Anyone catch him last night? I was very impressed with him. He reminds me a little of a young Fernando Vargas. He looks extremely strong and mature in the ring. I would like to see him against more quality opponents but so far he seems like his future looks very bright ahead. Thoughts?
dsimon writes: I have a policy that says support the young ones unconditionally so I support this goofy kid. I never saw such a goofy Mexican sheesh! :: Time will tell. They are bringing him along good and slow as they should and he has not made any mistakes as he should not. The comparison to Vargas is not without merit by any means. The only thing that scares me is that Vargas had an edge, this kid with his a shucks smile and affliction hat, underwear and shirt... sheesh! :notallthere:
He looks to be a southpaw Fernando Vargas with fast hands and decent pop. I wouldn't mind seeing him take on Beastly Bradley or Holt.
What was so impressive about a young prospect 22-1-1 beating a bum with a record of 30-14-4? I should be more impressed with Wilfredo Vazquez Jr. (13-0-1, 11 KOs) winning the vacant WBO latino featherweight title over mexican Adolfo "El Terror" Landeros (19-11-1, 19 KO) just because Vazquez Jr (A) have zero amateur fights and (B) is the son of three division champ, Wilfredo Vazquez. Even though it was a highly entertaining fight (which was held in my backyard, the Kissimmee Civic Center, in Kissimmee, Florida), the fact that Landeros was a guy with 11 defeats, even if he came from upsetting an unbeaten Oscar De La Hoya protegee, that doesn't erase the fact that the guy was not that good. Vazquez Jr. still needs to work more on his defense and try not be constantly looking for the KO win (of course, he did pulled it at the 8th round, but he should not be looking to drop a bomb constantly).
I haven't seen Ortiz fight, so I don't know if he has talent at all, thus my question of why was it so impressive of a young guy 22-1-1 beating a bum of 30-14-4.:flip:
Because he actually looks impressive inside the ring. He has a lot of tools. I watched Vasquez struggle with some bum in Mexico and to put it mildly I wasn't impressed.
You shouldnt be putting in your 2 cents if you havent seen him fight. He looked very impressive showing many tools. This kid has a bright future and I can't wait to see him in the ring again.:bears:
dsimon writes: I don't see any particular tools from Ortiz quite honestly. He has power and he has good mental focus. I don't see any particular ring smarts, anything exceptional. He is a young fighter on his way up and he had my support but I seriously wonder how people can look at his performance and say he is doing anything more than not making mistakes and seasoning in the ring.
I can't wait to see him against better opposition. Hopefully we will very soon. He's only 21 years old I think.:bears:
maybe he can fight Rey Bautista in December :: But I agree, throwing him in their with a complete stiff - a junior lightweight stiff at that - tells next to nothing. Kid is mad talented, but there wasn't anything he did on Saturday that he wasn't supposed to do against a can.
dsimon writes: I just think one of the hardest things for me to accept about the fight game is that a kid cannot really make the mistakes they need to at times! As human beings we learn from mistakes yet a few wrong moves and a kid can go from the greatest thing since sliced bread to nothing! So a few cans is ok.
Beating on a can his size is forgiveable. A can that generally fights 10 lb lowe than a blue-chipper like Ortiz is all but asking for a ring fatality. So no, I can't agree with you in that regard
I dont see the Vargas comparison other than they were both from La Colonia in Oxnard. To me, Vargas was a tad slower, more economical in his punches, and to me Vargas punches were more of a thudding variety while Ortiz seems to have a quicker flashier punch. I actually think Feroz had underated footwork in that he was never fleet footed but he always seemed in front of his opponent in a good position to punch or counter. Ortiz still chases a lot.
Vargas did have good footwork indeed. It's not like he zipped around the ring, as you say, but his footwork was technically good, always in position, never clumsy or chasing.
The opposite side of that equation is that he was always in front of his opponent and could be countered seeing that he didn't have good head movement. This is the reason 'Nando was so easy to catch clean. Thus the KO losses to Trinidad, Oscar and Mosley and knockdowns by Rivera and Mayorga. From what I remember from the two times I've seen Ortiz, he's pretty much the same way. Let's see if he's got a chin.
bum or not, the dude is seriously overprotected. dibellas forced to talk out of both sides of his mouth when it comes to handling his career
Who has he fought? More importantly...stocky guy, short arms, supposed devastating power and gets hit far too cleanly and has been rocked by lesser opponents. TRANSLATION: a 147 version of Jeff Lacy...with better handspeed He'll look good against Forbes, but Forbes couldn't KO anyone at 135. Too bad DiBella has Cinitron...Cintron would be his ass (which says ALOT). Truthfully, Berto isn't that different from a young Bojado...the only difference is Bojado didn't like to train and Berto does.
Fair enough, I can't disagree with that, and it would be foolish to pick him over any top guy yet, he is too unproven. My point is simply that he does look like a pretty decent fighter thus far, and surely has potential. He looks more talented than Lacy ever did. He should hurry up and step it up though, yes.
agreed it was a good trait but also a liablity. While he was always in position to throw good punches he also had a pourous approach to D in that he would drop his hands a ton thus getting countered was the #1 way Feroz got fucked up. as for Ortiz he is fleeter of foot but he chases a bit which leads to believe he will get caught coming in and in his fight under the DLH Forbes he got dropped. it was a clean knockdown but he seemed ok. Heck Barrientes dropped him on the under of Pac Solis. not sure about his chin both times moreso than maybe getting carried away with what he was doing and getting caught for it Berto on the other hand I hear is horribly chinny
I think we need to re-define what a "bum" is. A bum is John Duddy, or Mora. Berto isnt a bum. Overrhyped maybe, but he's not a bad fighter at all. Lacy, pre-Calzaghe, wasnt a bum either. Though he's certainly become a bum post-Calzaghe. BTW - Bojado was actually MORE talented than Berto IMO, and had Panchito had Berto's dedication, he would have been better than Cotto in my mind.
dsimon writes: Ortiz does chase a bit when he stalks no question about it. Vargas' foibles and successes defy clear explnantions in so far as: He was a precise predator when he was setting up his shots coming up the food chain... he seemed to lose that edge and wanted to see himself based on being a big puncher. He also stopped throwing his combos as much as when he was coming along under Debella. Hence he was open also becasue he was throwing less shots when in front of the other guy. Ortiz already wants to see himself as a puncher. Where as Fernando was a stalker in his early days Ortiz fights like a puncher.... He looks like he is imitating Joe Louis frankly. Where this will take him is anybody's guess, my guess is as follows. The kid is either a big puncher, or won't make it past being credible.
