Mayweather Jr. vs Ortiz September 17

Sly, are you OK with the fact that Mayweather managed to not fight any of the threats in the weight class in which he calls himself champion?

Are you really OK with his resume at 147 given the quality of guys that have hovered around the weight class during his tenure there?

It's useless to argue here with you because you're obviously set in your beliefs.

Cotto
Both won major titles at 147 at then end of 2006. It made sense for them to fight each other. The fight never happened. Maybe Mayweather did not "duck" Cotto, but he sure never went out of his way to try and make the fight happen.

Margarito
Was the WBO champion when Mayweather entered into the WW division. Called Mayweather out numerous times to which Mayweather replied "what has he done to deserve a shot at me".

Article from ESPN detailing how Mayweather sooner bought his way out of his contract with Arum rather than fight Margarito: http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/news/story?id=2420382

You never replied to other posters pointing out the fact that Mayweather instead fought Baldomir for $1 more than the offer that was on the table to fight Margarito. Do you seriously believe this was because Mayweather cared about the lineal WW belt?

Paul Williams
Also called Mayweather out numerous times. When asked about the possibility of a Mayweather-Pac fight, this was his response:

 

Damien what are you going on about?

Cotto fought just ONE Welterweight fight in 2006 and that was his FIRST Welterweight fight and that was in DECEMBER. Floyd had ALREADY beaten both Baldi and Zab and signed to fight Oscar at 154lbs.

Williams only became a factor after Floyd had already planned to meet Hatton .

Margarito wasn't a worthy name at the time Floyd entered the division. Baldi and Zab were more meaningful fights...and more prestigious belts.

 

You conveniently didn't answer any of my questions.

Mayweather won the WBC WW title in November 2006. Cotto won the WBA WW title in December 2006. What about this are you not understanding?

Let's not forget that after the DLH fight, after Mayweather fought Hatton, Larry Merchant asked Mayweather point blank if he would fight Cotto. Mayweather, rather than saying yes he would like to fight Cotto, went on a tirade about how the sport of boxing would not retire him, how he would instead retire on his own. After that he disappeared for nearly 2 years while the top guys fought one another. He then, after all of the top guys had knocked each other off, conveniently comes out of retirement and fights a career featherweight in Marquez as his comeback fight at WELTERWEIGHT.

If you seriously believe that fighting Carlos Baldomir was more meaningful than fighting Margarito than I don't know what to tell you.

 

Tell me that I'm right! Margarito was a WBO Titlist who had only beaten Cintron, and Baldomir was the undisputed WW Champion having beaten the man who beat the man who beat the man...

Fuck Margarito!

Should George Foreman have fought Lennox Lewis or Riddick Bowe instead of Michael Moorer using your logic?

 

Pacman 5' 5 1/2" started career at 106lbs
Floyd 5' 8" started career at 130lbs

Yet... Floyd is scared shitless to fight Pacman not to mention all the big/strong welter's that Pacman has already destroyed. Head to head fights Pacman has also beaten common opponents way easier. Oscar practically won his fight with Floyd. Pacman had him shitting himself in the corner begging to stop by round 8. Hatton took Floyd more than half the fight to land his shots, Pacman had him unconcious before the end of 2. He had Mosely beat to a pulp and begging to quit, never happened against Floyd. There's no comparison.

 

shit like this makes mayweather jr fans look bad. sheer bias. baldomir was a bum and margarito wouldve murdered him. baldomir isnt among the 10 or even 15 best opponents mayweather jr has fought.

 

Mayweather earned the right to disapear for a few years. That's the thing. Since beating Hernandez he fought frequently and beat everyone in winning titles all the way to 154lbs.

Hatton was a bonus and only happened because Ricky had called him out and hurt his ego.

Marquez was a decent warm up for bigger things..which Shane Mosley at the time represented. Both Cotto and Margarito had been fucked up by then.

 

So what? You rate Foreman over Muhammad Ali as a result of this logic?

 

Yeah, you got a point. It's not like Margarito was ranked #1 by the Ring Magazine from late 05-07 or anything.

Oh wait......He was ranked #1 at that time.

 

It's a valid point well worth making. But nevermind, let's ignore the blatant truth and keep talking about how great of a win Bumdomir was.

 

Problem with this is they actually fought eachother. Floyd has not fought Manny. So what does that leave us? Comparing resumes.

