rock on
03-17-2008, 05:02 AM
What makes peeps proud of their country vary from person to person depending on what they deem to be right or what they appreciate.

Some folks really do appreciate their country commiting injustice, distabilising, exploiting, maming and killing other peoples so long as it advances the developement/progress of their country. So it is no wonder that they wave their flags and profess their patriostism whenever their country yet again embark on such activities.

Some folks are just naturally averse to all forms of injustice regardless of the perpetrator, so it is no wonder they are able to condemn their country whenever it commits acts of injustice.

What makes u proud or unproud is really a manisfestation of your values as a human being.

Tyler Durden
03-17-2008, 05:09 AM
What makes peeps proud of their country vary from person to person depending on what they deem to be right or what they appreciate.

Some folks really do appreciate their country commiting injustice, distabilising, exploiting, maming and killing other peoples so long as it advances the developement/progress of their country. So it is no wonder that they wave their flags and profess their patriostism whenever their country yet again embark on such activities.

Some folks are just naturally averse to all forms of injustice regardless of the perpetrator, so it is no wonder they are able to condemn their country whenever it commits acts of injustice.

What makes u proud or unproud is really a manisfestation of your values as a human being.

Maybe this is why lb4lb thought I was from another country :lol:

slystaff
03-17-2008, 10:00 AM
Now you know why his wife made that comment "this is the first time she's proud to be an American." It's the truth to them after being preached to over the years by this bozo.


TFKSadly....I think most of the American public is going to have this view going forward after juxtaposing the two.

It doesn't matter that Obama in his book has been saying how much he loves his country, it doesn't matter that Obama has denounced the anti-semitism and person of Farrakhan...it doesn't matter that Obama has ejected Wright from his campaign and rejected his anti-american, anti-white comments....

What matters is that a black man has the audacity to run for President and that he knows someone who made these remarks.

All of us are close to people that say things we don't agree with. ALL OF US. Sometimes they are even our parents or siblings...we still love them but we profoundly disagree.

The truth is there is not ONE black person in the country (including people like Powell and Condoliza Rice) who isn't close to someone who still harbors bitter feelings about the way blacks have been treated in the US ove rteh centruries and up to recently AND by the US establishment.


It's blacks that have been on the receiving end of US injustice...not whites, and that's why Whites don't understand why some blacks can harbor these negative views.

Anyway..Obama has said that he acknowledges that alot of people feel this way but he's trying to show that he is of a new generation that wants to end the differences.

Sadly..the inherent racism of white america will not give him that chance...

Rock on
03-17-2008, 10:10 AM
Sadly....I think most of the American public is going to have this view going forward after juxtaposing the two.

It doesn't matter that Obama in his book has been saying how much he loves his country, it doesn't matter that Obama has denounced the anti-semitism and person of Farrakhan...it doesn't matter that Obama has ejected Wright from his campaign and rejected his anti-american, anti-white comments....

What matters is that a black man has the audacity to run for President and that he knows someone who made these remarks.

All of us are close to people that say things we don't agree with. ALL OF US. Sometimes they are even our parents or siblings...we still love them but we profoundly disagree.

The truth is there is not ONE black person in the country (including people like Powell and Condoliza Rice) who isn't close to someone who still harbors bitter feelings about the way blacks have been treated in the US ove rteh centruries and up to recently AND by the US establishment.


It's blacks that have been on the receiving end of US injustice...not whites, and that's why Whites don't understand why some blacks can harbor these negative views.

Anyway..Obama has said that he acknowledges that alot of people feel this way but he's trying to show that he is of a new generation that wants to end the differences.

Sadly..the inherent racism of white america will not give him that chance...

Very good post Sly.

Please have a beer on me; it's on the house.

PetreTG
03-17-2008, 11:01 AM
Now you know why his wife made that comment "this is the first time she's proud to be an American." It's the truth to them after being preached to over the years by this bozo.


TFK

Yep ... that was my point before. You cannot have a faith like that and it not permeate into how you think and look at everything.

For the average joe ... you want to live with a chip on your shoulder , by all means do so.

For the President of the USA .... sorry , not acceptable.

PetreTG
03-17-2008, 11:06 AM
Sadly....I think most of the American public is going to have this view going forward after juxtaposing the two.

It doesn't matter that Obama in his book has been saying how much he loves his country, it doesn't matter that Obama has denounced the anti-semitism and person of Farrakhan...it doesn't matter that Obama has ejected Wright from his campaign and rejected his anti-american, anti-white comments....

What matters is that a black man has the audacity to run for President and that he knows someone who made these remarks.

All of us are close to people that say things we don't agree with. ALL OF US. Sometimes they are even our parents or siblings...we still love them but we profoundly disagree.

The truth is there is not ONE black person in the country (including people like Powell and Condoliza Rice) who isn't close to someone who still harbors bitter feelings about the way blacks have been treated in the US ove rteh centruries and up to recently AND by the US establishment.


It's blacks that have been on the receiving end of US injustice...not whites, and that's why Whites don't understand why some blacks can harbor these negative views.

Anyway..Obama has said that he acknowledges that alot of people feel this way but he's trying to show that he is of a new generation that wants to end the differences.

Sadly..the inherent racism of white america will not give him that chance...

Bullshit ... Were Colin Powell to run for president , half the country would vote him in , in a landslide.

You know why he didn't run and why he got out ? Because he saw how fucked our system has become. :nono:

Obama will be one of the boys ... he'll play right along with the grand scheme and will fit their agenda perfectly , because he can sell water to a drowning man and fools the ignorant masses with ease.

His agenda will be someone elses ... don't believe the hype.

I'm gonna remind you how many times i said that later when you realize YOU'RE the one that got hoodwinked and bamboozled again. :clap:

slystaff
03-17-2008, 11:57 AM
Bullshit ... Were Colin Powell to run for president , half the country would vote him in , in a landslide.

You know why he didn't run and why he got out ? Because he saw how fucked our system has become. :nono:

Obama will be one of the boys ... he'll play right along with the grand scheme and will fit their agenda perfectly , because he can sell water to a drowning man and fools the ignorant masses with ease.

His agenda will be someone elses ... don't believe the hype.

I'm gonna remind you how many times i said that later when you realize YOU'RE the one that got hoodwinked and bamboozled again. :clap:Nah...the media would dig for anything they can find to suggest he's unamerican or did drugs when he was young, hasa dodgy pastor or has an illegitimate child or whatever.

Still...I think Colin should run next time! :bears:

PetreTG
03-17-2008, 12:02 PM
Nah...the media would dig for anything they can find to suggest he's unamerican or did drugs when he was young, hasa dodgy pastor or has an illegitimate child or whatever.

Still...I think Colin should run next time! :bears:

The difference is , like Paul ... Finding dirt on Powell would be near impossible.

I was hoping he'd run , but instead he got the fuck out. Smart man.

slystaff
03-17-2008, 12:10 PM
The difference is , like Paul ... Finding dirt on Powell would be near impossible.

I was hoping he'd run , but instead he got the fuck out. Smart man.Nah FOKKKS NEWS would make sure to find something on Powell. Hannity and the boyz would make it their mission...

phonetap
03-17-2008, 12:10 PM
Bullshit ... Were Colin Powell to run for president , half the country would vote him in , in a landslide.

You know why he didn't run and why he got out ? Because he saw how fucked our system has become. :nono:

Obama will be one of the boys ... he'll play right along with the grand scheme and will fit their agenda perfectly , because he can sell water to a drowning man and fools the ignorant masses with ease.

His agenda will be someone elses ... don't believe the hype.

