Unheard Of, Unknown, Unappreciated Fighters.

With the fall-out from Haye's "Toe" now well established, let's take a look at real fighting men who took fights or lived lives of fighting at a level above and beyond what the likes of Haye could ever tolerate. I'm not saying any of these could beat Haye in the squared ring, but they wouldn't cry over a broken toe either. I am looking at "modern" guys, so we aren't relying on some black and white photo of a man in tights of whom we know almost nothing.

1. Bartley Gorman, King of The Gypsies, Ireland and the UK.

"If you can't take pain, real pain I mean, you can't be a fighter"



That's Bartley with Ali.

At 05:30 he describes what happened to him on St Leger Day in 1975 {Gorman says it was 1975, Wikipedia, who weren't there, say it was 1976}


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2. Paul Sykes, British Heavyweight-Title Contender, Wakefield, Yorkshire, England.

"I know exactly how to deal with sharks. You punch them right in the fucking ear-hole".



Once regarded as as one of the most dangerous men in the British prison system. Highly intelligent, but Bi-Polar, he became "institutionalized"
but not before he fought for the British Heavyweight Title against John L Gardner in 1979, in what was Sykes 8th fight- making a mockery of Audley Harrisons claim that he would win the same British title by his 5th fight :: Sykes would have butchered Harrison.

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Bishwago "Jackhammer" Johnson.

Totally unappreciated around here. No one seems to mention him.

 

Where was he from??? The Congo??

 

Nah..from Mississippi

 

I think he may have been mentioned in Gormans book.

 

From my time? Bobby Vanzie, Michael Ayers and Affif Djelti

 

Djelti was a guy whom I remember as DESTROYING large swathes of the cream of British 130/135 fighters. It took Colin Dunne, who was fringe World-Class all of the distance to tame him. He would have shown Khan a thing or two at 135.

 

Absolutely, I remember spaz-eyes Dean Pithie got broken down big time with cracking body shots and was never the same again. I think Djelti was in his 40s back then as well, the dude could really fight

 

Djelti was ancient alright. He gave Alex Moon a hiding and all. Moon had gone 12 with JonJo Irwin for the BBBoC Title, but Djelti broke him up. I think he might have beaten up Charlie Shepherd too.

 

Paul Sykes was a cretin and not someone who should be admired, his whole family are thugs and he was a bully. I live close to where he used to live and in his 'prime' if you wish to call it that he was known to lose his temper and take out his anger on anyone he choose whether or not they actually wanted to fight, he had a horrible violent streak. One of his party tricks was to go up to a couple in a pub and he would grab the womans arse knowing her man would be duty bound to defend her honour. Sykes was nearly always twice the size of the other guy and batter them.

However this sort of behaviour did eventually come back to haunt him in later life when he was a drunk, in poor health and karma caught up on him.

He passed this violent trait onto his sons one of who killed someone over 50p!

 

I never said I "Admired" him as such, I was aware of his habits, spitting into a Pint and then keeping it for himself was another of his favourite moves.

He was eventually battered over this sort of behaviour in the street by a large number of men who left him in a heap.

That said he was still quite bright, and his taking a British Hvy title fight after only 8 fights puts Audley and his shite in its proper perspective.

He was clearly bi-polar, as indicated by his sudden, fantastic trip-round-the-world escapades, which resulted in his being detained in the Far-East and banged up back in England in no-time.

His sons are filth, as you can see in the rest of the videos.

 

Vanzie was a badass, he was in some classic domestic battles and had good skills. Was chinny too so there was always that element of danger. The dust up with Steve Murray was a great fight. Should be 2-0 against Earl, too. Two of the worst decisions I've seen

 

Vanzie was good and could have done a number on Khan if he had been around at the same time. Murray was fancied to beat him, and was a very strong guy, a tree surgeon in his spare time, had a built upper body, and had Vanzie nearly out of there. Murray was never the same after he lost to Vanzie.

