Will September decide the greatest fighter of this generation?

Andre Ward was the Better Fighter & Would've WHUPPED Canelo's Ass Head to Head (GGG Also)...But Canelo Accomplished SIGNIFICANTLY More...For Whatever Reason, Ward Never RESONATED...



REED

 

I dont like either guy. Ward or Alvarez. I can't say Alvarez accomplished significantly more. Even if you give him the golovkin rematch, which for me was a draw at best

Wards rematch victory over kovalev was far more dominant. Alvarez did ko that same Russian but only after ward and the other Alvarez had beat him down

What are these great wins Alvarez had ?

 

The 2 Kovalev fiascos left a bad taste in my mouth even after all these years, but yeah, Ward is in the equation.

 

So you're comparing how they both did at 175.

Ward fought at 165 in the amateurs and light heavyweight was an easy step up after his reign at 168.

Canelo was a welterweight amateur and at 5'8" really had no business at 175 other than to challenge himself and go for a title in a fourth weight class.

 

I'm comparing their best wins

Golovkin (on paper, I felt he won neither)

And kovalev (I had ward splitting the 2)

Alvarez accomplished the most in his career at 168, thats his best division

I dont care if he was a welter when he was 14

 

The hell you're talking about. He has accomplished much more at middle. It's obvious that this was his optimal weight

 

At 160 alvarez beat cotto, khan, chavez jr and jacobs. He got one dubious decision in the golovkin rematch and clearly lost their first fight

At 168 he beat fielding, Smith, yirildrim Saunders, plant, washed golovkin, Ryder, charlo, mungeara, bumlanga, scull. All clearly and easily and no one has come close to beating him there

 

Lara was also at middle. Yeah he had more close fights at 160, but his level of opposition was so much better that its a no contest

 

Canelo has contributed more to boxing through the sheer breadth of his work. He's embellished boxing. Were the fights close , disputed, even farcically fixed? Yes, some of them.

Take Canelo out if boxing this past 15 years. Take Ward out (he didn't even go 15 years) Bigger hole? It's left by Canelo.

Knocked out a pedophile. Called Oscar a drunk.

Didn't spit his gumshield against Froch.

Did it all with red hair.

Clear winner.

 

Maybe I don’t appreciate Andre Ward enough….but I don’t think he is that great….

Not in the discussion imo because other than the Kovalev fights, must of his better work was done pre 2012( Dawson, Kessler, Froch)that was still Floyd and/or Pacquiao generation.

 

Not Only Beating Kessler/Froch, But Having the Willingness to BET On Himself, Entering the Super 6 Tournament...Once Signed Up There was NO Picking & Choosing; Ward Had to Face Whoever was NEXT In Line...

The Super 6, the Dawson KO and the Kovalev Fights Illustrated Wards Greatness...Still, He Failed to RESONATE and Becomes the FORGOTTEN Great in Threads Like This...



REED

 

The kovalev fights were not a highpoint. Most thought he lost the first fight - hence, the rematch. And in the rematch, he won by low-blow.

 

I'm pretty surprised at the Canelo greater than Ward arguments. To me, they hold zero weight outside of Canelo being a bigger star.

Ward has the bigger, more significant wins and won them in much clearer fashion. Ward has a case of being the GOAT in his division, accomplishment wise at least. H2H, of course Roy was better at 168, but Ward has a claim as the greatest super middle.

Canelo doesnt really rank highly all time in any division he's won titles in with the exception of 168, where you can call him top 10 all time.

I dont gaf about star power. IMO Ward was greater by far. I have no dog in that fight, I hate them both equally.

 

Wasn't there a grievance over Ward avoiding having to travel overseas or away from home to fight during the super 6, unlike the rest? I guess it's what he managed to negotiate and it did leave him with some advantage, although there's no doubt he was the best of the lot....I dislike both but Ward ranks higher all time at 168 than Canelo at any division where he fought

 

2 Fights w/Andre Ward BROKE Sergey Kovalev, Irreparably...He Was NEVER the Same Again...The "Krusher" was No More...

In Boxing, Taking Another Man's SOUL is a "Highpoint"....




REED

 

ward hardly dented kovalev, elieder alvarez was clearly the one who broke him!

 

I would blame the cumulative effect of downing a river of Stoli vodka, no doubt he wasn't the same afterwards though

 

Exactly. These 2 fights only showed that Ward could beat Kovalev when a high level of corruption was involved

 

Probably a lot more to do with how disgusted he was with boxing afterward. Not a lot of people would stay commited to a sport that so blantantly screwed them twice

 

Yeah, but we are arguing the hypothecal scenario where Canelo beats Crawford convincingly.

 

If Alvarez beats crawford at 168lbs who gives a fuck?

There's nothing for him to gain legacy wise here

 

Only a total idiot would say such an absurdity (no surprise here). There's a ton of ATG that cemented their legacy by decisively beating a fellow ATG coming up in weight

 

Alvarez never wanted the fight because there's nothing to gain and everything to lose

The money was too good so he eventually accepted

What in the fuck is to be gained for a guy who's been at 168 lbs for 7 years facing a guy who's had 1 fight above 147 in his career, and hasn't fought in 2 years?

 

2 years? The hell are you talking about.

And yes, Canelo has a lot more to lose than Crawford, but his historical standing will definitely improved if he beat Crawford convincingly. Hell, the odds for the fight are rather close, so let's not pretend a canelo win is inconsequential

 

Canelo is expected to beat Bud. Bud is the one with the odds against him. If Nelo wins, it doesn't hurt his legacy, but I would still rank Ward over him.

My thoughts on Canelo are no secret: I think he's excellent, but simultaneously I think he's one of the most overrated fighters ever.

Divisional dominance means a lot to me when fighters; moreso than weight jumping. And like I said, the only division Saul ever made made his mark in is 168.

 

Nobody gave a shit when he beat charlo. Now he's facing an even smaller guy

 

Disagree vehemently. He more than made his mark at 160 by beating Cotto and GGG, who was ranked 1 p4p by quite a few pundits (albeit controversially). He also beat convincingly a few other solid fighters at that weight

Would I rank him in the top10 of the division? hell no, but thats because mw as such a deep history.

 

Alcohol and being robbed .

 

Crawford is a great fighter who could compete against pretty much anyone in history from 135 to 147 but hes old, inactive and has had 1 unimpressive fight above welter in his entire career

Nobody will be looking back on this as some legacy enhancer if Alvarez beats him like he did charlo