I'm gonna remind you how many times i said that later when you realize YOU'RE the one that got hoodwinked and bamboozled again. :clap:

you've become a certified idiot. :laughing:

the self-proclaimed libertarian/constitutionalist attacking another who's excersizing his constitutional right to freedom of speech. the same constitution that was written by slave owners and native american murderers...be honest for once in your life, would any of the founding fathers been president in this day and age? not one of them...in fact 3/4 of former presidents of the united states would never have become president if you wanted to crucify them for racist views, objectionable and/or controversial associations.

this entire rev wright escapade is just another way of fear mongering, you're just too stupid to see it. you're just part of the mindless sheep you've always argued against. what better way to drum up fear with white america (outside of islamic radicalism) then to showcase black rage behind the pulpit. and since no one can dig up direct quotations from barack obama the focus is now turned to those he's close with. besides, you know you agree with half the shit the rev wright says...especially the Goddamn america and 9/11 part. the only people you are fooling are those with sub 70 IQ's and yourself....phonetap is on to you. :tease:

PetreTG
03-17-2008, 12:20 PM
you've become a certified idiot. :laughing:

the self-proclaimed libertarian/constitutionalist attacking another who's excersizing his constitutional right to freedom of speech. the same constitution that was written by slave owners and native american murderers...be honest for once in your life, would any of the founding fathers been president in this day and age? not one of them...in fact 3/4 of former presidents of the united states would never have become president if you wanted to crucify them for racist views, objectionable and/or controversial associations.

this entire rev wright escapade is just another way of fear mongering, you're just too stupid to see it. you're just part of the mindless sheep you've always argued against. what better way to drum up fear with white america (outside of islamic radicalism) then to showcase black rage behind the pulpit. and since no one can dig up direct quotations from barack obama the focus is now turned to those he's close with. besides, you know you agree with half the shit the rev wright says...especially the Goddamn america and 9/11 part. the only people you are fooling are those with sub 70 IQ's and yourself....phonetap is on to you. :tease:

Someone is too stupid to see the conflict of interest here ... and keeps trying desperately to fit that square peg in the round hole.

Do I agree with some of what the reverend says ... sure. I never said EVERYTHING he said was wrong. That was never the point. Much of what Paul says , without all the racial undertones is SIMILAR.

But Obama is not evern trying to push a platform anything like Paul's, as a matter of fact , his platform and fiscal sense is diametrically opposite of Paul's.

What Obama is getting from the kook of a reverend (Who stepped down and out BTW) is the bad portions of the message.

Obama surrounds himself with crooks. Look at the list of characters I have presented.

I didn't make that shit up. Obama has poor judgement wrapped up in a pretty package. He's allied himself with crooks and world government proponents. He'll be right on board for the next phase of this train wreck.

Mark my words cause I'm gonna remind you of them later.

Rock on
03-17-2008, 12:35 PM
Fuck Powell, the war monger. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
<?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /><st1:country-region><st1:place>America</st1:place></st1:country-region> can do better than have a bare faced, day light liar who brazenly disgraced himself to the whole world in the UN Iraq war debate. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
He lost all credibility amongst the progressives of this world except for the reactionaries on that day and ever since.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
He may have been popular to do well in a presi election but after his UN stunt and <st1:country-region><st1:place>Iraq</st1:place></st1:country-region>. His cred has been profoundly battered.<o:p></o:p>

phonetap
03-17-2008, 12:36 PM
Someone is too stupid to see the conflict of interest here ... and keeps trying desperately to fit that square peg in the round hole.

Do I agree with some of what the reverend says ... sure. I never said EVERYTHING he said was wrong. That was never the point. Much of what Paul says , without all the racial undertones is SIMILAR.

But Obama is not evern trying to push a platform anything like Paul's, as a matter of fact , his platform and fiscal sense is diametrically opposite of Paul's.

What Obama is getting from the kook of a reverend (Who stepped down and out BTW) is the bad portions of the message.

Obama surrounds himself with crooks. Look at the list of characters I have presented.

I didn't make that shit up. Obama has poor judgement wrapped up in a pretty package. He's allied himself with crooks and world government proponents. He'll be right on board for the next phase of this train wreck.

Mark my words cause I'm gonna remind you of them later.

pastre, you are no where near as smart as you think. you won't remind phonetap of shit because he's never said things will turn around automatically should obama become president. :doh:

but back to the subject, can you even see over the pile of bullshit you've been spewing lately. what do you think would have happened if ron paul was a leading presidential candidate? people would have been digging into his background pulling up whatever skeletons they could find to use against him. being that ron paul is akin to a deity in your mind, you probably believe there would be nothing to find...no matter how many gallons of ron paul kool aid you've drank, the unfortunate truth (for you is) there is ALWAYS something to find. fortunately for ron paul, he can go back into political anonymity for the remainder of this unremarkable career while barack obama has to deal with self-righteous media, surrogates and political hacks.

Rock on
03-17-2008, 12:39 PM
you've become a certified idiot. :laughing:

the self-proclaimed libertarian/constitutionalist attacking another who's excersizing his constitutional right to freedom of speech. the same constitution that was written by slave owners and native american murderers...be honest for once in your life, would any of the founding fathers been president in this day and age? not one of them...in fact 3/4 of former presidents of the united states would never have become president if you wanted to crucify them for racist views, objectionable and/or controversial associations.

this entire rev wright escapade is just another way of fear mongering, you're just too stupid to see it. you're just part of the mindless sheep you've always argued against. what better way to drum up fear with white america (outside of islamic radicalism) then to showcase black rage behind the pulpit. and since no one can dig up direct quotations from barack obama the focus is now turned to those he's close with. besides, you know you agree with half the shit the rev wright says...especially the Goddamn america and 9/11 part. the only people you are fooling are those with sub 70 IQ's and yourself....phonetap is on to you. :tease:

This is good, very. :bears:

I salute you.

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 12:50 PM
Obama's spending plan

THE WASHINGTON TIMES EDITORIAL
February 22, 2008
Barack Obama has a plan. Well, he actually has lots of plans. Paying for those plans is no secret.

Bear with us even though the costs aren't hidden in these details. To finance (1) his 10-year, $150 billion program to "establish a green energy sector," (2) his 10-year, $60 billion "National Infrastructure Reinvestment Bank," (3) his nearly universal health care plan (whose annual price tag he low-balls at $50 to $65 billion) and (4) a host of refundable tax credits ranging from $4,000 per year for college students to a tripling of the Earned Income Tax Credit for minimum-wage workers, Mr. Obama plans to (1) end the war in Iraq, (2) permit the Bush tax cuts to expire for households earning more than $250,000 and (3) "change our tax code," which "has been rigged by lobbyists with page after page of loopholes that benefit big corporations and the wealthiest few."

In his attempt to appease the anti-war brigades, Mr. Obama may be overestimating the peace dividend. And in his efforts to engage in class warfare, he is demonizing businesses and wealthy individuals, who collectively bear the lion's share of the nation's tax burden.

Regarding the peace dividend, it must be recalled that Mr. Obama declined in September to promise that all U.S. troops would be out of Iraq by January 2013, which was more than five years down the road. Meanwhile, U.S. military forces in Afghanistan will soon exceed 32,000 troops, there are growing expectations that more will be needed and it is likely that our allies will be withdrawing more of their forces. If a Democratic president managed to reduce U.S. forces in Iraq by 75 percent from the surge's peak level, there would still be 40,000 troops there. That means the Afghanistan/Iraq theaters would still have a total of about 75,000 U.S. troops. In October, when the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) examined a scenario in which 75,000 U.S. troops would remain in those two countries through fiscal 2017, it concluded that the costs "would total $1,055 billion over the 2008-17 period." That figure did not include an additional $290 billion in interest outlays; nor did it include another $147 billion over the 2009-17 period to increase the size of the Army and Marines; and it did not include the tens of billions of dollars that will be required to reset the military's equipment.

Regarding the lobbyists who have "rigged" the tax code with "loopholes that benefit big corporations and the wealthiest few," two facts are worth noting. First, as total tax receipts increased from 16.5 percent of gross domestic product (GDP) in fiscal 2003 to 18.8 percent of GDP in fiscal 2007, corporate income taxes increased from 1.2 percent of GDP to 2.7 percent, the highest level in 30 years. Thus, the four-year proportionate increase in corporate income tax revenue (from 1.2 percent to 2.7 percent) accounted for 65 percent of the proportionate increase in total revenues (from 16.5 percent to 18.8 percent). The second point relates to the "loopholes" for the "wealthiest." According to a December 2007 CBO study, in 2005 the top 1 percent of households earned 18.1 percent of income and paid 38.8 percent of individual federal income taxes and 27.6 percent of all federal taxes. The highest quintile (the top 20 percent) earned 55 percent of income and paid 86.3 percent of individual federal income taxes and 68.7 percent of all federal taxes.

