Wilfredo Gomez Appreciation Thread

Gomez is the consensus 122 GOAT, and on most lists, the Puerto Rican GOAT.

Inoue is not a GOAT in any division thus far, and resident Japanese boxing expert on here @roughdiamond will tell you, that he still has a ways before being considered the Japanese GOAT.

There is no comparison between these two guys at the moment. Which is kinda the point of this whole thread, Wilfredo Gomez deserves more respect.

Like I said, he is the best fighter in history below 126 (IMO).

Inoue has a LOOOONNNGGGGGG way to go before challenging for a distinction like that.

Based on what we saw last year, prime Donaire likely beats him.... let alone fricken Wilfredo Gomez.

 

Yeah, along with talent, ability, skill, and style. One of them is a bonafide ATG who wiped out a division and is one of the best ever, the other is a midget bantamweight who just went life and death with an ancient Donaire. At least Tyson destroyed his old opponents. Tyson may have talked like a lesbian, but at least he didn't look like one.

Oh, and they have different names.

 

Not to shit UGO, we like eachother, and he's easily one of the legends of this forum, but he is prone to heavy recency bias.

These debates are nothing new - he's always trying to argue the contrarian opinion of a modern P4Pder being on a comparable level to the ATGs.

Here we are on Mythical Matchups, and it's still up for debate if Inoue handles a 3rd tier bantamweight great like Canizales (I'd pick Inoue, just saying) and he's ready to jump up 3-4 levels from a guy like Canizales.

Let's wait before he can be compared to Wilfredo's victim (Zarate) before making this comparison.

 

And yes, thank you for defending Mike.

Inoue can't be compared to Tyson yet, and even as a Tyson fan I'll tell you that Gomez was greater than Tyson.

Knowing his history, I'm sure Mike would agree if you asked him.

 

Last thing I would add to the H2H discussion between them, Inoue is a tiny guy, he really is. Dont forget, he started at 108.

Wilfredo was much bigger and MUCH MUCH physically stronger.

We can talk about them in a P4P sense, but Inoue's chances of winning straight up are dismal.

 

The comparison here was Tyson before the Berbick fight, and Inoue of now. Up until then Tyson hadn't exactly cleaned the house, although he had all the ability. Also, he had "gone life and death" with Quick Tillis.

I also realize that Tyson had the more correct style, cooler outfit and an altogether different name

 

In fairness, Inoue was massive at 108, and skipped flyweight due to troubles with weight (supposedly, I think he just really didn't wanna fight Chocolatito, as we saw at 115). He's an average sized BW IMO. He's a little bigger than Pintor, and about the same size as Gomez.

Not that it matters, of course.

 

Mind you, this all began from your take that "idiots" would pick Inoue over Gomez. In my opinion we don't have the certainty that they were on totally different levels.

The debate was never about their accomplishments as of now, since there is zero to debate there.

From my point of view, we always come to that I am not ready to accept the premise of "this generation of fighters is vastly lesser in class compared to its predecessors".

Most others seem to accept it, and draw their conclusions from there. In my opinion, boxing techniques have been simplified, physical training has developed and thus fighting looks bit different now. I do not think this era is the best ever, but I do believe that the best of this era are comparable to best of other eras,in most cases.

Saying this might make me a contrarian, or ignorant even, but I seriously, truly believe it to be the case

 

The fact that you have to cherry pick when you can say this only proves the point me and X are trying to make. And Tyson before Berbick was 19 with no title fights. Inoue right now has had 15 title fights, is a three weight champion, beaten 10 champions, and is 27. He also happened to avoid an entire division of elite talent, deciding to fight old scrubs for years. There's a difference. And Tyson won every round with Tillis. Inoue had half of his face broken vs Donaire.

Do you think Inoue will end up as good as Gomez?

 

No, you completely missed the point I tried to make (probably my own fault).

Picking that version of Tyson over Frazier accomplishment-wise would have been without basis, but it might have been the correct pick.

Picking this version of Inoue over Gomez accomplishment-wise is without basis, but, as the example above shows, it isn't necessarily wrong. Of course it doesn't mean it is the correct pick either.

The chances are Inoue is never going to achieve as much as Gomez. But if we assume they are roughly the same size (Inoue fights lower but things have changed based on weigh-in policies and nutrition, as we know) then I do think Inoue is good enough to give Gomez a run for his money

 

Why do you think that?

