The definitive way to gain respect as a knowledgeable poster

In a Mythical Matchups always pick to more revered legend to win.

For example:

Lamotta vs Calzaghe.

Lamotta wins yo. Knocks that fool out in about 8 rounds. The dude was strong and rugged and fought 15 rounders and 12 times a year not like the slapping gay pussies you see nowadays, yo.

If you do that consistently you be the most knowledgeable and best poster around here, yo.

I'ma start doing that, yo, so that I get me some accolades around here and lose my "nuthugger" status. ::

 

Calzaghe is about four natural weight classes bigger than Floyd Mayweather. Just sayin'.

 

Calzaghe beats LaMotta. The knowledgeable guys to me are the ones who consistently call fights correctly. Guys like Reed, Jake, Mex, Z, Salaco etc. Knowing your history is nice and all but it doesn't mean shit when knowing how to call a fight.

 

word. You forgot to add a very important person to that list, homie.

 

Agreed. He's a safer bet to beat Lamotta than Floyd is as a result. Just sayin'

My point is...people are only labelled as good posters if they stick with "Bert Sugar" tradition when it comes to MMs.

But knowing history and picking based upon revered legend doesn't mean a person understands the game more than anyone else. However people use this meaurement to distinguish between what they call "nuthuggers" from what hey call "great posters".

Someone says Ray Robinson is the best fighter that ever lived..and he gets no label. Say Jones, Hopkins or Mayweather and he's a "nuthugger with an agenda". ::

This is indeed a silly place.

 

Dont wanna sound like a knob, but I'd put my record of picking fights between fighters I've actually seen against pretty much anybody. Maybe not quite up against REED, or MWS, but it'd be up there. :Thumbs:

 

Well it certainly makes somebody a better poster in MM which is predicated on proper knowledge of the fighters in question. Most of picking fights properly is just having seen enough of both guys to form a solid opinion on how good they are, there isn't much magic to it.

 

ahem! What about the one that them call Sly?

 

No dude. It SHOULD be based upon proper knowledge of the fighters in question. In actuality it is based upon proper knowledge of the reputation and status of the fighters in question. Ergo...pick the fighter with the greater cult status and you are declared winner.

 

But there's more to being a 'good poster' than knowing allot about history, anyway. I mean, I'd probably agree with more of BWJs persepctives on boxing than yourself sly, but I usually enjoy your posts more since you're actually offering a perspective & engaging in discussions, whereas BWJ just goes from thread to thread to thread calling you an idiot 15 times a day.

 

For example:

Robinson vs Hopkins at Middleweight.

"Hopkins wins. Much bigger physically, more intelligent and crafty, better defense. Robinson had diffulty with Turpin, and Fulmer...Hopkins would likely then decision him"

Verdict: Boxrec warrior nuthugger

"Robinson wins. Beating guys like Lamotta, Fulmer, Turpin, Basilio is must better than beating Joppy, Trinidad, De La Hoya, Echols, Holmes"

Verdict: This guy knows his shit, yo.

 

That's why my only response to him, when he does that, will be "queer". He is a homosexual and it's not relevant to his boxing positions, but if he's going to be silly and only offer "agenda, bias, Stafford" and all of that nonsense then my only response to him is "queer".

I'll continue to discuss normally with those worthy of discussion. Such as yourself, buddy.

 

I think that's a pretty misleading caricature of the type of debates MM throws up, mate.

 

no it isn't. ::

You are different. But for the most part...a fighter is picked based on their RESUME and "greatness" as opposed to what they've actually proven between those ropes in terms of ability and coping with styles etc.

 

I've got 2 fights spot on since i've been a fightbeat poster. Froch SD Dirrell, Garcia SD Holt.

:giggle:

*Edit* I think I also called Marquez - Concepcion 1 spot on too. Can't remember.

 

I don't get involved in the prediction competitions because admittedly I don't follow the majority of fighters in the game.

I tend to only know the "big players" these days. However in that regard, when I do make predictions I'm usually very accurate.

Of course i was way off in the recent Pac-Marquez fight. But I mischievously did inject a "wimp clause" saying that my HEAD picked a close semi-controversial decision. :l2:

 

The predictions league is for real men

 

Thats cool, you probably are a good predictor of fights. All I'll say is, I was SecondsOut champion in the golden era, so you should be looking back on me with rose tinted glasses :kidcool:

 

It's just brought up to contextualise exactly what different performances mean. And it's a pivitol debate. If Floyd beats a guy like Carlos Baldomir and it's being held up (implicitly perhaps) as a reason he'd beat Jake Lamotta then that can't stand without bringing in a proper understanding of the different levels those fighters operate on.

You only need to look at the fight on saturday - Pac was just arguably beaten at welter by a 38 year old blown up featherweight. I think that vindicates the position taken by cdogg and BWJ etc that his previous welterweight wins weren't nearly enough to go on if we're gonna start bringing him into discussions with the great, skilled welterweigths like Robinson, Napoles, griffith, Leonard, Hearns etc. He was playing in a lower division (and so has Floyd been).

 

Secondsout was the old first division, fightbeat is the new improved premier league, LOL

 

Yeah but...

Clay beating Cooper with that style therefore shouldn't be used to predict how he'd do against Liston. In fact it wasn't and that's why Liston was the favourite.

