Epic battle. No idea who would've won. Could easily go the full 15 rounds with both men refusing to lay down and severely beaten down.
Frazier beats the ever living SHIT out of Rocky.. Rocky would wake up a week later and move to Panama and open a Pineapple stand
agREED I also think that he would use the Dildo in Rocky's ass, then after it's all covered in dung and blood he'd put it in rocky's mouth!!
Marciano not getting enough respect here....Ali said that was probably the only guy that could beat him....and that was based on a for fun in the ring experience where he felt the power of Rocky...also interesting is that Rocky faced the kind of fighters that could give any fighter his style some problems (masterful hall of fame boxer punchers) and yet he still won against them having said that....Marciano hurt his own legacy by retiring a little early...i know his back was bothering him but knocking out some of the "new generation" big black guys like Hurricane Jackson, Valdez, and Patterson would have put him in an almost untouchable category....i think if he knew there would be questions he would have done it over again
Marciano gets too much respect around here.. he beat some bums and washed up or hurt guys.. he would get dominated by Frazier, Foreman etc. he was a LHW really and would get whupped
This is head on trainwreck. In such a matchup you have to favor the bigger guy every time, especially when the smaller guy isn't faster.
He was a Cruiserweight. The best Cruiserweight there's ever been (would have been too strong for Holy at that weight), but a Cruiser none the less. This isn't about selling Rocky short. It's about size. Frazier was too big for Marciano.
Marciano was 5'10" & weighed ~185 when he stepped into the ring. He was about the size of your average modern light heavyweight.
Holyfield-Marciano at cruiser is possibly the MM I'd pay to see more than any other. Frazier too big though.
All action but Joe is too big and he's quicker. He gets Rocky out of there at some point. Rocky versus any great fighter you want to name between 180 and 200 pounds is a good match, IMO. The guy was for real. Rocky versus Holyfield at 190 is a surefire epic.
No, I think Marciano was a naturally bigger, and CERTAINLY stronger man than any light heavy. He was freakishly strong, both in terms of power and physical strength. Kov is my favorite current fighter, but Marciano would have destroyed Kov. Just too big, and too strong. He was a cruiserweight.
The Toney who ruined Jirov in '03 would beat Marciano. Roy Jones Jr circa '99-01 beats him as well. Hell, I'm not sure I'd pick Marciano over Oscar Bonavena.
Marciano would have beaten the fuck outta Toney, and I'm one of the top Toney fans on this forum. The difference in class between Rocky and Jirov is astronomical. Marciano was 10x stronger than Jirov, hit 10x harder, and had a 50x better chin. Much better stamina as well, AND a much better defense.
Naturally bigger based on what? If a guy is entering the ring at 185 lb today, odds are he's a light heavyweight or possibly a super middle. Even if he has this mythic strength (that didn't prevent him from looking sloppy and getting outboxed by a 40 year old Walcott for long stretches), how would that change his weight class? That's like saying "oh, GGG is really strong, so he's actually a light heavyweight." It drives me nuts when people use their subjective and arbitrary metrics for deciding how "big" they think someone is. That isn't how weight classes work. Marciano was in the right place at the right time. A few years later, Sonny Liston would've murked his ass.
10x better defense? :: Have you ever actually seen Marciano fight? Who did Marciano look so great against that people turn him into this monster? Was Jirov ever dropped before he fought Toney, btw? What are you basing his having a bad chin on? Marciano got dropped by a 40 year old Walcott.
Another poster said in a previous thread and I agree with that Marciano boiled himself down to 185-190. Today, he'd be closer to a SOLID 200. The light heavy division has always been one of the most prestigious in the sport. If Rocky COULD HAVE dropped 10 more pounds to compete at 175, then move up to become a two-division champ, I'm sure he would have. The impression I get from Marciano is that he trained like an animal, and likely couldn't have dropped below that 180 range. I'll say again - he was bigger than a light heavy, and if you put him in his prime today he'd be so destructive at cruiser that he would have made that division popular.
Also this is a tricky one since both are short guys and both would need to get inside to be successful
Boiled himself down? WTF? The guy wasn't dehydrated at 185-190, he was just in shape. With added weight, he'd have lost the sole attribute that allowed him to overwhelm old men in the late rounds (his stamina). The light heavyweight division is one of the most prestigious in the sport? Again, WTF? It's nothing compared to the heavyweight division, and especially back then. No fighter is going to struggle to make light heavy if they can be a heavyweight instead - cruiser didn't exist back then. And the reason cruiser is a wasteland now is because guys who fight at cruiser would rather chase the bigger bucks/prestige at heavy, instead. Being 185 lb and in shape doesn't make you bigger than a modern light heavy. Shit, Chavez Jr was coming in at 185 for 160 lb fights. Welcome to 2015, Bert Sugar. Here, we have day before weigh-ins and modern dehydration/rehydration techniques. Here, Rocky is a light heavy because here, 185 lb is no longer a heavyweight.. and since light heavy is so prestigious according to you, why would he not drop a mere 10 lb of water weight (relatively little by today's standards) and fight there instead of the wasteland cruiserweight division?
I am not sure at all about that. It is difficult to see the realistic picture of Marciano through the legend. How strong was he actually? I don't know really. He did have plenty of stamina and he definitely hit hard for a small guy, but he could be hurt, he rarely ever KOed anyone with single shots and Toney was difficult to beat with his style
I think Marciano was legit, he was just a tiny heavyweight, a cruiser basically. Even modern cruisers like Haye and Holy are significantly bigger. So no, he wouldn't beat Frazier but he'd beat the absolute crap out of Toney, I have no doubt about that.
Styles make fights. 40 year old ex-light heavyweights ("light heavyweight" in a 1950s context) have a hard time dealing with a swarming heavyweight (again, 1950s context) pressure fighter. I don't think the 2003 version of Toney would have the same issues, Marciano is absolutely tailor made for him.