 

.

I sure as shit hope not based on the Donaire fight.

But the real reason. To Ugo, modern fighters = Awesome. Old fighters = overrated.

Even though he doesn't even have enough of knowledge on bantamweight history to be making these picks.

BTW, 24-hour weigh in or not, Gomez was a bigger man. He was cutting a lot of weight to make 122.

 

Inoue is too easy to hit for Gomez. His chin appears okay, Donaire would have knocked him out if it was glass, but Donaire hurt him, so of course Gomez could as well.

And he'd be hitting Inoue far more frequently than Donaire did, with combinations, while punishing his body.

Inoue can't win a boxing match with Gomez, nor could he win a shootout.

As of now, he's still an underdog to Zarate and Pintor.

 

Rigo, circa 2012, has a better chance of upsetting Gomez than Inoue has. I wouldn't pick Rigo, but he has better odds.

Circa 2012 Rigo also beats Inoue, imo.

 

Hard to argue the case for Inoue as of now.
Personally,..I don’t think Inoue is that much smaller than Gomez.
Inoue is half an inch shorter with a one inch reach advantage over Wilfredo.
No doubt that Gomez would be the best opponent Inoue has or ever will face.
But outside of Zarate,..Inoue would be the best opponent Gomez ever faced at 122

 

So Inoue is automatically better than Pintor?

Cause Pintor sure as Hell had a better resume.

I don't think Inoue is a lock to beat Pintor... at all.

I don't think Inoue is a lock over guys like Jeff Chandler, Miguel Lora, Jorge Lujan, Orlando Canizales, Alberto Davila, MUCH LESS putting him in a discussion with Wilfredo Gomez.

 

Before we start worrying about Inoue vs Wilfredo Gomez, we need to stop pretending that a certain elephant in the room doesn't exist - Inoue doesn't look like he would have beaten prime Donaire.

 

@George Crowcroft To me, jury is out on Inoue beating Roman, Watanabe, Galaxy, and Moon.

And all of a sudden, he's bypassed all those guys and apparently gives one of the best fighters who ever lived a run for his money.

 

For me, the jury's out on whether he'd beat Estrada and Rungvisai.

There's a reason he didn't fight them.

 

I suspect he would, but like you said...

 

Really not sold on Inoue. He looks spectacular against C+, B- fighters, but struggling as.much against an ancient Donnaire is a a big red flag

 

I'm sold on him.

I'm not all attempting to bash Inoue here. I think he's an excellent, excellent fighter, and matches up very well against just about anyone in history at 115.

118 - dunno how he would fare against the greats, but I suspect not too well against the true upper crust.

We're talking about at 122 against WILFREDO fucking GOMEZ! The man who was considered P4P #1 when RAY LEONARD was peak.

Some people think that Canelo and Bud are better than Inoue. Pre-Sanchez, people didn't think Sugar Ray fucking Leonard was better than Gomez.

Think about that...

 

Y'know who matches up very well with Inoue at 115? Gerry Penalosa....

And Inoue is definitely legit, but people are going way overboard with him. Like, more than usual with current elites. He isn't beating Olivares or Gomez, and there's little hope he'll ever reach that level. I can only assume that it's because people don't really know the lower weights.

 

Olivares and Gomez. LOL!

Does even beat Rose??? Cause is if it's the Rose from the Harada fight, I say NO.

 

I just watched Castillo-Rose, and I think Inoue is soundly beaten by both. Actually, every BW since Zarate is IMO.

 

If Tanaka wins this week, rest assured, he's already the favorite over a prime Jofre...

Or at least I'm sure Ugo will believe so.

 

Knowledge = agreeing with Xplosive.

Ignorance = disagreement

Learn everybody, learn

 

I knew you fuck up this thread as soon as I opened it.

I said, "It's a great who fought before 1990, watch Ugo have some negative, contrarian opinion."

BTW - that's objectively, categorically false.

There are PLENTY PLENTY of posters who I disagree with, but say, "Ok, I don't agree, but I see your point."

You're just talking about your ass, Mr. "Joe Brown whooo?"

 

Yet, you were the one who took a personal shot on this thread. Which I fucked up

 

A personal shot?? LOL. WTF?

I didn't question your integrity as a human being, I questioned your boxing knowledge.

How in the world is that "personal"?