Has Canelo improved?

This isn't about styles.

Golovkin is a better talent and higher caliber fighter than Canelo.

It seems after Saturday that everyone's either forgotten or forgiven Canelo's flaws. And I KNEW this would happen.

Golov will OUTCLASS the Ginger, it has nothing to do with styles.

 

Golov is the better fighter, but there IS NOT a difference in class.

A difference in class implies...well you know what that implies, I don't have to spell it out. I'll just say that they are both top level talents.

Golov is better and bigger and rangier and so should win. Canelo, IMO matches GGG for chin and dare I say it...boxing ability. I also think Canelo is less hit able.

GGG was hitting Lemieux with the kitchen sink and still only managed to stop him on his feet, late in the fight. Not only that but LEMOO wasn't badly hurt at the time (although it WAS a good stoppage..considering the tide of the fight). LEMOO had been knocked out before.

So what am I saying? Considering Canelo has never left his feet and has shown a good defense and has shown the ability to take the punches of a puncher (Cotto), I see no reason why we must assume that GGG stops him.

 

Translation "Floyd is the one who can outclass Canelo."

Golov is a level above Canelo and it'll show. After he whups his ass, I fully expect the Nelo groupies to say "Canelo was too young. He needed a few more years.".... but it'll have nothing to do with that.

 

The question was asked has canelo improved. Either he has or he hasnt. Everyone improves. I dont give a fuck who you are. If you train and work on certain things in the gym you are gonna improve. I dont understand the hate towards canelo. Some stated that canelo should have stopped cotto. Damn cotto was running the whole fight. And trust me had floyd fought like that it would have been called running but since it was someone not named mayweather it was boxing. As far as ggg as concerned has he fought anyone the caliber of a cotto. So how do we know if he would have stopped cotto. I'll Holla 5000

 

Golovkin vs alvarez will be a huge money making opportunity. The popularity of alvarez will cause the odds to be close to even when he should be a 5-1 underdog

 

So, it's okay for GGG to plant his ass at 160 and expect fighters from a lower weight class (155 is NOT MW) to come up and face him.

It is NOT okay for Canelo to stay at 154 and expect fighters from 147 to step up to face him? (WHAT A COWARD!!!)

I'm not making excuses. I believe Canelo will take the fight and I think he'll beat GGG in a good fight but pointing out again the complete bias of some of the posters here at shitebeat.

 

If alvarez wants golovkin to make 155lbs then he should do it.

It's just funny because alvarez will be the heavier guy in the ring when they fight

Alvarez was considerably heavier vs cotto than golovkin was vs Lemieux

 

There's no stylistic advantage for Canelo. It's the exact opposite. He's a stubby mid range puncher that's too slow footed and square to make an inside fight against a taller rangier guy that can box and bomb at long and mid range. Add in that Canelo isn't a lights out puncher and he doesn't keep a high work rate and he doesn't have a lot of options.

 

Canelo isn't staying at 154. He's fighting at 155 for the 160 belt against a natural 147 pounder that he outweighed by 20 pounds.

 

I know he isn't staying there for long.

The fact that he fought Cotto at 155 doesn't mean much. They could have just as well fought for Canelo's belt at one pound less. In fact the guy Cotto won the belt from (Martinez) could have still made 154 had he not had an injury that hampered training.

My point was that SOME (not you) of the posters here have implied it would be a bitch move for Canelo to stay at his weight class. Those same posters do not have a problem with GGG simply staying put at 160 instead of a possible fight with a guy like Ward at 168. What's good for the goose...

I am not really intersted in the argument about what a fighter weighs at fight time. If they change the weigh in rules then that will come into play.

 

I think the only problem people have is that IF Canelo is going to call himself the middleweight champion of the world, then he is supposed to face middleweights at middleweight limit. And thus, he has to fight GGG. If not, he must simply announce that he isn't a middleweight and go on to dominate 154 (which is perfectly valid).

The same with GGG. If he proclaims himself to be the super middleweight champion of the world, then he needs to move up to fight Ward. If he is fine with being the middleweight king, he can stay at 160 and let others (including Canelo) to meet him there.

Thus, I don't see the hypocrisy here. All problem started when Cotto didn't give up his title yet claimed that he isn't a middleweight

 

w/All DUE Respect, Brother X, YOU'VE Been REED's Chief Adversary in this Whole "Improved Canelo" Saga...

