All time greats who lacked handspeed

A good many of the all time greats have in common that they had very fast hands. Ali, Leonard, Robinson, Charles, Louis, lightweight Duran, Whitaker, Jones, all very quick handed.

How bout some all time greats who had RELATIVELY non-elite handspeed.

The obvious ones who come to mind:

Monzon
Hagler
Marciano
Arguello
Chavez

Others?

 

Good topic

Foreman

 

Not sure why I forgot George. He's probably THE most obvious.

 

Neither Nicolino locche, Rubin olivares or emile Griffith ever struck me as particularly fast

 

Was Archie Moore fast?

 

Three more good examples.

I would add Carlos Ortiz. He wasn't blistering fast.

 

From what I've seen, Moore had good handspeed. Good enough handspeed that he probably wouldn't make this list.

 

Agreed this is a good topic and also one where Sly can't include Floyd::


Sonny Liston wasn't fast even though yo could claim he was deceptively fast

Michael Spinks could be another, he was about on the level of Chavez or Hag-er

 

Lennox Lewis. Not slow...but no one would have accuse him of having blazing hand speed.

 

Liston is a good pick.

I definitely don't agree on Spinks though. Spinks had fast hands at 175. I mean, he wasn't Leonard/Jones fast, but he definitely had far above average handspeed. Faster hands than Hagler/Chavez for sure.

 

id say he was. But partly it's that his arms were so freakishly long he didn't have to move them very far!

 

I dunno if I'd agree with that, and I hated Lewis.

For his SIZE, Lewis was very quick and athletic.

The proof is the Ruddock and Golota fights.

 

this is indeed a good thread. along the same lines, we have also discussed the many examples of "bad" fighters who have exceptional hand speed. but that is an even larger and more nondescript population.

other examples:

El Finito
does Wright count?
Jofre

 

Winky Wright was a very good fighter, but he DAMN SURE ain't no all time great. However, I guess you can include him.

"Bad" fighters with exceptional handspeed - Judah and Khan are the first two that come to mind. They're not "bad" fighters per say, just non-elite fighters.

 

right. exactly. that is why i put bad in quotes.

what about lopez and jofre. do you think they qualify?

 

Yeah I think Lewis was fast for a big dude

 

Lewis was a helluva lot more coordinated than these goofy bums Wilder and Fury.

 

Hagler wasn't that agile but he had good hand speed when he set himself. Look at his ko of Tony Sibson. You need to see it in slomo to really see the combos he was landing.

Finito had good hand speed as well. He was always set to throw with leverage so you didn't see a lot of shoe shining but his combos were quick and crisp.

At 130 and 135 Chavez had fast hands as well.

 

Felix Trinidad
Riddick Bowe
Arturo Gatti
Mike McCallum

 

1. Trinidad: Bad example. Trinidad had very good handspeed.

2. Bowe: Bowe had good handspeed for his size.

3. McCallum: That's a good example.

4. Gatti: I said greats, not punching bag scrubs.

 

1 - No he didnt. That's why De la Hoya beat him. He never showed any great handspeed. He was heavy, not fast.
2 - Rubbish. Big lumbering oak of a man who appeared to have great handspeed inside, but really didnt.
4 - Gatti is a HoF'er and 3-weight champion

 

1. Rubbish. Tito had slow feet, and had to be set to punch. Oscar gave him the proper movement to where he couldn't get set, and thus, couldn't get off. When he had a stationary opponent in front of him and could get off his punches off, he always showed fast hands. Corrales was the same way.

2. When Bowe was actually in shape, he had good handspeed for a big man. No one should debate that.

3. Gatti was a bum.

 

You're an idiot.
Trinidad has servicable handspeed bordering on sluggish. What fucking fights have you watched?

I'm debating and I'm calling it. This is one reason why Lewis would'v crushed this brain-damaged BUM.

Gatti is a HoF'er with molasses-hands...

 

1. Basically every single fight of a prime Trinidad shows that had good handspeed. Pretty retarded to state otherwise. His footwork was ponderous, and at times clumsy, but there was NOTHING slow about his hands.

2. Lewis beats Bowe because Bowe had a horrendous defense, not because he had slow hands.

3. Gatti's the most undeserving HOF there's ever been. The man was a C fighter and doesn't belong in this thread.

 

I have to take X's side on this. Tito did indeed have quick hands, just look at the combinations he shredded Vargas with.

Tito's problem indeed was his footwork. The time which he needed to let his first shot fly was long, but when he got going, he was quick. Chico Corrales and David Tua were same type. even though both were much slower than Tito and not great by any stretch.

Also, Bowe was not slow for a big guy but not quick either. He could fit the thread since he wasn't among the quickest hw champs ever, but he wasn't great either.

And also, Gatti was not great. To be an actual great fighter I think you usually need to be in the top-3 of some weightclass at some point

 

Forgot about Saad. I feel like he's a good example. Saad had endless stamina and determination, and was a booming puncher, but not particularly fast handed.

 

I have no idea, but surely Gatti was rated top 3 at one point or another in either the Superfeatherweight or lightwelterweight divisions. I mean, especially considering he was IBF and WBC champion at those weights respectively.

 

I remember in 2000 when there were serious talks of a Mosley-Gatti fight. Shane woulda murdered Gatti 9 years before his wife did.

 

Lord, that woulda been brutal

 

all time great?