Better left hook: Felix "Tito" Trinidad or Sugar Ray Leonard

Ahhh yes, and how much time between fights before that?

Also - this should be funny - who did Tito fight seven months earlier?

 

I have a nasty habit of butting into e-conversations without checking what people are actually really talking about. Sorry. ray:

 

Because I don't agree that a schooling at the hands of Hopkins, in his third weight class after years at the top in lower divisions, and a schooling at the hands of Wright almost four years since he had fought a top guy is evidence that he could never do something.

 

A tough eight round fight against a guy that couldn't beat Kendall Holt. :dunno:

Tito was obviously faded man, get with it.

 

But then again, what adjustment could Tito have really made in that fight?

The only thing I could think of was to just try and outwork Winky but I don't think Tito is that kind of fighter.

Nor could he have sat back and countered.

But Winky was a great fighter. I just think that people today assume that anyone with a jab is better than Tito and thats not true. I think you have to be a great fighter to shut down Trinidad which Hopkins and Wright were.

Oscar had success but was too much of a bitch to close the show for fear of getting caught.

 

No, it was a product of not being able to close the show. He had the perfect fight plan and was in the best condition of his life. He simply didnt have it to close the show.

 

I thought you were referring to Delahoya?:giggle:

 

This is what I feel his main mistake was. Everyone knows you are supposed to get your foot outside. It didn't look to me like Tito even tried to do this and I never heard his corner ask him to do this. I think Tito tried to win, I don't think he was shot, I don't think Wright did anything special, I just think Tito made things easy for Winky by fighting like a putz.

 

::

 

HORSESHIT

Every fighter who stuck a good jab in his face and employed solid lateral movement utterly bamboozled Tito... DLH, Hopkins and Wright all made him look utterly ridiculous for long stretches

the problem with the other guys is that none of them had the skill sets to do what those guys did... Who is Tito's greatest victory? Vargas? Oba Carr? Hell, it may even be the totally used up Pernell Whitaker he went up against... you want to know why "only" three guys (three is, by the way, an ASTRONOMICAL number of different guys humiliating the same guy with essentially the same weapon if that guy is supposedly a "great" fighter) completely baffled him and why two of those guys lost nary a minute against him while the other one lost only those minutes he gave away? its because these were the only significant jabbers on Trinidad's resume, they were also easily the three most durable and disciplined men he ever faced

 

I give up, your right Tito sucks, anyone with a jab destroys him :bears:

 

yeah, clearly thats exactly what I said

 

It makes me wonder if they were watching the same guy fight

 

Hopkins was too big for Tito anyway. He beat De La Hoya. He was past prime against Wright.

 

The problem with Vargas is that he was all balls, no brains. Vargas fighting a smarter fight beats Trinidad.

does "TLC" stand for "Tito's Little Cockboy?"

 

Agreed. People say Vargas fought the wrong fight versus Trinidad by getting into too many exchanges, but the momentum changing moments didn't come when Vargas slugging it out with Tito. Tito simply countered a jab in round 1 from Vargas and knocked him silly. Vargas regained momentum in the 4th with the KD and dominated the 5th, but Trinidad hurt him late in round 6 with a long right hand. Vargas was just boxing and trying to use the ring, but Trinidad was able to get to him. For the next couple of rounds, Vargas continued to try to box and use angles, but Trinidad was getting to him with good shots. Finally in the 9th, after Trinidad again got to Vargas with a long right hand, Vargas decided to stay and trade with Tito, and took hard punches.

Sure, Vargas didn't do his health any good by trading, or trying to exchange left hooks, but all that probably changes about the result if he didn't do this is that Trinidad wins by UD rather than stoppage.

At least he was willing to take the risk of getting laid out when doing this. He was losing the fight otherwise.

 

It's been a long time since I've watched the fight, but I remember Vargas trading in the early rounds, outboxing Tito in the middle rounds and then choosing to trade again in the later rounds after he got caught again.

Tito did save himself in the 4th by throwing low blows, though.

 

Not really.

Trinidad was just better than Vargas. Fernando was a very good fighter with good skills but his defense lacked. Even when he boxed, he wasn't very mobile.

Hopkins and De La Hoya not only had the skills, but they had the abilities to get away from Trinidad's incoming.

Vargas did not. And hence thats why he would have never beaten Tito.

 

I don't know who had the better left hook. But what I do know is that the left hook being thrown by a conventional fighter is the most dangerous punch in boxing. There is no better punch to land then the left hook. I'll Holla 5000

 

Vargas could have fought a smarter fioght but I think he still would have gotten knocked out... Vargas was suceptible to the hook as it was, and to me he lacked the durability to take it, which he invariably would, no matter how well he was jabbing