Broner U Turn

I didn't realise Broner had been taken to a majority decision within his first ten fights (only found out after seeing Illu's vid). I'm always a little suspicious when supposed superstars are run so close early on in their careers, but then again there has been a definite change in style so maybe it doesn't mean as much in this case.

 

Same. I don't like to write guys off either, but put it this way, what elite fighters today were beaten or pushed to the limit by sub par fighters early in their career?

Even elite fighters with no amateur backgrounds are generally far too much for the kind of opposition they face early in their careers.

 

pacquiao

 

I'm still not quite sure how far he'll go or how long his sudden dominance will last but can definitely say I enjoy what he brings to the game.

The Litzau and Rodriguez fights were to be expected. I predicted that Perez for all of his talk would find himself in over his head, but I still expected him to be more competitive than that. Broner flat out destroyed him and without breaking a sweat.

If we're going to call him a Floyd carbon-copy, then the very least that can be said about him is that he has personality/charisma, something Floyd sorely lacks.

As Latin King put it, Broner has definitely grown on me. Curious to see how far he goes and I'm not quite ready to say he beats Gamboa, but it's by no means a blow out in either direction.

 

Andre Ward was "Pushed to the Limit" by Sub Par Guys like Andy Kolle, Kenny Kost and Darnell Boone, in his FORMATIVE Years as a Pro...

Boone even DROPPED Ward on his Ass...



REED:hammert:

 

Good answer. Ward is the best example I can think of for sure, he's a legit eilte fighter now.

 

Hopkins lost his prod debut, same for JMM ( it was a dq though, so don't know if it was a close fight or not )

 

I knew someone would mention those, but imo they don't count. It's a debut, they might have been nervous or froze or something.

Still interesting they both lost their debuts, but I don't think it constitutes struggling early in their career.

 

Your boy Pac got KTFO by 2 cans. Lots of guys lose early fights in their careers to unknown guys.

 

The Torrecampo loss falls under this for sure but at least the Singsurat defeat was at world level

 

I know he was knocked down and hurt early in his career, but was he actually pushed close on the scorecards? Genuine question, I haven't seen those fights. It would be surprising to me.

 

Have you seen the Torrecampo fight?

 

Hopkins lost his first or second fight. Oscar got off the canvas to win more than a couple times coming up. So did Tito.

Secondly, I don't have issues with guys struggling or getting off the canvas to win early in their careers. In fact. I'd rather have a guy have a bit of adversity early on so they'll know how to deal with it if pressed in fights with better guys.

How many times have you seen guys make it to big fights and fold up because they've never been in peril and had no clue how to conduct manage through adversity?
I bet Irish can name at least one...Wlad vs Purrity. :cheer:

 

i guess nedal hussien doesnt constitute early in pacquiao's career?

 

All three Marquez fights were either early in his career when he was green, or late in his career when he was shot. In the 2nd one he may have been green and shot at the same time.

 

Clear dive

 

He was floored, and bizarrely quite hurt, by a jab. But other than that, did he struggle?

I'm not sure you guys are understanding it right.

Tito doesn't count either. He would get floored by scrubs, pop right back up and continue to beat the crap out of them with his lead footed anvil hooks.

Like I said the best example is Ward by a mile. He struggled and looked average against very ordinary fighters, but now is an elite fighter for sure, and on most P4P lists.

 

I don't see knockdowns or even getting knocked out the same way as a razor thin decision win/loss to a scrub. Anyone can get caught and hurt, you can write that off as a fluke, if you're finding yourself getting outboxed by these guys though, that's far more telling IMO.

 

I very much agree with that. Experience and solid matchmaking, a gradual increase in quality of opposition is important.

But that's different to supposed superstars like Broner struggling throughout an entire fight.

Especially given that he arguably lost to the best fighter of his career, it's hard to ignore.

Who knows though, he might turn out to be another Ward. I'm just not buying the hype just yet.

 

Precisely. Two very different things.

 

Pac was down on all three cards against Singsurat iirc.

 

Yea, I think he was actually being whitewashed on at least one in fact, though my memory is sketchy. Still, it was at world level so isn't as bad

 

he's talented but he has proven nothing

 

At the very least I like his relaxation level in the ring.

 

dress it up however you like, he was knocked out by a very mediocre opponent.

 

Knocked down, not out. But yeah, Hussein is a better example of an early struggle against mediocre opposition for Pacquiao than any flyweight fight, so is the Sanchez fight.

It was around this time I was sure he'd get battered by Morales or Barrera.

 

i consider it a knockout based on the length of the referees count

 

I don't remember it being a long count, but I do remember Pacquiao looking pretty out of it when he got up.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSI-TnZD2LY

appeared to be a slow 13 count before pacquiao's countryman padilla allowed hussien to engage him

 

agree, he is not skittish