Mr. Obama's anti-war and class-warfare rhetoric borders on the demagogic.

:lol:

PetreTG
03-17-2008, 12:51 PM
pastre, you are no where near as smart as you think. you won't remind phonetap of shit because he's never said things will turn around automatically should obama become president. :doh:

but back to the subject, can you even see over the pile of bullshit you've been spewing lately. what do you think would have happened if ron paul was a leading presidential candidate? people would have been digging into his background pulling up whatever skeletons they could find to use against him. being that ron paul is akin to a deity in your mind, you probably believe there would be nothing to find...no matter how many gallons of ron paul kool aid you've drank, the unfortunate truth (for you is) there is ALWAYS something to find. fortunately for ron paul, he can go back into political anonymity for the remainder of this unremarkable career while barack obama has to deal with self-righteous media, surrogates and political hacks.

Did I ever say things would automatically turn around?

No

I said he's going to make shit a LOT worse. His fiscal idiocy guarantees it.

So who's not too smart ... I think it's the guy that can't understand English.

As for Paul ... BULLFUCKINGSHIT if they didn't and YOU didn't look for any and all dirt you possibly coulld on him.

There isn't any ... and drawing to much attention to him would have been VERY dangerous.

You keep your audacity to hope on Obama Phonetap ... I promise not to laugh too hard when you get made a fool of for supporting this obvious shyster.

phonetap
03-17-2008, 12:57 PM
Did I ever say things would automatically turn around?

No

I said he's going to make shit a LOT worse. His fiscal idiocy guarantees it.

So who's not too smart ... I think it's the guy that can't understand English.

As for Paul ... BULLFUCKINGSHIT if they didn't and YOU didn't look for any and all dirt you possibly coulld on him.

There isn't any ... and drawing to much attention to him would have been VERY dangerous.

You keep your audacity to hope on Obama Phonetap ... I promise not to laugh too hard when you get made a fool of for supporting this obvious shyster.

:laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

PetreTG
03-17-2008, 01:04 PM
:laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

The intelligent man's response . :clap:

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 01:06 PM
http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=6262

:lol:

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 01:08 PM
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=311 border=1><TBODY><TR align=middle><TD width=311 colSpan=3 height=54>Individual Income Taxes Under Presidents Clinton and Bush, 1999 Law and 2008 Law</TD></TR><TR><TD align=middle width=311 colSpan=3 height=50>For taxpayers who take the standard deduction and have no children</TD></TR><TR><TD align=middle width=127 height=67>Taxpayer</TD><TD align=middle width=94>Tax under Clinton, 1999 tax law</TD><TD align=middle width=90>Tax under Bush, 2008 tax law</TD></TR><TR><TD width=127 height=59>Single, income of 30,000</TD><TD align=right width=94>$3,157.50 </TD><TD align=right width=90>$2,756.25 </TD></TR><TR><TD width=127 height=51>Single, income of 50,000</TD><TD align=right width=94>$7,262.50 </TD><TD align=right width=90>$6,606.25 </TD></TR><TR><TD width=127 height=54>Married, income of $50,000</TD><TD align=right width=94>$5,085.00 </TD><TD align=right width=90>$4,012.50 </TD></TR><TR><TD width=127 height=46>Married, income of $60,000</TD><TD align=right width=94>$6,585.00 </TD><TD align=right width=90>$5,512.50 </TD></TR><TR><TD width=127 height=51>Single, income of $75,000</TD><TD align=right width=94>$14,262.50 </TD><TD align=right width=90>$12,856.25 </TD></TR><TR><TD width=127 height=53>Married, income of $75,000</TD><TD align=right width=94>$9,426.50 </TD><TD align=right width=90>$7,762.50 </TD></TR><TR><TD width=127 height=47>Single, income of $125,000*</TD><TD align=right width=94>$29,378.50 </TD><TD align=right width=90>$26,472.25 </TD></TR><TR><TD width=127 height=41>Married, income of $125,000*</TD><TD align=right width=94>$23,426.50 </TD><TD align=right width=90>$19,462.50 </TD></TR><TR><TD width=311 colSpan=3 height=45>*This chart does not take into account the Alternative Minimum Tax</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

:lol:

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 01:09 PM
so much for the poor getting jacked under bush

:lol:

phonetap
03-17-2008, 01:13 PM
The intelligent man's response . :clap:

yup...you denying your God, ron paul has anything negative in his past is intelligent alright. was ron paul born from a virgin? :laughing:

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 01:17 PM
yup...you denying your God, ron paul has anything negative in his past is intelligent alright.

this isn't english

phonetap
03-17-2008, 01:20 PM
this isn't english

njgfuewgcvd ojfgouewvc ewfhoie? :dunno:

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 01:23 PM
Why Is Bill Clinton Cultivating Envy?

by Stephen Moore
<!--BIO-->
<!--CITATION-->This article appeared on cato.org (http://www.cato.org/) on July 31, 1997.
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The biggest winner in the tax-cut passage that Congress and the White House have agreed on might be the greed and envy lobby.
For weeks the Clinton administration has assailed the GOP tax plan as unfair and heavily skewed toward the wealthy. In order to inoculate themselves from this class-warfare virus, Republicans have now made concessions that make the tax bill worse. These concessions include dropping the proposal to index capital gains for inflation, providing income tax "cuts" to low-income families that don’t pay taxes, and imposing a $75,000 income cap on the child tax credit.
(http://www.cato.org/people/moore.html)


Republicans shouldn't have wilted so easily. They should have met the class-warfare argument head-on. This is not -- nor has it ever been -- a nation principally motivated by greed and envy. Most Americans don't hate rich people as much as Dick Gephardt apparently does. Americans don't begrudge billionaires like Microsoft's Bill Gates or Federal Express's Fred Smith their fortunes. The vast majority of Americans don't want to tax the rich out of existence; they want to become rich themselves.
What does it mean for a tax plan to be "fair?" According to President Clinton's definition, a tax cut is equitable if the least productive people in the economy get the largest tax break and if the most productive people get no tax cut at all. Four years ago he made the amazing statement that his tax increase plan was "fair" because "70 percent of the taxes would be paid by the wealthiest 2 percent of the families."
Americans do want a fair tax system. But by "fair" they do not mean the Clintonian notion of requiring the rich to bear almost all the tax burden. Rather, most Americans think of a "fair" system as one in which everyone plays by the same rules. (That is why a flat rate tax system with no special-interest loopholes is the fairest tax system of all.) What offends Americans is not a tax cut that benefits all but a tax cut that carves out sweetheart deals for powerful political groups at the expense of the rest of us. This is precisely why the Reagan tax cut was so politically triumphant: everyone got an equal percentage reduction in their tax burden. There were no windfalls, and there were no losers.
The Republicans have unwittingly fallen prey to the class warfare argument partly because of their own political timidity. By agreeing to such a small tax cut in the first place ($85 billion over five years is one percent over total revenues), the tax debate predictably has generated into a battle over how the pie should be divided.
The White House complains that "two-thirds of the benefits of the Republican plan go to the richest 20 percent of Americans." It turns out that in calculating family income, the Clinton Treasury uses a bizarre notion of income that includes fringe benefits, imputed rental value of one's home, Individual Retirement Accounts and other forms of non-cash income. A family with earnings of $28,000 a year can easily appear to be making $40,000 under the Clinton definition of income. A family with earnings of $70,000 can easily be converted into a $100,000-plus income family. The reason that the Clinton administration says that the GOP tax plan benefits the rich is that according to the White House model, if you have a full-time job, you're rich.
Once phony indicators of income -- like the rental value of one’s house -– are eliminated, the Institute for Policy Innovation calculates that three-quarters of the tax reduction benefits help Americans with incomes under $75,000. Only 7 percent of the benefit goes to Americans with earnings over $100,000. Most of the benefits of the tax cut go to middle-income families with children through the $500 per child tax credit.