 

Yep, I would have picked Vanzie over Khan too if they'd met at lightweight, with Vanzie at his best. Agreed on Murray, that fight ruined him, remember as well that Vanzie had to take on Murray and the hometown support, very hostile atmosphere that night. To get up twice in the first round and go on to stop Murray showed real guts, one of the knockdowns Vanzie looked OUT before he'd hit the canvas.

 

Vanzie then lost to Romanoff, another guy who just disappeared. Was that his name, Yuri Romanov?

 

thread should be titled "Third-tier European Clubfighters Nobody Gives a Crap About"

 

I think it was James Armagh who first beat him, Romanov the first man to stop him.

It's funny, Martinez would have been a real contender for this thread had it not been for his recent emergence

 

Bartley Gorman was a clubfighter? Paul Sykes??

Thread is about guys who were involved in the fight-game in an obscure or oblique fashion.

If it was about 3rd Tier Europeans that nobody gave a crap about it would be called the Amir Khan thread. :laughing:

 

I believe loadedgloves point was that these guys sucked

 

Vanzie didn't suck, which is my point. The guy had talent.

 

It doesn't matter if they "sucked" or not. They were different and tangential and were deeply involved with the sport in an obscure or tangential fashion. Bartley Gorman, a shithouse Irish knacker getting his photo taken with Ali? Allegedly his brother, Sam Gorman, was flung out of sparring camp by Gerry Quarry when Quarry was in England to fight Jack Bodell, on the grounds that he, Quarry, couldn't do a damned thing with Gorman. Gorman was a massive guy, 6'4", 80" reach Most likely they discovered he was useless and threw him out :: Either that or his pivot was too good for them.

This is what Ali would have looked like if he didn't have the black blood mixed in with his Irish blood



http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=123574450146

 

Who cares?

you should have just made a thread called "weird boxing characters whose notoriety, if any, has almost nothing to do with the act of boxing"

 

William "Caveman" Lee is like Ezzard Charles compared to these guys

 

No. Sykes fought for a British title after only 8 fights. Audley Harrison said he would fight for and win the British title in 5 fights. Ironically, it is Sykes and not the 2000 Olympic Gold Medalist who is remembered with greater respect, pugilistically speaking.

Bartley Gorman would have beaten guys like Harrison.

 

None of the blokes I listed suck. I don't know about Sykes as this was the first I'd heard of him, but my guys were very good and certainly fit the title of this thread.

 

you know who fits the thread both in a general sense, and a very particular British sense- Augustus.

Thaxtons people took one look at his record and brought him in.

::

 

::

Yup, that was one of the best boxing clinics I've ever seen

 

Laziest and most costly piece of match making ever.

Augustus was :Lok: and Frank Warren was :truce: and afterwards Thaxton was athetic: and the public were :scratcher::scratcher:

 

Sykes had a pro record of 6-3-1

Bartley Gorman wasn't even a pro boxer... he was a bare-knuckle boxer (quite a talent pool in that sport, I betcha... )

Vanzie was 26-5 against 4th-tier opposition
Ayers 31-5 against similar opposition

Djelti fared even worse than those two... 37-13, same level of comp

I stand by what I said... none of these guys ever did a thing on the 1st or 2nd tier level... by THAT standard, they sucked... I concede on them maybe being personal favorites, thats entirely an individual matter

For a thread about underrated, underappreciated world-class fighters who weren't great fighters, you could mention Eugene Hairston, Ralph Jones, Ralph Dupas, Gypsy Joe Harris, Ken Overlin, Saoul Mamby

Or for journeymen/gatekeepers whoa re underappreciated... Arturo Leon... check out his resume, it's nuts... he fought a ton of great fighters... tough guy, just not good enough to win... but he's better than the lot you guys are talking about

 

Did he have his leg hacked off with a cider bottle while trying to fight a champion from a different trailer-site???