Andre Ward vs Joe Calzaghe.

Hopkins and RJJ are a level above Ward. At least a level above. They also both hit hard. Ward punches like a girl. After they both put calzaghe down, they proceeded to lose to Joe.

So would Ward.

MTF

 

Your post and the post you were quoting is all the evidence I need. It's nuthuggery gone wild.

 

So you agree with judges scorecards all of the time, then? The evidence of your own eyes means nothing to you? All 10-9 rounds are the same, are they?

Come on man, you are arguing all kinds of nothing just out of blind Calzaghe hate. And Calzaghe ceased being a factor in this thread about five pages ago.

MTF

 

No, it's you, biased and looking to wind up Calzaghe fans (and indeed British boxing fans) as usual, running about and spouting off before resorting to smiley-insults.

MTF

 

Look, I'm not the one pretending I don't know anything about boxing to prop up Calzaghe and slag Ward.

I picked Calzaghe to beat Ward in this thread. Yes, so biased.

 

The Reid fight was an anomaly, where things just aligned right for Reid so that the fight evened up for two fighters on very different talent levels, much like Mayweather-Castillo I.

 

"I saw Joe walk into shots and go down against Hopkins and Jones. I think Ward could time Joe and throw off his rhythm."

MTF's direct reply - "Hopkins and RJJ are a level above Ward. At least a level above."

But no, you're right, you weren't talking the Roy that Calzaghe fought.

Get your shit together.

 

Calzaghe was a coward, but he was a very talented coward, that happened to waste most of his career.

Calzaghe was the definition of a guy who fights to the level of opposition. He looked awful in the Reid fight and several others, and good against every "name" opponent he faced. You keep banging on about the Reid fight every time you mention Calzaghe. It doesn't mean much tbh.

 

The point is that we were discussing whether or not Kessler was diminished after the Calzaghe fight (or at least I think we were). IMO he was because, the evidence of my eyes showed a fighter who looked less sharp, less comfortable, less focused and took a good while to settle into a rhythm when he fought in his next fight. He then took a year off. Sure, he won decisively, but there is 'decisive' and then there is 'DECISIVE'/ Look at Pacquiao/Shane. The record shows that Pac scored a KD and won every minute of every round. Did he look the same as he did against the cheat? On paper he did, but you and I, watching both fights, KNOW that the fights were very different.

That was the point.

MTF

 

I stand by the points I've made even if you seem to be deliberately missing them.

FWIW, I do put more weight on the form book than my own eyes. When 3 judges all see the same thing and nobody raises any objections about it, then I trust the evidence of that as the absolute bottom line, implicitly. Our eyes are brim full with biases, all of us.

 

He always brings up the Salem fight too for some reason, even though Calzaghe won going away despite looking like shit

 

A year off, four months off, same difference.

 

Yeah, that's what I'm doing.

MTF

 

DeGale beats them both anyway so I don't know why everyone's getting so upset

 

I don't think we know that, tbh. I just saw a guy who was less comfortable having to chase somebody round the ring which he wasn't comfortable with and didn't suit his style. Beyond that I came to no conclusions.

 

To suggest Roy was better than Ward is to pretend you don't follow boxing.

It's not even that you made the point - it's that you won't admit it was wrong, or that you made a mistake.

 

You can keep repeating the same thing, but it doesn't detract from the FACT that I never said that the RJJ Calzaghe fought was better than Ward. Not once and despite your trying to claim, still, that I somehow did.

MTF

 

Some fighters come back better from defeat, some worse, most the same. What is CERTAIN is that we'll look on them different, notice their vulnerabilites more and project weaknesses on them as a result. Seriously, that's an automatic, guaranteed effect of a first defeat.

 

"RJJ is a level above Ward"

That's what I said. Do you disagree with that?

MTF

 

You responded directly to that point, you quoted the post.

 

And you said that in response to...?

 

Come on, feebes.:dunno:

 

Fine. Let's agree to disagree mate.

MTF :love:

 

I would have let it go pages ago if he'd just admit his error. ::

 

Deal.:truce:


(down with jazzercise!)

 

So what? The point I was making was the RJJ was a level above Ward. That point is obviously valid.

MTF

 

Are you joking; this is the most fun I've had on this forum for ages.

MTF

 

Fine. Point taken. It's irrelevant to the topic at hand, however.

 

Reid fight means a lot, since it was a fairly big fights, wich he should have lost if the judges weren't in his pocket. So that fight to the level of opposition bullshit is just that , bullshit. He was a fairly talented fighter, but he was far from the unbeatable machine you and some british jingoist claims he was. Contrarly to you, and the others calzaghe groupy, I don't rate Joe higher cause of his cowardism (wich enabled him to stay undefeated), but lower, since we never could see how good he really was.

I agree that he looked pretty good against kessler, but that's pretty much is only great performance (don't think neither Lacy nor Eubanks fight qualify), and his fight versus an old decrepit Hopkins was close as fuck.

 

I do enjoy the back and forth. ::