<CENTER><TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=middle>Income</TD><TD align=middle>Percent of GOP
Tax Cut Benefit</TD></TR><TR><TD align=middle>Less than $20,000</TD><TD align=middle>5%</TD></TR><TR><TD align=middle>Less than $75,000 </TD><TD align=middle>76%</TD></TR><TR><TD align=middle>Less than $100,000</TD><TD align=middle>93%</TD></TR><TR><TD align=middle>More than $100,000</TD><TD align=middle>7%</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER>

Polls show that many Americans mistakenly believe that the rich today pay very little in federal taxes. The Internal Revenue Service just released data on the distribution of tax burdens in America that offer some surprising results. The richest 1 percent of Americans today -- the Steven Spielbergs, Michael Jordans, Warren Buffetts and Madonnas -- earned 16 percent of the total income in 1995. How much of the income tax did they pay? Two percent? Five percent? Try 30 percent. That's right! One percent of Americans pay almost one-third of the income taxes. The top 5 percent pay almost half. How is that fair?
On the lower end of the income scale, the numbers are even more shocking. Americans who fall below the median income level (those in the bottom 50 percent) pay only 5 percent of all income taxes. Those in the bottom 25 percent pay no income taxes -- zero! Bill Clinton complains that the Republicans don't cut income taxes for Americans at the bottom of the income scale. But how could they? Those Americans don't pay any income taxes at all. Clinton wants to send non-taxpayers a government check. That's welfare, not a tax cut.
Ultimately, to win the tax fairness debate, tax cutters need to make the case that they want to expand the economic pie, whereas the Clintonites are mainly focused on dividing it. An agenda of wealth creation always trumps an agenda of wealth redistribution. Not long ago a New Jersey painter was quoted in the Washington Post as saying, "You're looking at a poor man who thinks the capital gains tax [cut] is the best thing that could happen to this country. People say capital gains are for the rich, but I've never been hired by a poor man."
Republicans will win the tax fight this summer and fall if they can learn to speak with such simple eloquence

:laughing: :lol:

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 01:24 PM
njgfuewgcvd ojfgouewvc ewfhoie? :dunno:

oh

well you shoulda just said this from the start

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 01:30 PM
Obama calls for $1,000 income tax cuts




<!-- Article Publsih Date -->November 7, 2007
<!-- Article By Line -->BY JENNIFER HUNTER (jhunter@suntimes.com) Sun-Times Columnist
<!-- Article's First Paragraph -->BETTENDORF, Iowa — Hoping to make it easier for working Americans to realize their dreams, White House hopeful Barack Obama today proposed a sweeping legislative package aimed at shoring up middle America. The legislation — which Obama will champion if elected president in 2008 — calls for an income tax cut of $1,000 per working family.
It would eliminate income taxes for seniors who earn less than $50,000 a year, provide an annual raise in the minimum wage, offer quality after-school programs, and expand family and medical leave.
The plan also would:
—Target mortgage fraud by raising “penalties on lenders who have broken the rules.”
—Provide a tax credit covering 10 percent of a family’s mortgage interest payment each year.
—Establish a Credit Card Bill of Rights to ban “unilateral changes to a credit card agreement.”
—Create a $4,000 refundable tax credit when a student enrolls in college.
Obama, a Democratic U.S. senator from Illinois, said he wants to “put some wind at the backs of working people, to lower the cost of getting ahead” and “protect and extend opportunity for the middle class.”
Like rival U.S. Sen. Hillary Clinton’s plan to rejuvenate middle-class fortunes, Obama’s package also offers a workplace pension policy that requires businesses to enroll workers in portable, direct-deposit retirement accounts.
“And the federal government will match savings for working families,” Obama said, although he didn’t disclose costs. “This will dramatically increase the number of Americans who save for retirement.”
“There has been a lot of talk in this campaign about the politics of hope,” Obama concluded. “But understand, the politics of hope doesn’t mean hoping that things come easy. It’s a politics of believing in things unseen; of believing in what this country might be; and of standing up for that belief and fighting for it when it’s hard.”
“And what binds us together, what makes us one American family is that we stand up and fight for each other’s dreams, not just our own.”
Earlier this year Obama laid out his plan for more than $80 billion in tax cuts for middle-class Americans offset by tax increases for investors and companies. That proposal involved raising the top rate on capital gains and dividends, eliminating ‘‘corporate loopholes,’’ including one used by hedge funds and private-equity firms, and cracking down on overseas tax havens.
Clinton, of New York, and another Democratic rival, former U.S. Sen. John Edwards (D-N.C.), have also endorsed tax increases for investment funds and wealthier Americans.
Obama is on a week-long campaign swing through Iowa, home of the nation’s first presidential contest on Jan. 3. He trails Clinton in state polls.

i guess having a home is going to become a right now too :rolleyes:

brilliant way to help the economy, tax investment and capital gains

what a fucktard

TFK
03-17-2008, 01:40 PM
It doesn't matter that Obama in his book has been saying how much he loves his country, it doesn't matter that Obama has denounced the anti-semitism and person of Farrakhan...it doesn't matter that Obama has ejected Wright from his campaign and rejected his anti-american, anti-white comments....

What matters is that a black man has the audacity to run for President and that he knows someone who made these remarks.



This is the kind of simple minded, ignorant thinking that has held back true victims of racism for years.

It couldn't possibly be Obama's connections to these questionable people that have voters wary of him...it HAS to be because he's black.

Here's a newsflash, Sly. Not everything bad that happens to a black man is the result of racism. It's possible to dislike Obama because of his associations, his stance on the issues, his inadequecy to be president. It doesn't have to be just because he's black.

As soon as you idiots can see past this, open your eyes to reality, stop trying to use racism as a crutch everytime something bad happens to a black person...the world will be a much better, happier and peaceful place. And then the real racism can be dealt with. But every bullshit cry of racism marginalizes true instances of racism.

As a black man, you should be ashamed of yourself.

TFK

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 01:42 PM
This is the kind of simple minded, ignorant thinking that has held back true victims of racism for years.

It couldn't possibly be Obama's connections to these questionable people that have voters wary of him...it HAS to be because he's black.

Here's a newsflash, Sly. Not everything bad that happens to a black man is the result of racism. It's possible to dislike Obama because of his associations, his stance on the issues, his inadequecy to be president. It doesn't have to be just because he's black.

As soon as you idiots can see past this, open your eyes to reality, stop trying to use racism as a crutch everytime something bad happens to a black person...the world will be a much better, happier and peaceful place. And then the real racism can be dealt with. But every bullshit cry of racism marginalizes true instances of racism.

As a black man, you should be ashamed of yourself.

TFK

ouch

burn

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 01:48 PM
Tax Delusions

by Alan Reynolds
<!--BIO-->
<!--CITATION-->This article appeared in the New York Post (http://www.nypost.com/) on February 15, 2008.
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<!-- AddThis Bookmark Button BEGIN --><SCRIPT type=text/javascript> addthis_url = location.href; addthis_title = document.title; addthis_pub = 'cato_webmaster'; </SCRIPT><SCRIPT src="http://s7.addthis.com/js/addthis_widget.php?v=12" type=text/javascript></SCRIPT>http://s7.addthis.com/button1-bm.gif (http://www.addthis.com/bookmark.php?v=12&winname=addthis&pub=cato_webmaster&s=&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cato.org%2Fpub_display.php%3F pub_id%3D9224&title=Tax%20Delusions) <!-- AddThis Bookmark Button END -->
<!--BODY-->Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama both propose to "turn the economy around" in a novel way - by raising tax rates on small businesses, working couples and stockholders in general, including retirees.
Of course, their plans are also meant to raise revenue for their various hundreds of billions in new spending - but the move would fall flat on that front, too.
Start with the deficit. The Bush administration predicts a $409 billion budget shortfall for fiscal 2009. But that rests on absurd assumptions - a sudden $104 billion drop in the price of war in Iraq and Afghanistan, a freeze in non-security discretionary spending - and a speeding up of economic growth.
In fact, this election year's "stimulus" bills are likelier to slow things down in 2009. Seven of the 10 postwar recessions began in the year after a presidential race, including 2001 and 1981.
So, with luck, the next president may start out with an economy that is only fragile or feeble and a deficit not much above $500 billion.
Now, on to tax hikes.