 

You complain about Floyds competition then you want to give credit to Pac for beating guys that Floyd has already beaten

 

Margarito as a fighter is the biggest myth of all. He couldn't even win 1 round against an old Shane Mosley. The same Shane Mosley that Floyd gets no credit what so ever for making look like a sparring partner.

 

Let's examine Floyd 3 best fights at WW, and the result:
1 Oscar - split decision, very unconvincing, there was even some rematch talk here
2 Judah - hit the canvas, wobbled, lost 4 first rounds bad, uncle jumped in the ring and choked Judah midfight - clearly should have been a DQ loss, but yeah, he did eek a legitimate decision
3 Mosely - ancient Mosely hurt Mayweather BAD with the 1 shot he threw. Prime Mosely would've finished the job

Anymore questions about why he's avoided young punchers like Cotto, Margarito and most of all Pacman ?

 

Yet Baldy beat Judah who beat Spinks who beat Mayorga who beat Forrest who beat Shane ect...............

 

That wasn't known at the time now was it? Hindsight cannot be used in this debate.

 

This means nothing.

 

At the time Cintron was considered an up and coming welterweight. I don't recall if he were the favorite against Margarito and that was in 2005. Don't forget...Margarito had made a name for himself when he KO'd Soft head Lewis...so don't act like Margarito hadn't been around in the division for years and Baldomir was all of a sudden this highly regarded fighter after beating Judah. He wasn't.

So what you have is Margarito beating Lewis (2003), Cintron (2005), Clottey (2006) and several others in the time prior to Floyd getting to 147. Margarito went on to lose to Paul Williams after Floyd beat Margarito.

The point about Paul Williams becoming a "name" when Floyd was signed to fight Hatton...maybe...maybe not. Floyd and Hatton fought in December...Williams and Margarito fought sometime in the summer.

Regardless...the way you find out about guys is by FIGHTING them. I've always said there's a longer list of reasons Floyd wouldn't fight a guy than why he would.

Finding out how good or bad a guy is is typically accomplished by climbing into the ring and finding out. Perhaps Floyd beats those guys...perhaps not. Point being, he had more excuses than balls to take the fight.

Like Neil said...the baldomir argument is hogwash. the day before the Judah fight could you have picked him out of a line up? hell no. And yet after the Judah fight he was credible despite Margarito being a champion in the division starting in 2002 when Floyd was at lightweight...

yeah,...margarito was a a nobody in the division whereas Baldomir was the best guy in the division.

 

Pacquiao shit on Mayweather resume at 147(by completely destroying/dominating common opponents) then add a few top opponents that Mayweather never dare to fight...

 

ok now i now it's futile to discuss this with you, regardless of what facts I bring.

He "eeked" a decision against Judah? Mosley hurt him so badly that it's evidence that prime Shane would have finished him? Floyd avoids young punchers?

Floyd could beat Superman and you'd say he ducked Galactus...

 

As said...margarito first won a belt at 147 in 2002. Try as you may to rewrite history...the attempt falls flat.

 

Back to the original post; I have no problem whatsoever with Mayweather fighting Ortiz. I am not a fan of Mayweather, but I do enjoy watching him fight and Ortiz will hopefully prove a good challenge. I certainly will not pay for this fight, but I will try and watch it either live on stream or later at some point.

However, if this fight is followed by yet another retirement or another opponent not named Manny Pacquiao then what? Will you Mayweather fans still support him?

 

Cintron was the only "big" name. Six heads had already been exposed badly by Mayorga and so beating him meant nothing. Clottey came after Judah and Baldi.

I'm not rewriting anything.

 

of course they will.

FloydIdiots are dedicated in their disillusionment. When given a whiff of a Floyd topic their stupidity is exposed more obviously than Anthony Weiner.

 

Nice job avoiding all my posts Sly. Please go back and reply to them all.

Thanks,
Zed

 

Can you deny this Sly? Irrelevent? Or was he actually a highly ranked contender?

 

Ok ZED since you called me out, let me start with this one.

Can you confirm hat Margarito was ranked # 1 by Ring since 05? I find that hard to believe. And if he was...perhaps you mean #1 CONTENDER because the ring certainly wouldn't have ranked him as the CHAMP since Judah and Baldi earned that designation respectively.

 

Floyd beat Oscar at his best weight 154

 

Are you the poster formerly known as Zed's Dead?

 

Please. Pac just goes after guys that are washed up or somebody else has done the hard work. Roach said that Shane was too dangerous back when Mayweather was whupping his ass.