How much respect did you lose for Roy Jones Jr after the 3rd Tarver fight?

US standards are much higher than Euro standards.

Case in point, isn't Siaca the guy that critics laughed at as Roy was lining up a 'tuneup' fight in Philly before it fell through? Yet, he's considered a high point on Mikkel's resume? Also wondering if Kessler caught flak for fighting an old Lucas, you know the guy that Roy toyed with and was crucified by critics for fighting (a much younger version too I might add). Yes Roy was held to the highest standard ever, but I just wish people would draw a consistent line....being an elite fighter means you're part of a select few and Kessler was/is not one of them.

 

You are correct. I should have said Hopkins was recognized as the Light heavy chamipon linearly. In reality, he was not. Zolt Erdei is. DM was too. Yeah, Joe had more balls. He went to another country to get the perceived linear title and Kessler was supposed to be the legit successor. Roy never fought a guy like that. If people think Robin Reid beat Joe, they shouldn't score fights. Did you see that fight? Why would anyone see it again.

 

To be honest, the lineal stuff is a bunch of nonsense, but I'll initiate a thread in the very near future as to why DM wasn't the linear champion as suggested anyways.

With respect to Robin Reid, it was a close enough fight where a man "with the balls you say" would've rematched....you know the Roy standard.

With respect to travel, Joe finally came to the U.S. because he wanted to get paid. Joe came from the small pond to cash out & HBO forced his hand. Roy (and others big names) never travelled because in the modern boxing business climate, US stars didn't have to and shouldn't travel...so you can't compare travel habits because they were on opposite ends of the spectrum.

Now Joe came to beat a cagey & highly respected old(er) Hopkins, but remember he refused to come America when the recognized best was Roy....that speaks volumes. Don't forget that Joe candidly went on record to Boxing Digest back in the day and clearly said that Roy was the only guy that he didn't want to fight.

To my other points, they still stand. Emperically, it cannot be suggested that Joe has more grit or balls as you say...to be honest it doesn't even matter. They will finally fight on Nov 8 and we all can't wait.

 

Some of the revisionist stuff in this thread is quite unbelievable.

Firstly, Mikkel Kessler is most certainly an elite fighter by whatever definition you choose to apply. He completely cleaned out 168, including dominant wins over Andrade and Beyer and a hard fought win over Mundine- all guys the Calzaghe haters told everyone he was 'ducking' prior to Calzaghe fighting Kessler.

I remember quite well the build up to the Calzaghe-Kessler fight and I think the board was fairly evenly split on how would win. What I DEFINTELY DO recall is Mister REED confidently picker Kessler to stop Joe in the 11th round.

I have tried to find the prediction thread again to be sure of this, but life is too short frankly, and besides, I managed to find this instead:

Now, of course, because RJJ has returned to view, all of this seems to be forgotten though, it seems...:bangh:

That said, RJJ's win over Ruiz WAS bigger than Joes over Kessler. That was a MIDDLEWEIGHT beating a HEAVYWEIGHT, FFS! You can count how often that happens on one hand.

I also agree with those who rightly point out that this fight is a lose/lose proposition for Joe (save money). If he wins, which he will and comfortably, he was expected to beat what was left of Jones anyway and it meant nothing because Jones would have beaten Joe handily 6-10 years ago. If, someohow, Joe manages to lose, it will have a seriously negative impact on his legacy IMHO.

For once I also agree with Ike in one respect; there is no doubt that Joe himself has diminished considerably over the last few years and that this really should be his last fight if he wants to retire with that '0' intact.

That said, he still has far more left to offer than Roy. I still laugh my hands off whenever this topic comes up and will laugh harder still when the usual people start confidently predicting a RJJ miracle. It never ceases to amaze just how much common sense people disregard when it comes to their favourite fighters.

MTF

 

Roy's W over Toney clowns anything Calzaghe has ever done.

 

I for one thought Joe would indeed school Mikkel....Kessler was just too mechanical to give trouble to someone like Joe and it showed. Mikkel was/is good fighter, yes, but he was most certainly over-hyped to help bring along the promotion.

Time will tell to see what he does from here on in.....for a young guy he doesn't seem like he really wants to fight again though, doesn't it?

Bottom line it was a good win for Joe but the backlash here stems from the absurd suggestion that the Kessler win somehow outshines things accomplished in Roy's career....give me a break.

 

Mister FEEBLES...

Though it May have APPEARED that REED was Diminishing Calzaghe, Please Consider the CONTEXT N Which REED was Posting...

It was Basically a Roy Jones vs. Calzaghe RESUME Debate, Waged btwn REED (RJ Nuthugger Extraordinaire:cheer:) & Ike (NOTED Roy HATER & Calzaghe Lover)...

Also, REED isn't Certain WHO he Picked N the Calzaghe-Kessler Fight...It Very Well COULD have been Kessler...

"However", REED Vividly Remembers Calling Calzaghe "The SAFE Pick" on the FB Radio Show, Prior to the Fight Itself...

To Say that "Most" People Picked Kessler is FALSE...& Saying Kessler was More "Proven" than Calzaghe is LUDICROUS...