Higher tax rates on dividends and capital gains would crash the stock market yet do absolutely nothing to cut the deficit.
The federal government now takes 33 percent of taxable income above $200,000 on a joint return and 35 percent of income above $357,700. Both Democrats would raise those tax rates to 36 percent and 39.6 percent, respectively.
Even the Tax Policy Center (a think tank famously friendly to tax hikes and Democrats) estimates that raising the top two tax rates might bring in a mere $32 billion in 2010. That's 6 percent of the likely deficit - not a license to start a dozen new programs.
To squeeze a few more pennies from top taxpayers, Clinton and Obama would also phase out all personal exemptions at $250,000. That means large families would pay higher taxes than childless couples with the same income. They'd also phase out itemized deductions - which would force two-earner families in New York and California to pay more federal tax than those living in Texas and Florida.
And this politically suicidal tax discrimination against New Yorkers, Californians and big families would bring in only an extra $15 billion a year.
All in all, these tax hikes add up to, at most, $47 billion a year - only 1.5 percent of federal spending and 0.3 percent of GDP.
And even that assumes nobody makes the slightest effort to avoid the increased taxes. In reality, many two-earner families would become one-earner families; doctors would play more golf; some folks would quit working long hours and others would retire early. Top-bracket taxpayers would maximize deductions (take out a bigger mortgage, put more in the 401k) and minimize taxable income (buy municipal bonds or just spend rather than invest).
Such tax avoidance alone would cut the estimated revenue in half. The tax hikes' adverse effects on the stock market and the economy would more than eliminate the other half.
<STYLE> .author_pub2 a { float:right; margin: 10px 0 8px 8px; display:block; height: 152px; width: 110px; background: url(/people/pub_photos/reynolds_w.jpg) no-repeat -110px 0; } .author_pub2a a { float:right; margin: 10px 0 8px 8px; display:block; height: 152px; width: 110px; background: url(/people/pub_photos/reynolds_w.jpg) no-repeat 0 0; } </STYLE>[/URL][URL="http://www.cato.org/people/reynolds.html"]Alan Reynolds (http://www.cato.org/people/reynolds.html) is a senior fellow and author of Income and Wealth (http://www.amazon.com/Income-Wealth-Greenwood-Business-Economics/dp/0313336881/ref=sr_1_1/002-2780348-3452824?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1193669389&sr=1-1) (Greenwood Press, 2006).

More by Alan Reynolds (http://www.cato.org/people/reynolds.html)

Meanwhile, both candidates are eager to spend more tens of billions a year on health-insurance subsidies, billions more for biofuels and (in Obama's case, at least) tens of billions more for several more refundable tax credits - checks to people who don't pay income tax. All these shameless vote-buying schemes would only worsen the real budget problem - which is runaway spending, not taxes.
Marginal tax rates are now much lower than they were in 1993 to 1996 on all incomes, large or small. And tax rates are much lower on dividends and capital gains. Yet the individual income tax brought in 8.5 percent of GDP last year - the same as in 1996 and much more than under the higher tax rates of '93-95.
Why do lower rates bring in as much money? In part because people do less to avoid taxes once rates are cut, in part because lower rates promote economic growth.
But the Democrats have an ideological bias against recognizing these clear facts - a naive faith in higher tax rates and an aversion to confronting excess spending. So they plan on two more tax hikes that won't work.
Obama wants to bring back the 28 percent tax on capital gains. In fact, our experience in the first Clinton administration proves that this would lose a lot of revenue: Investors would sit on stocks rather than sell and pay the tax.
The cap-gains tax dropped from 28 percent to 20 percent in 1997 - and revenues from that tax alone accounted for 12 percent of all individual income-tax payments from 1997 to 2000 - up from just 7.9 percent from 1993 to 1996.
Obama and Clinton also want to raise the tax on dividends from 15 percent to 39.6 percent. But that would just compel investors to liquidate blue-chip stocks at distress-sale prices and get back into tax-exempt bonds, cutting revenues further.
Higher tax rates on dividends and capital gains would crash the stock market yet do absolutely nothing to cut the deficit.
Other presidents have tried and failed to tax their way out of a budget squeeze. During the 1990 recession, the first President George Bush raised tax rates on "the rich," mostly by ending their deductions and exemptions. It didn't work: Individual income taxes brought in 8.3 percent of GDP in 1989 and just 7.6 percent of GDP by 1992.
President Bill Clinton then piled on another layer of high tax rates, 36 percent and 39.6 percent, while also greatly hiking taxes on Social Security benefits of working seniors. That failed, too: Individual income taxes brought in only 7.8 percent of GDP in 1993 and '94, 8.1 percent in 1995.
Federal revenues did not get much above the 1989 level until 1997 - when they rose because the capital-gains tax was cut.
In short, Obama is a "tax-and-spend" liberal, while Hillary is a "spend-and-tax" liberal. If either actually launched their gargantuan spending plans on the basis of imaginary revenues expected from taxing the rich, he or she would quickly end up having to tax the stuffing out of the middle class.

PetreTG
03-17-2008, 01:49 PM
yup...you denying your God, ron paul has anything negative in his past is intelligent alright. was ron paul born from a virgin? :laughing:
Just about ... there are few more honorable men in Congress. And deep down you know it.

What's sad here tap is ... you and I know the real reason you like Obama and it has nothing to do with his political stance. Hell ... you're willing to overlook glaring flaws in the man and his CURRENT associations .

All these threads and hundreds of posts and you cannot muster a credible argument as to WHY anyone should support him. WHY ?

Because the real reason you support Obama is because you relate to him. You see yourself , LIKE Obama and as such , you're willing to overlook so much obvious controversy about him.

In Illinois , Obama talked a good game , luckily his opponents imploded , but he was charismatic there too ... hiding all his dirty laundry behind the same phoney smile ... and ultimately what did he do during his time at the helm ... JACK SHIT. That's what he did. Lots of talk , no actions.

What does Obama have to offer when I look at him ?

Bad policies
Bad associations
Bad past choices
Bad current choices

All wrapped up and hidden behind a big smile and a lot of talk .

Trying to compare Paul to Obama ? That's like comparing Jesus Christ to Satan. :clap:

You chose , I will point out your errors later if he's elected , since you can't see them now.

Trplsec
03-17-2008, 01:50 PM
This is the kind of simple minded, ignorant thinking that has held back true victims of racism for years.

It couldn't possibly be Obama's connections to these questionable people that have voters wary of him...it HAS to be because he's black.

Here's a newsflash, Sly. Not everything bad that happens to a black man is the result of racism. It's possible to dislike Obama because of his associations, his stance on the issues, his inadequecy to be president. It doesn't have to be just because he's black.

As soon as you idiots can see past this, open your eyes to reality, stop trying to use racism as a crutch everytime something bad happens to a black person...the world will be a much better, happier and peaceful place. And then the real racism can be dealt with. But every bullshit cry of racism marginalizes true instances of racism.

As a black man, you should be ashamed of yourself.

TFK


As ironic and contrary as it is, this post will only enhance your legacy as a racist.

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 01:53 PM
As ironic and contrary as it is, this post will only enhance your legacy as a racist.

i agree

TFK hates muppets

TFK
03-17-2008, 01:53 PM
As ironic and contrary as it is, this post will only enhance your legacy as a racist.

Oh, I'm well aware of that.

But anyone with even a lick of common sense can see that it's the exact opposite.

Unfortunately, we have quite a few members here who will interperate my words for what they want it to say, not for what it actually says.

TFK

PetreTG
03-17-2008, 02:01 PM
Let's pretend for a moment that Obama was not a charismatic speaker ...

Who here thinks he would be doing so well if he presented his piss poor policies like say , Ron Paul speaks ...

with this look on his face all the time ?

http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/1339/obama0161lj8.jpg

:lol:

Therein lies the difference between real solutions and bullshit.