1 1/2-2 Years Ago, when REED 1st Broached the Topic, You Said THEN that Canelo was ALREADY as Good as he was Going to Get...Hell, After the Kirkland Fight YOU Said, "That was BUM Ass Kirkland and NOT a Sign of Any Improvements"...Yet NOW, within the Confines of this Thread, You're Copping to "Incremental" Improvements in Canelo???...

Even if Only SLIGHT, Improvement is IMPROVEMENT, Bruh...This AIN'T "Rocky III", Where Apollo Creed Trains Balboa to Box Like Himself, in the Course of 1 Fight...Improvements Occur in INCREMENTS...Pacquiao DIDN'T Start Using his Right Hand Overnight, Did He???...

Canelo Alvarez HAS Improved...PERIOD...Not Sure Why it BOTHERS You to Acknowledge it...Not Sure Why you IMMEDIATELY Bring up GGG when Someone Points Out Canelo's Improvements, Either...1 Has NATHAN to Do w/the Other...

Canelo's ALWAYS Picked His Shots Well, but When have you EVER Seen Cotto Hit CLEANLY w/as Many Uppercuts as Canelo Landed On Him???...When has Canelo EVER Looked as COMPOSED Over the Course of a Distance Fight???...When has Canelo EVER NOT Gotten Tired Over the Course of a Distance Fight???...Those are IMPROVEMENTS, Bruh...

@ NO Point Did You "Try to Tell" REED Canelo Was Going to Pitch a SHUTOUT on the Cards of Some Judges, Homey...Nice Try Though...





REED::

 

You DO Realize a Good Jabber Can IMPROVE his Jab, Right???...A Good Combination Can IMPROVE his Degree of Combination Punching...

Canelo's ACCURACY Certainly Looked Improved, Especially Considering Cotto was RARELY a Stationary Target & Kept that Guard High & Tight ALL Fight Loooooooong...

Again, you Were Reluctant to Acknowledge ANY Improvements in Canelo, as Recent as the Kirkland Fight...You're Singing a DIFFERENT Tune Now, Bruh...





REED:kidcool:

 

Brother X is by Faaaaaaaaaaaaaaar THE Most "Reactionary" Poster @ Fightbeat...REED's Been Saying Canelo WOULD Improve for the BETTER Part of the Last 2 Years...

This AIN'T No Hindsight, Wrong Prediction BULLSHIT...




REED:kidcool:

 

Canelo Would be THE Most COMPETITIVE Fight GGG's Ever Had, by Faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar...Canelo's CONSIDERABLY More PROVEN than GGG...

It WOULDN'T be a Tyson-Douglas, Rousey-Holm Level Upset if Canelo Won...





REED:nono:

 

word....or as I should say...agREED!

 

Canelo is rounding out the skills that he's good at but he has fundamental, conceptual problems that don't seem to be solving themselves.

 

Ok, let's REALLY see who' being reactionary, shall we?

YOU sir, are the one who was saying just a few weeks ago that Golov should move up cause Cotto AND Canelo would have no shot against him. Suddenly, after Canelo beats Cotto (something you didn't think would happen) ALLL of a sudden now Canelo has a great shot against Golov in your mind. That IS reactionary.

I'm very consistent actually. VERY consistent. I said from the jump that I favored Canelo over Cotto, and that Canelo would give Golov a spirited fight but had no chance of winning.

Canelo beats Cotto (as I figured) and I'm STILL saying the same shit - Canelo gives Golov a spirited fight, but has no shot of winning.

So please tell me how I'M the reactionary one?

I'm one of the FEW people staying logical actually. 90% of the forum is now on Canelo's nuts, singing his praises, when ALLL he did was exactly what the odds makers and most the media predicted him to do.... beat up an older, naturally smaller man.

Golov will fuck Canelo up. And once he does, I cannot WAIT to hear your excuses. Which will it be? "Canelo was overrated anyway." "Fight came too soon for Canelo. He needed a few more years. He's still improving." "Golov beat a smaller man."

I can't wait.

 

Nah..X...you are KNOWN to be the most reactionary guy here. Everyone knows this about you.