REED Has No Beef w/Someone Calling Kessler "Elite", but when it's THE SAME Motherfuckers who're RELUCTANT to Give Roy Jones ANY Credit Whatsoever (Questioning Roys "Balls", his Resume & his Place N History), that DOESN'T Wash...

REED:nono:

 

It's interesting how topic threads branch out into other directions.

 

No he only was the WBO champion beating the reigning WBA, IBF and WBC champions. By court ruling he was the first ever to unify all four major belts. artie:artie:

 

Actually he never won the WBC belt, but you need to look back even further as to why the claim is b.s.

Like I said, I'll go into it another time.

 

He won it from Rocky. :bears::bears:

 

There have always been debates as to RJJ resume

MTF is a confirmed RJJ fan, but I am also happy to admit that once his friend Gerald McClelland got hurt, he became a very different fighter.

I'm a certified fan of RJJ, but you cannot discuss his resume by comparing it to Joes. Joe left it late, sure, but BELATEDLY, Joe has shown himself to cut the mustard. Twice in his 168 reign, people have nominated champs to do for Joe, and both times (Lact and Kessler), he's proven his quality.

If you wanna big up RJJ, but you can't do it at the expense of Joe Calzaghe.

Or at the very least, you shouldn't do.

MTF

 

Roy Jones is so 1996.

 

No he didn't and if you give credence to Rocco as champ then the proposed foundational argument you have for DM's claim is 0%.

 

Court ruled Rocky was the rightful WBC champ, when he fought Darisuz again. End of the 35 million dollar story. :mj::mj:

 

I don't big up Roy's resume at the expense of Joe as everyone should stand on their own merit. Thing is we must admit that others have tried at the expense of Roy.

You'd notice especially in the late 90's-early 00's when the media was rotating guys like Oscar, Shane, & Tito above Roy in the p4p lists...."better resumes" they would say(actually that's not even how the original parameters of p4p was defined). Sure Oscar may have had a few more so-called names (not necessarily better fighters) on his resume, but can anyone honestly say that he or the other two were ever close to much less better than Roy Jones Jr?

 

Amen. It is sad to hear millions of Roy fans collective drop Roy's nuts on the floor. I laugh at Kellerman and Kenny who hold the Ring as its God, but fail to grasp both wrongly called Roy the man at 175. Unfortunately, Roy never wanted to prove it against the so call MichalSHitske. If DM was so bad, certainly superman Roy could have flown to Germany, with only some glued on feathers and his arm strength, impregnated 80 German woman and ko'd DM in the first round. Too bad Roy's legion of Homosexual warriors have large collective balls that their hero lacked.

 

Like I said previously....

 

info@wbcboxing.com <info@wbcboxing.com>

Jose Sulaiman wants to know how he can save 35 million dollars. :boohoo:

 

In trying to be clever you're veering off.....I'll post in detail on this bogus lineal claim in depth when I have some time.

 

So he "Won" the Title N a COURTROOM???...

Impressive!!!...


REED:boohoo:

 

Mr. FEEBLES...

This Thread Took a DIVERSIONARY Route when a CALZAGHE Fan Bigged Up HIS Resume, "Balls" & Accomplishments @ the EXPENSE of Roy Jones...

U MUST Understand that the RJ Nuthugger Coalition's Playing a COUNTERPUNCHING Role N this Particular Debate...


REED:hammert:

 

Perhaps YOU Can Explain WHY MichalSHITski SAID he'd Fight Roy Jones N America, Sat RINGSIDE for Roy vs. Virgil Hill, then (4 Rounds & a HELLACIOUS Bodyshot Later) Hopped On the QUICKEST PLANE OUT of the U.S., NEVER to Return to American Soil???...



REED:dunno:

 

LOL, you are not dragging me down to your fanboy nuthugger logic and beat me with experience. ::::

 

Instead of the RINGING of the Bell, MichalSHITski had his WBC "Reign" Ushered In by the BANGING of the Gavel...

NICE!!...


REED:shit:

 

The man is 39 so there is no way he is still peak. That being said, I do agree that Roy's problem is more mental than physical. He can still get it done and could have beaten Tarver in the third fight.

If that is what you mean by 'frontrunner' then I have to agree.

 

You don't think being rated as the best in boxing makes that difficult?

 

No it wasn't. Jones had campaigned at LH for years up until that point. To say he was still a natural MW is ridiculous.

 

I only said he wasn't shot. I don't see what is so controversial about that. He could have beaten both Johnon and Tarver and stopped Tito in 20 seconds. He is like Humpty Dumpty. Tarver smashed his weak little mind. The problem with Roy is he is just like his fans. He really thought he was unbeatable and he believed he won fights because he was better. I mean, how dare fans expect boxer to actually beat other fighters. We should stop fights all together and see who beats the heavybag the worst.

 

Aside from the fan bashing, I can't disagree with this. Roy I think bought into the whole 'unbeaten' nonsense boxing fans love these days. It's like your career is over after one loss. It's bullshit.