And THAT is what Obama is doing ... bullshitting his way to the Whitehouse.

http://www.truthwinsout.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/obama.jpg

slystaff
03-17-2008, 02:08 PM
This is the kind of simple minded, ignorant thinking that has held back true victims of racism for years.

It couldn't possibly be Obama's connections to these questionable people that have voters wary of him...it HAS to be because he's black.

Here's a newsflash, Sly. Not everything bad that happens to a black man is the result of racism. It's possible to dislike Obama because of his associations, his stance on the issues, his inadequecy to be president. It doesn't have to be just because he's black.

As soon as you idiots can see past this, open your eyes to reality, stop trying to use racism as a crutch everytime something bad happens to a black person...the world will be a much better, happier and peaceful place. And then the real racism can be dealt with. But every bullshit cry of racism marginalizes true instances of racism.

As a black man, you should be ashamed of yourself.

TFK

I agree with your post in principle, I also hate it when people cry race for no reason. however in this case it's not for no reason.

Obama has preached unity, love for his country, denounced prominent black leaders and words from black pastors who happen to say things that are at odds with his message. He has never played the race card and yet there are still people like you who want to condemn him based upon things HE HAS NOT DONE and NOT SAID.

So you tell me what the reason for this is

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 02:16 PM
I agree with your post in principle, I also hate it when people cry race for no reason. however in this case it's not for no reason.

Obama has preached unity, love for his country, denounced prominent black leaders and words from black pastors who happen to say things that are at odds with his message. He has never played the race card and yet there are still people like you who want to condemn him based upon things HE HAS NOT DONE and NOT SAID.

So you tell me what the reason for this is

so questionable connections with people isnt something to bring up?

i call BS, if any other candidate had any connection with someone like wright youd be all over them and you know it

ive never said obama personally held any of these views, however its questionable that he would associate himself with these people

this is also about hypocrisy, either you think this shit is racist or you dont, period, thats all im trying to get at, this dude is a raving lunatic and a racist, that obama would associate himself with this clown is something that could and should brought up

and it doesnt matter if obama has said these things himself or not, obama knew about this clown a long time ago and still put him on some BS committee, he only recently kicked his ass to the curb

phonetap
03-17-2008, 02:19 PM
so questionable connections with people isnt something to bring up?

i call BS, if any other candidate had any connection with someone like wright youd be all over them and you know it

ive never said obama personally held any of these views, however its questionable that he would associate himself with these people

this is also about hypocrisy, either you think this shit is racist or you dont, period, thats all im trying to get at, this dude is a raving lunatic and a racist, that obama would associate himself with this clown is something that could and should brought up

and it doesnt matter if obama has said these things himself or not, obama knew about this clown a long time ago and still put him on some BS committee, he only recently kicked his ass to the curb

what was said that was racist?

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 02:21 PM
what was said that was racist?

youve seen the tapes

if you cant see it for yourself than your beyond my help

slystaff
03-17-2008, 02:36 PM
so questionable connections with people isnt something to bring up?

i call BS, if any other candidate had any connection with someone like wright youd be all over them and you know it

ive never said obama personally held any of these views, however its questionable that he would associate himself with these people

this is also about hypocrisy, either you think this shit is racist or you dont, period, thats all im trying to get at, this dude is a raving lunatic and a racist, that obama would associate himself with this clown is something that could and should brought up

and it doesnt matter if obama has said these things himself or not, obama knew about this clown a long time ago and still put him on some BS committee, he only recently kicked his ass to the curbNonsense.

So if you had an uncle who loves you and gives generously to your family and takes you fishing etc...blah blah...bottomline you have a relationship with him...but he happens to have racist views....he wouldn't kill a black man or anything...but he certainly wouldn't vote for a black man to become president under any circumstance...you telling me that you'd cut him out of your life and kick his ass to the curb based upon this?

Answer the question yes or no

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 02:42 PM
Nonsense.

So if you had an uncle who loves you and gives generously to your family and takes you fishing etc...blah blah...bottomline you have a relationship with him...but he happens to have racist views....he wouldn't kill a black man or anything...but he certainly wouldn't vote for a black man to become president under any circumstance...you telling me that you'd cut him out of your life and kick his ass to the curb based upon this?

Answer the question yes or no

firstly this guy isnt obamas uncle

secondly im not running for president

thirdly you know youd be all over mccain or anyone else

fourthly obama knew about this guy long before this whole thing started and only kicked him out recently, before that he put him on some committee, at that point it went past "just some crazy uncle"

and to answer your question, no i wouldnt kick that uncle out of my life, but i sure as hell wouldnt vote for him for president or anyone that decided itd be a great idea to put him on a political committee

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 02:43 PM
so now you answer the question, is what this guy has been saying racist or is it not?

yes or no

slystaff
03-17-2008, 02:44 PM
firstly this guy isnt obamas uncle

secondly im not running for president

thirdly you know youd be all over mccain or anyone else

fourthly obama knew about this guy long before this whole thing started and only kicked him out recently, before that he put him on some committee, at that point it went past "just some crazy uncle"

and to answer your question, no i wouldnt kick that uncle out of my life, but i sure as hell wouldnt vote for him for president or anyone that decided itd be a great idea to put him on a political committeeThis is the only part of your post which answers my question and is remotely relevant. And THAT my friend is my point.

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 02:46 PM
This is the only part of your post which answers my question and is remotely relevant. And THAT my friend is my point.

:lol:

i have no control over who my uncle is

obama does however have control over what church he goes to

and obama isnt kicking the guy out of his life either, he just removed him from that committee

coincidentally enough, some black leaders have spoken out against obama speaking out against wright :lol:

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 02:51 PM
btw everyone is so enamoured with obamas charisma and speaking ability

i didnt even think he was the best speaker out of all the candidates running this year

huckabee is MUCH better imo

Arben
03-17-2008, 02:58 PM
The pastor of my church is against gay marriage, premarital sex, abortion, and girls showing their shoulders. Does that mean I agree with him?

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:00 PM
The pastor of my church is against gay marriage, premarital sex, abortion, and girls showing their shoulders. Does that mean I agree with him?

didnt know you were running for president

i do wonder why youd stay at such a church however

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:03 PM
get educated fools:

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Arben
03-17-2008, 03:04 PM
didnt know you were running for president

i do wonder why youd stay at such a church however
Well, all churches pretty much preach the same thing. But when you go to a church, and that's your community, you can't exactly just up and leave. Sure, you can do that, but many of those people pretty much become a part of your family.

slystaff
03-17-2008, 03:08 PM
:lol:

i have no control over who my uncle is

obama does however have control over what church he goes to

and obama isnt kicking the guy out of his life either, he just removed him from that committee

coincidentally enough, some black leaders have spoken out against obama speaking out against wright :lol:Yeah, Obama is in a no win situation with this and the white media LOVES putting him in this position. The lesson learned from all of this is that in future NO BLACK MAN should waste their time, money and energy in trying to Run for President. If Obama couldn't make it...then it's futile...

Sure Obama has control over what church he goes to, but if he has a relationship with teh guy, he can't just condemn him because the guy has certain views that he doesn't agree with.

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:08 PM
Well, all churches pretty much preach the same thing. But when you go to a church, and that's your community, you can't exactly just up and leave. Sure, you can do that, but many of those people pretty much become a part of your family.

i understand that, "however" you should understand if someone has serious questions about your affiliation with said church if it does preach those things, thats the point, it doesnt matter if obama believes these things or not

people are judged alot on the company they keep, if mccain went to a church that preached a "white values system" and his pastor was calling the US of Black Panther A and was friendly with a known terrorist, people would be all over him, whether he actually held those views or not

THATS the point

slystaff
03-17-2008, 03:09 PM
btw everyone is so enamoured with obamas charisma and speaking ability

i didnt even think he was the best speaker out of all the candidates running this year

huckabee is MUCH better imoHuckabee doesn't captivate an audience like Obama. Stop being silly...

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:11 PM
Yeah, Obama is in a no win situation with this and the white media LOVES putting him in this position. The lesson learned from all of this is that in future NO BLACK MAN should waste their time, money and energy in trying to Run for President. If Obama couldn't make it...then it's futile...

