Gerard McClelland vs Mike McCallum @160

Day before weigh in. The McClelland of the second Jackson fight, McCallum of the first Toney fight.

Cha'hink?

 

McCallum beats the living shit outta him.

 

the Body snatcher sodomizes him

 

McCallum boxes smart early, diffuses those bombs and gradually increases the workrate, eventually battering the living shit out of that sadistic fuckhead

 

I agree with you as usual brother Clogg

I think the body snatcher was an excellent fighter..

 

McCallum is one of my all time time faves. I think he makes G-man his girlfriend and treats him reeeeaaal nice

 

I'm quite impressed that I managed to misspell both of McCellan's names in one go. A new PB, I believe.

 

...and again! :bears: ::

 

It's a subliminal expression of my respect for him as a man and a technician. He wasn't half the fighter jeo Caslzagieh's was.

 

agREED

i think he puts it in slow and dry though

 

Is Gerard McClelland the super version of Gerald McClellan :dunno:

 

:laugh11:

 

:laughing:

MTF

 

Mike wins this handily. Far too good.

MTF

 

Mike was the sexiest fighter of the last 25 years

 

I prefer Jennifer Ellis to Gerard McClelland.

But yeah, Mike beats Gerard down.

 

I have two uncles & a cousin called Gerard. Popular name in the Hut family.

 

Whitaker had a bigger dilz

 

I love Pernel too, but I prefer McCallum. I like guys who I know will eventually knock you the fuck out even if it'd take more than the round limit allows. That's the noble art in my book. They can be out scored but never outfought.

 

James Toney>Roy Jones.

 

to watch, both at their best? No doubt about it

Roy Jones was a great fighter, a greater fighter than Toney, but I'd much rather watch James Toney because his style was beautiful, to me

I rag on Toney for being fat and wasting a lot of his career and I rag on him for not being versatile despite people always suggesting he is against all evidence, but James Toney against an aggressive opponent is what counterpunching and relaxed, confident defense is ALL about... beautiful to see

Some of my favorite guys to watch are/were counterpunchers like that... Toney, Marlon Starling, Archie Moore, Georgie Benton

I wish we could go back and grab Freddie Little, George Benton, Joe Brown and Harold Johnson at their peaks, make 10 clones of each and then populate the various divisions of today with the clones

 

I think he's flat out better.....at what I like, which is fighting with your hands in a ring. Not better at getting 'W's in modern boxing matches admittedly, but in the spirit of what originally impeled the invention of the sport - superior. I bet even Jones would admit that, he always raves about Toney and says he's the greatest fighter he was ever in a ring with

 

I can't see Jones ever saying Toney is better than him and I think his raving about him has a lot to do with Toney being his most important victory... What does he say about Antonio Tarver? Probably not much... I don't take those testimonials too seriously

I read interviews with Archie Moore where he mentioned Lloyd Marshall and Jimmy Bivins and Harold Johnson 150 times when asked who the best fighter he ever fought was, but he never once said the words "Ezzard" or "Charles", the only man who ever owned him at 175.

Any way you slice it, the guy with the greater career, greater accomplishments, is Jones. I don't like his style, either, but I also don't think he was guilty of the same traits we now see in all of the leapers -- escapology via holding -- Jones was not a big holder, he was a mover... Leap Amateurism worked for Jones, he did it WELL and he managed to do it while inflicting real damage on people... his one round blitz of Montel Griffin was an alarming display and Griffin was very much an old school "cutie" in the context of the 90s and beyond. He wasn't jazzercising in there, he beat the shit out of some people.

I do agree with Slice in the sense that I don't think you'd ever get a 12 round fight where Toney beats Jones. He wouldn't be able to catch him often enough. Toney can't go after a guy, he's not good at it, he's not a pressure fighter. Even a 15 rounder, the possibility remains remote, there is too much ground to make up. And don't forget, Toney's got to be aware of the incoming... when Jones put some heat on his punches, he hit HARD and did so at a speed rivaled by precious few fighters in all of history.

 

Yeah, but you really can't go by that. Fighters are often very self-serving about who they heap praise on and who they don't.

 

Agreed, plus it's not like Toney even offered much resistance in their fight, Jones beat him easily.

And although I can see one preferring Toney's skillful, clever counter punching style and boxing ability to Jones's insane athleticism and natural physical talent, he wasn't a better fighter.

To be honest I don't it's close either. I like both fighters, but Jones is just flat out better. Forget about this "modern boxing" and leap amateurism stuff too.

Match prime Jones and Toney against the 10 best fighters ever at 168 to 175 at any era, Jones probably goes undefeated and Toney doesn't come close.

 

Good post, I agree.

Personally I'm not a big fan of Jones's style either, because I don't like pot shotters. And Jones was essentially a super elite pot shotter.

But I can't help but like watching prime Jones fight, he was amazing to watch, absolutely freakish talent. A 5'11 super middle or light heavy who is faster and more agile than any flyweight I've ever seen. How can you not admire such talent?

And while I admit guys like Toney who relied heavily on old school skills and craft, I just don't see an argument of Toney being better. Put them both in any era of the sport, and Jones is going to be far more dominant.

 

Roy Jones was, like, a lot better than James Toney.

 

Roy Jones Jr beats James Toney 10/10 times and beats any common opponents who Toney would lose to as well. Greatest 168 lb fighter ever and tough to pick against at 160 or 175. I love Toney and have defended him here (mostly to cdogg) in the past, but there's no metric by which he is better than Jones Jr. As was pointed out, he also was not nearly as good when he had to go after a guy instead of the other way around (though he could still get the job done).

 

Pretty much yeah. I can't see any argument at all for Toney being better.

As I said, even stick both of them in the 40's, 50's and 60's, and Roy beats far more people.

I think Roy could potentially go undefeated if matched with the top 10 of all time at 160, 168 and 175. Toney wouldn't come close.

 

Like, much better, or something.