Lyle KO4 Williams was a great puncher with the chin of an accounts receivable supervisor Lyle could take a shot and respond and was just clearly better
It's easy to say Lyle would win, because he looked so much better against a rusty Foreman than Williams did with a peaking Liston. That said, Lyle truly was the better man. Broader boxing skills, better recuperative powers & a stronger set of whiskers, & similar hitting power. Lyle could be caught with his hands low, though, & if Shavers could nearly put him out, Williams should not be discounted. Lyle would have been dispatched by a 1960-vintage Liston in much the same dominant way Williams was. I have Lyle winning by knockout in six.
no way, Ramonza!:: you know I like you, man, but I don't see how you can objectively come up with Williams > Shavers Cleveland Williams has ONE NOTABLE VICTORY in his entire 90 plus fight career... a 7th round TKO win over Ernie Terrell (who returned the favor a year later with a decision victory) ... that is IT... unless you think beating Alex Miteff is a significant accomplishment (I certainly don't) ... in every other respect, Williams ranks as little more than a notable KO artist against clubfighters... he faced exactly four truly good heavyweights during his prime years... Satterfield, who pretty much destroyed him, Liston who turned the trick easily twice and Eddie Machen, against whom he managed a home-cookin draw... thats IT... thats his entire career against good opposition when he was still at his best.... the rest is guys that were unranked... a handful are passibly familiar to fanatics like us (Sonny Banks, for instance) but that doesnt mean they were good fighters... the rest? only their relatives know who they are Shavers? Shavers has early round near-decapitations of Young, Ellis, and Norton ... that is better than Williams' entire career... the rest of Shavers victories are a mixed bag of fighters on a similar level as those Williams beat, but Shavers has fewer soft touches in there than Williams does for sure... but those three victories loom large next to Williams bare cupboard of wins... Shavers competed in a much deeper division... every possible way of rating what they actually did in their careers favors Shavers clearly again, I would take Shavers over Williams every day of the week
I must admit, that is pretty comprehensive. Maybe my disregard for Shavers got the better of me on this one (though I do not concede Young, who was completely green & not a shadow of the fighter he would become). Fair play, CDogg. I will yield Williams for Shavers. At least we agree he's not in Lyle's class.
definitely... Lyle was better than both (though Shavers hurt him real bad early on in their fight) but clearly, lyle had more overall tools than either guy
Tough one here. I knew Cleveland as a kid when he was training Rocky Johnson (Dwayne "The Rock Johnson's dad) for a wrestling/boxing match here in Houston in 1979, and he was a very bitter man towards Patterson for ducking him, said Floyd was garbage and a chicken, and disgraced the sport..his words, not mine. Two very authentically mean and tough men here: Lyle murdered two men and Cleveland beat several half to death in poolrooms and on the mean streets here. Cleveland was a better all around fighter, but Ron the more durable under heavy assaults. Ron would have to weather and survive a fearsome assault from Williams, and I don't know if he could have done that, as that was not the way to fight Williams, lying on the ropes as he did Shavers and Foreman. It would not have gone the route. Williams wins in the third round by ten count knockout.