Sure Obama has control over what church he goes to, but if he has a relationship with teh guy, he can't just condemn him because the guy has certain views that he doesn't agree with.

:rolleyes:

yeah the WHITE media.... right

ive seen plenty of black folks who feel the same, just go to youtube, watch any news outlet

and if obama doesnt become president itll have little to do with his race i guarentee that, once people actually get past this whole novel feeling they have right now and get into the nuts and bolts of his plans theyll begin to realize this man has no clue

just read the articles i posted, obama wants to spend this country into "bolivion"

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:12 PM
Huckabee doesn't captivate an audience like Obama. Stop being silly...

id take huckabee head to head over obama ANY day

huckabee is a MUCH better speaker

Arben
03-17-2008, 03:12 PM
i understand that, "however" you should understand if someone has serious questions about your affiliation with said church if it does preach those things, thats the point, it doesnt matter if obama believes these things or not

people are judged alot on the company they keep, if mccain went to a church that preached a "white values system" and his pastor was calling the US of Black Panther A and was friendly with a known terrorist, people would be all over him, whether he actually held those views or not

THATS the point
So then what's your point?

Like I said, you can't just dump your pastor or the parishioners. Especially in an area where he was the community leader and a politician.

When I vote for someone, I'm voting for that person, not his/her pastor.

Arben
03-17-2008, 03:13 PM
id take huckabee head to head over obama ANY day

huckabee is a MUCH better speaker
No, man. Obama takes the cake on this one. Huckabee is good, but not that good.

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:15 PM
No, man. Obama takes the cake on this one. Huckabee is good, but not that good.

id debate that, i bet one on one huckabee would take obama

slystaff
03-17-2008, 03:19 PM
id take huckabee head to head over obama ANY day

huckabee is a MUCH better speakerHuckabee is a very good speaker and he'd likely beat Obama in terms of debate skills.

But in terms of speech delivery....it's NOT EVEN CLOSE compadre! Obama wins handily.

phonetap
03-17-2008, 03:22 PM
youve seen the tapes

if you cant see it for yourself than your beyond my help

again: what was said that was racist?

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:22 PM
Huckabee is a very good speaker and he'd likely beat Obama in terms of debate skills.

But in terms of speech delivery....it's NOT EVEN CLOSE compadre! Obama wins handily.

hed likely beat obama in a debate?

hed CRUSH obama in a debate, hell until like the last 2 debates hillary was beating him

and as far as the other..... :lol:

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:23 PM
again: what was said that was racist?

i find it funny that you comment on the issue when it appears you havent even seen the tapes, if you did youd know what i was referring to

other than that if your too fucken lazy to do some research of your own than thats your problem, not mine

phonetap
03-17-2008, 03:24 PM
:lol:

i have no control over who my uncle is

obama does however have control over what church he goes to

and obama isnt kicking the guy out of his life either, he just removed him from that committee

coincidentally enough, some black leaders have spoken out against obama speaking out against wright :lol:

now if phonetap didn't already know that you idolized ty cobb he might give you the benefit of the doubt...but you are completely full of shit. if ty cobb were reincarnated, you'd drop to you knees and suck his racist cock...and don't even begin to pretend otherwise.

phonetap
03-17-2008, 03:26 PM
i find it funny that you comment on the issue when it appears you havent even seen the tapes, if you did youd know what i was referring to

other than that if your too fucken lazy to do some research of your own than thats your problem, not mine

since you've seen the tapes, send phonetap a link because he hasn't heard anything racist yet.

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:27 PM
now if phonetap didn't already know that you idolized ty cobb he might give you the benefit of the doubt...but you are completely full of shit. if ty cobb were reincarnated, you'd drop to you knees and suck his racist cock...and don't even begin to pretend otherwise.

i wouldnt vote for cobb for president

and i admire his skills, ferocity on the field, and his will to win

i never said i admired his racism

just another instance of you putting words in someones mouth

how about you just do the world a favor and die in a fire

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:27 PM
since you've seen the tapes, send phonetap a link because he hasn't heard anything racist yet.

look it up yourself

its not my day to babysit

phonetap
03-17-2008, 03:31 PM
i wouldnt vote for cobb for president

and i admire his skills, ferocity on the field, and his will to win

i never said i admired his racism

just another instance of you putting words in someones mouth

how about you just do the world a favor and die in a fire

no one is voting for rev wright as president either...nice try but no cigar.

bottom line, you personally idolize baseballs most notorious badguy and racist and then try to pass judgement on others. you are a hypocritical piece of shit and that's why you get mad when called on your bullshit...:laughing:

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:32 PM
actually, im feeling charitable today:

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phonetap
03-17-2008, 03:32 PM
look it up yourself

its not my day to babysit

that's because you are full of shit.

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:36 PM
no one is voting for rev wright as president either...nice try but no cigar.

bottom line, you personally idolize baseballs most notorious badguy and racist and then try to pass judgement on others. you are a hypocritical piece of shit and that's why you get mad when called on your bullshit...:laughing:


im not running for president so your point is moot, and besides liking a baseball players for their skills AS a ballplayer is alot different from having a flaming racist as a close and personal confidant

id just love to see how youd react if mccain went to a church whose pastor was the grand wizard of the KKK

your ass would be in here pissing and moaning and bitching like a woman on her period

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:37 PM
that's because you are full of shit.

one post up fuckface

and i posted it because i knew your lazy ass would never take a look so you could make an actual objective observation, if your even capable of it

phonetap
03-17-2008, 03:38 PM
actually, im feeling charitable today:


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<embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/hwQWuQVE6sw&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></OBJECT></P>
there was nothing racist there. racially divisive? agreed. anti-american? arguably, yes. brutally truthful in a couple of instances? definitely.

bottom line, do you even know what racism is? :laughing:

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:40 PM
there was nothing racist there. racially divisive? agreed. anti-american? arguably, yes. brutally truthful in a couple of instances? definitely.

bottom line, do you even know what racism is? :laughing:

here we go with this game again, i say yes i do then post it and then clever you says that you made me question the definition and i played right into your game

and wtf is the difference between racially divisive and racism? sounds like semantics to me

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:47 PM
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:laughing: :laughing:

"barack isnt rich and privledged"

phonetap
03-17-2008, 03:48 PM
im not running for president so your point is moot, and besides liking a baseball players for their skills AS a ballplayer is alot different from having a flaming racist as a close and personal confidant

id just love to see how youd react if mccain went to a church whose pastor was the grand wizard of the KKK

your ass would be in here pissing and moaning and bitching like a woman on her period

now you are babbling incoherently because you are desperately trying to cover your own ass. you know the old saying, "people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones". at least barack obama has condemned the statements his pastor has said....you've NEVER at any time condemned anything ty cobb has said, you've always ignored cobb's racist views, used his images as avatars then have the audacity to pass judgement on the attitudes of currrent players like barry bonds. you have a well documented history of not applying your self-righteous sensibilities across the racial spectrum...sorry but there is a pattern with you that can no longer be ignored. not saying you are personally a racist but be a man and admit white racism doesn't bother you as much as black racism (or what you perceive as black racism). you are only human, admit to it...