After every big fight you start a million Mythical Matchups threads pitching the winner or the loser against ATGs...like you suddenly have some new insight about the guy in question.

 

You're trying to talk smack about Canelo showing up about 15 pounds heavier than a clearly past prime fighter and winning by virtue of being a lot bigger and stronger. And you're doing it to people who picked Canelo to win by KO when he didn't...

Reed hates GGG so much he's gone from begging him not to kill Cotto and Canelo to seeing a glimmer of hope. Lol

 

What was your excuse when your prediction of "Wilder is going to get BRUTALLY KO'd by Stiverne and look stupid in doing so" fell flat?

Oh yeah. "I don't care about any heavyweight fights anyway. As you were, FAG!" :bears: (Great response.)

When a fighter you don't like wins a fight, you bitch and moan abaout how they wouldn't be shit if it was some all time great in there as an opponent. if he was fighting Trinidad of '98, Hagler of '85, etc. this guy would have been in a coffin tonight. I notice you don't do that shit when Crawford (or any fighter you like) is fighting. Oh, yeah, but what if he was in there with Aaron Pryor tonight? Then what? You heap priase on guys you like. Look for any way to criticize fighters you don't like. ALWAYS.

YOU'RE BORING and you are fucking whiner. The most biased poster on shitebeat by a country mile.

 

Canelo fans are raging out. Lol

 

Has fuck all to do with Canelo. Some of these mugs (two in particular here) are so biased toward the fighters they like or hate it's just damn near impossible to have a sensible boxing conversation. I respect all fans of boxing fans but GODDAMN.

 

Actually, What REED Said was GGG Should Move Up Because the Cotto-Canelo Winner DOESN'T Seem Interested in Fighting him...As for GGG vs. Canelo, ALL REED has Said to this Point is it WOULDN'T Be a Tyson-Douglas, Rousey-Holm Level Upset...That's ALL REED has Said in that Regard, Brother X...




REED

 

REED Digs the Mythical Matchups Contributions, Cause Lord Knows that Forum NEEDS Fresh Boxing Dialogue...

But Yeah, Brother X is CLEARLY the Knee Jerk Reactor EXTRAORDINAIRE, Around these Parts...& that's NOT a Bad Thing, Necessarily...




REED

 

Since You've Only RECENTLY Crawled Out from the HOLE in Which You Reside, You WOULDN'T Know REED has Previously Expressed FANDOM for Canelo AND Spoke of How he Would IMPROVE as a Fighter, for the BETTER Part of the Last 2 Years...

In Other Words, YOUR Miserable Ass is LATE to the Party, Twerp...




REED

 

disagREED on the "Boring" Characterization...It's Basically Impossible to Be "Reactionary" AND "Boring", Simultaneously...They're Basically Oxymoronic...

Brother X's Post Fight Rants Actually SPAWNS Debates...What's WRONG w/That???...




REED

 

Obviously it wouldn't be a Tyson-Douglas level upset.

There's only been three upsets in history that have been truly SHOCKING.... and sad for me, my two favorite fighters of all time were on the losing end of all three. Tyson-Douglas, Tyson-Holy 1, and Roy-Tarver II.

Would Canelo beating Golov be anywhere NEAR as shocking as those? No.

But at the same time, I dunno how he's gonna win. NOT at the level Golov's at now. His only chance would be to catch a faded Golov.

Golov has too many tools for him, and too much firepower. Canelo is a good talent. Golov is just a better talent.

 

The More PERTINENT Talent Comparison is btwn Canelo & ANY Guy GGG's Faced to this Point...In that Regard, Canelo WINS By a Mile...

Just Like Canelo's Never Faced a Guy like GGG, the SAME Can Be Said in Reverse...




REED

 

That's why I hope we see Canelo-Lemieux in May. I want you to see the difference in class between Canelo and Golov. Canelo will beat Lemiuex, but it won't be the one sided paint job Golov-Lemieux was.

It's actually IMPORTANT we see that fight to get a gauge of how Canelo handles Golov's power.

We KNOW Golov can handle Canelo's power. Lemieux might not be very good, but his left hook is lethal. He nailed Golov flush with it a few times.... no reaction WHATSOEVER from Golov.

Let's see how Nelo stands up to those same hooks.