Your logic is exactly what I'm talking about. I'm not saying Carlos B is as good as Lamotta...I'm saying that the style Floyd used against him would also be effective against Lamotta. Why? Lamotta had short arms, was and fought short, won based on strength and agression, didn't have particularly fast hands, wasn't particularly elusive, was pretty predictable, swung for the fences mot of the time.

I could therefore extrapolate that style to being in the ring with Floyd and come to a conclusion. Whether Lamotta was stronger, bigger, tougher and more experienced than Baldomir is actually largely irrelevant. He'd get outboxed, ad since Floyd never slows down...I see no reason why this wil change in the 11th and 12th rounds..or even the 13th-15th rounds.

 

It's not irrelevant. The gulf in class is as big a factor as styles.

 

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]They said to Him: Shall we then, being children,
enter the Kingdom? Jesus said to them:
When you make the two one, and
when you make the inner as the outer
and the outer as the inner and the above
as the below, and when
you make the male and the female into a single one,
then you shall enter the Kingdom.

:Thumbs:
[/FONT]

 

This post sums things up quite nicely Sly...you're always correct in hindsight. Pick nearly any fight and you'll have a "I knew it would play out like this" scenario.

The truth of the matter is most guys who are close to the sport whether fighters and trainers etc are notoriously poor in picking fights. That's generally speaking.

Why?

Because they're around the sport and have seen crazy shit happen which sometimes makes it difficult to gauge exactly what will transpire in a fight.

Instead of being a Britney Spears/Justin Bieber-on-the-surface type fan, I'd encourage you to spend time in gyms. Go to club fights. I'll do two things.

1. will show you how guys who fight for nothing sometime fight as though everything is on the line.

2. will accentuate how skilled the top level guys really are and exhibit how disappointing it is to see them go half ass and waste their talent.

 

Don't disagree....but I think you're being deliberately obtuse.

Gulf in class is very important, but when discussing the Floyd-Lamotta discussion...Jake has no gulf in class over FLOYD. He may have a perceived one over baldomir...but it doesn't mean that Floyd can't handle him just as easily as he handled Baldomir.

For example:

James toney is lightyears ahead of David telesco in terms of class. Jones handled hm as easily as he handled Telesco.

There are a million such examples...I need not state more.

So whether Jake is that much better than Baldomir means not much unless your talking about Jake vs Carlos. but in jake vs Floyd..Floyd's style would do the same to jake's style that it did to Carlos' style.....UNLESS you can share with me an instance when Jake faced someone as elusive as Floyd who had such counterpunching genius that he could maintain for 12 rounds...and handled that style.

 

Sounds good, set it up.

Nevertheless. Back in 1999/2000 two potential superstars emerged: Floyd Mayweather and Shane Mosley

I man said Floyd would endure and Shane would be exposed.

12 years later, it is so.

Barrera would beat Naz
Floyd would stop Corrales
Hopkins would dominate tarver and Pavlik
Mayweather would stop Hatton


Just a few examples that come to my head.

My point is...I've proven to understand the mechanics of the sport and I make no apolgies for my arrogance.

Some posters don't understand the mechanics. They pick based on likability and resume only.

That's my point.

 

You also said you were a bigger "fan" of Mosley than Mayweather. Which leads credence to the Britney Spears/Justin Bieber analogy.

Your position is really no different than a high school girl glomming on to the next "it" girl that walks down the hallway.

When Roy Jones was on top there are few that rode his balls more tightly than you...when he was done, so were you.

It's mainly a popularity contest at this point. has nothing to do with knowing or liking the sport.

I'm willing to bet you'd never seen or heard of Floyd or Mosley until they showed on HBO. You're following the hype.

All you're proving is a 12 year history of following who's most popular. Again...no regard or knowledge of the sport.

 

::

Floyd wasn't that popular following the "slave contract" fiasco. He was largely ignored. When Shane beat Oscar he was the overwhelming hype. Your logic makes no sense...or else I shoul dhave been saying Shane was unbeatable the way HBO and everyone else was saying it.

Also in terms of being a Shane fan. I was...he was a very exciting fighter and I loved to see his fights...doesn't mean I didn't see his limitations. Whereas with Floyd I never did and have YET to see his limitations.

As for Jones...I'm still of the same opinion which is that prime Jones was as close to unbeatable as it can get. I just lost respect for him as a man..because he showed in th e3rd tarver fight (and subsequently against Calzaghe) that he has the heart of a garden mouse. I'm just being honest.

Tyson has been beaten from pillar to post since Douglas and I still have mad love for him. So what you're saying doesn't hold true to the facts.

 

You do realize Sly that over the course of the years you've said the above and have also denied the above.

"Like I said before"

Where ever you think the popular vote will land, that's where you will stand.

It's like the old Richard Pryor joke. he said when he was growing up he was in every gang. Which ever side was winning he'd jump over and say, "this is my side!"

The problem you have with saying these things is guys such as myself have been around long enough to watch your opinions morph over time...thus we are not fooled nor subject to giving credence to another self-promotion on your end.

the bottom line is this...everyone gets things wrong. There's no shame in admitting so. It's part of the game and part of the sport. You've already said you only follow "the names" and opt out of prediction leagues. It's a soft resting place you've set up for yourself. never investing yet chasing glory.

Tell us again "without hindsight" how you knew Holyfield would beat Tyson in 1996...pre-boxing boards no less.

 

Calzaghe could barely take that Egyptian dudes pressure Lamotta would probably run him out of the ring.

disclaimer I only read the first post in this thread