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:53 PM
now you are babbling incoherently because you are desperately trying to cover your own ass. you know the old saying, "people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones". at least barack obama has condemned the statements his pastor has said....you've NEVER at any time condemned anything ty cobb has said, you've always ignored cobb's racist views, used his images as avatars then have the audacity to pass judgement on the attitudes of currrent players like barry bonds. you have a well documented history of not applying your self-righteous sensibilities across the racial spectrum...sorry but there is a pattern with you that can no longer be ignored. not saying you are personally a racist but be a man and admit white racism doesn't bother you as much as black racism (or what you perceive as black racism). you are only human, admit to it...

i didnt know i had to denounce a dead man :dunno:

but if it makes you feel any better i not only denounce it but i also reject cobbs racist views :lol:

instead of trying to change the subject from is obamas pastor racist or not to ty cobb and "white racism" why dont you just answer the question at hand?

im against racism in any form, last i knew ive been preaching for a while now that not only do i but everyone should view people as individuals, racism cant exist without the collectivist mindset

phonetap
03-17-2008, 03:55 PM
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:laughing: :laughing:

"barack isnt rich and privledged"

maybe compared to your poor ass, but barack has far less money than hillary or guliani....that was rev wrights point. that being said, phonetap doesn't agree with wrights methods...he should have known this crap would come back and cause obama problems...:doh:

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:55 PM
instead of perpetuating the issue by just arguing in circles how about we argue something more concrete, like policy for instance? :dunno:

just an idea

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 03:56 PM
maybe compared to your poor ass, but barack has far less money than hillary or guliani....that was rev wrights point. that being said, phonetap doesn't agree with wrights methods...he should have known this crap would come back and cause obama problems...:doh:

dude rich is rich

oprah isnt rich compared to bill gates but her ass is still rich

phonetap
03-17-2008, 04:03 PM
i didnt know i had to denounce a dead man :dunno:

but if it makes you feel any better i not only denounce it but i also reject cobbs racist views :lol:

instead of trying to change the subject from is obamas pastor racist or not to ty cobb and "white racism" why dont you just answer the question at hand?

im against racism in any form, last i knew ive been preaching for a while now that not only do i but everyone should view people as individuals, racism cant exist without the collectivist mindset

what assbackwards logic...are you saying it's okay to idoloze a dead man's ball playing skills but not okay to denunciate his personally racist views. do you have any clue what you are talking about...you're speaking in unintelligible circles...:laughing:

it's funny that you bring up view people as individuals...you aren't viewing barack obama as an individual, you're viewing him through your distorted prism of association.

phonetap
03-17-2008, 04:04 PM
instead of perpetuating the issue by just arguing in circles how about we argue something more concrete, like policy for instance? :dunno:

just an idea

agREED...be back later.

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 04:10 PM
what assbackwards logic...are you saying it's okay to idoloze a dead man's ball playing skills but not okay to denunciate his personally racist views. do you have any clue what you are talking about...you're speaking in unintelligible circles...:laughing:

it's funny that you bring up view people as individuals...you aren't viewing barack obama as an individual, you're viewing him through your distorted prism of association.

wrong again fuckface

if as an individual you decide to associate yourself with racists and terrorists than be prepared to answer questions

it was obamas choice to associate with these people, no one elses

as far as cobb, i didnt realize his personal views were relevant to the 2008 election

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 04:10 PM
agREED...be back later.

good atleast we can agree on that :lol:

Arben
03-17-2008, 04:23 PM
instead of perpetuating the issue by just arguing in circles how about we argue something more concrete, like policy for instance? :dunno:

just an idea
Tell that to Petre...

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 04:24 PM
Tell that to Petre...

his point is valid, theres just no use in arguing it

mexican wedding shirt
03-17-2008, 04:32 PM
The reverand looks more or less white :lol:

He is the whitest brother I've ever seen. He could be a rugged Yorkshireman.

atomicdOGg34
03-17-2008, 04:33 PM
The reverand looks more or less white :lol:

He is the whitest brother I've ever seen. He could be a rugged Yorkshireman.

you calling him an uncle tom you racist pile?



























:lol:

PetreTG
03-17-2008, 05:06 PM
Back up the truck for a big load of bullshit coming , tomorrow ? :cool:

This will be as genuine as his dennouncing Farrakhan. In other words ... not truth , just damage control.

:shit: :shit: :shit: :shit: :shit:
-----------------

March 17, 2008
Categories: Barack Obama (http://dyn.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/index.cfm/category/BarackObama)

Obama plans major race speech tomorrow


Barack Obama will give a major speech on "the larger issue of race in this campaign," he told reporters in Monaca, PA just now.


He was pressed there, as he has been at recent appearances, on statements by his former pastor, Jeremiah Wright.


"I am going to be talking about not just Reverend Wright, but the larger issue of race in this campaign," he said.


He added that he would "talk about how some of these issues are perceived from within the black church issue for example," he said.


He also briefly defended Wright from the image that has come through in a handful of repeatedly televised clips from recent Wright sermons.


"The caricature that’s being painted of him is not accurate," he said.


The speech could offer Obama an opportunity to move past the controversy over his pastor, and to turn the conversation to a topic he'd rather focus on: his Christian faith. But the speech also guarantees that the Wright story will continue to dominate political headlines.


Mitt Romney's attempt directly to address his Mormonism last year never decisively put the issue to rest for some voters.

Obama's schedule puts him in Philadelphia tomorrow.

TFK
03-17-2008, 05:19 PM
I agree with your post in principle, I also hate it when people cry race for no reason. however in this case it's not for no reason.

Obama has preached unity, love for his country, denounced prominent black leaders and words from black pastors who happen to say things that are at odds with his message. He has never played the race card and yet there are still people like you who want to condemn him based upon things HE HAS NOT DONE and NOT SAID.

So you tell me what the reason for this is

He has done this all after the fact.

He's in major spin mode. First he compared Wright to a 'crazy uncle'. Then he claimed he was 'unaware' that Wright was preaching the nonsense he was preaching, in spite of him being a member of the church for close to 20 years. Was he 'unaware' of the close association between Wright and Farrakhan as well?

This has nothing to do with racism, and deep down inside, you know it.

TFK

TFK
03-17-2008, 05:28 PM
Yeah, Obama is in a no win situation with this and the white media LOVES putting him in this position. The lesson learned from all of this is that in future NO BLACK MAN should waste their time, money and energy in trying to Run for President. If Obama couldn't make it...then it's futile...

Sure Obama has control over what church he goes to, but if he has a relationship with teh guy, he can't just condemn him because the guy has certain views that he doesn't agree with.

Damn Sly, your stock has plummeted on this site over the past few weeks, and it's because of garbage like this.

Could it at all be possible that Obama is being attacked because....oh, I don't know...he's a politican running for President??????

How are these attacks on Obama's character any different then the Swiftboat Veterans attacks on John Kerry? This is what happens in Presidential elections, and color has zero to do with it.

Hell, even Phonetap said...

what do you think would have happened if ron paul was a leading presidential candidate? people would have been digging into his background pulling up whatever skeletons they could find to use against him.

So I'm supposed to believe people would be attacking Paul for a different reason then they are attacking Obama? I'm supposed to believe that the Swiftboat Vets attacked Kerry for a different reason people are attacking Obama?

Jesus Sly, it's so damn obvious that you so desperately want white people to be racists, even when they're not, you're letting it cloud your judgement and common sense. It's even more clear that absolutely nothing is more important to you about any of this then the fact that Obama is a black man.

In your failed attempts to label everyone as racists, the only racist that was exposed was yourself.

TFK

mexican wedding shirt
03-17-2008, 05:33 PM
Yeah sly, he has a point.

You're getting all worked up and emotional, you need to chill.

Every politician or presidential candidate gets attacked, and often in sneaky, underhand ways etc, almost every skeleton in the closet ends up being exposed.

It's certainly nothing new with Obama, and not because he's black.

TFK
03-17-2008, 05:36 PM
And save all the 'White America won't allow a black man to be President' nonsense when Hillary Clinton and the Super Delegates steal the nomination from Obama. His skin color has nothing to do with it.

She would steal the nomination from her own mother.

TFK

slystaff
03-17-2008, 05:36 PM
Back up the truck for a big load of bullshit coming , tomorrow ? :cool:

This will be as genuine as his dennouncing Farrakhan. In other words ... not truth , just damage control.


So?

1. Was Clinton's denouncing of geraldine Feraro's comments or her husband's, genuine? Politicians have historically "pandered" when necessary.

2. How can you expect Obama to happily reject and denounce his former Pastor. If he did that...he would be a complete hypocrite. The man is his friend. He has to proceed very carefully indeed. He has to remove the fears of teh electorate but he mustn't stomp all over this man.

slystaff
03-17-2008, 05:38 PM
Yeah sly, he has a point.

You're getting all worked up and emotional, you need to chill.

Every politician or presidential candidate gets attacked, and often in sneaky, underhand ways etc, almost every skeleton in the closet ends up being exposed.

It's certainly nothing new with Obama, and not because he's black.TFK has a point but I don't recall inviting you into this discussion. Leave us big boys to discuss this matter.