Once a cheat, always a cheat

Vernon Forrest getting cortizone shots in his shoulders then going out and throwing some of the most hellacious shots ever to hand Mosley his first loss along with several years of hesitancy.

 

Surely that can't STILL be hurting. :dunno:

 

I still call bullshit on that one

The story always goes:

Pryor was dead at the end of the 13th round, and then all of the sudden he come out totally rejuvenated and KOs Arguello in the 14th

But that is horsehit, watch the fight... Arguello lands two great right hands in that 13th round and Pryor goes NOWHERE, he doesnt even seem fazed, he just keeps punching... he never looks hurt or dead... and he looks no different coming out for the 14th than he did at the end of the 13th

Furthermore, what was in the water bottle? Cocaine? All that would do is make him high strung (if it was even strong enough to begin with) and make him feel more energized, it doesn't enable to hit any harder or stay conscious from hellacious right hands... and nobody ever proved what was in the bottle to begin with... Pryor was quoted as saying that he though Lewis had poured a little peppermint schnaps in there ... to me there needs to be more than just "gimme the one that I mixed!" shouted in the corner on TV to prove exactly WHAT took place and WHAT was in the bottle

I feel the same way about Dempsey's gloves-- Willard's people satred that whole controversy... to this day there's never been any conclusive proof

 

dude, watch Dempsey/Willard and tell me his gloves weren't loaded. It was obvious to me.

I don't know about Pryor. But I definitely observed a surge in his energy level coming out for the 14th round. It was as if he were as fresh in the 14th as he was in the 1st, having looked tired and even exhausted in between.

I know there's no proof. There's no proof when it comes to Trinidad either. But does anyone really doubt that he was up to no good? He hasn't had a single significant win, let alone a knock-out, since losing to Hopkins. That alone should tell you his hand-wrapping had not been on the up and up.

 

Where did Pryor look exhausted? He looked fresh as a daisy throughout that fight... He came out for round 14 the same way he came out for the previous 13 rounds, he came out aggressive, moving and blasting, going after Alexis... I have watched that fight 1000 times trying to see what people are talking about, actvely LOOKING for it... there is no marked change between 13 and 14

You could TELL Dempsey's gloves were loaded??? On a grainy black and white silent filmstrip from 1919, you can TELL they are loaded??? HOW??? Based on what??

 

There is substantial audio/visual evidence that cheating took place in the pryor/arguello fight.

 

There IS???....


REED::

 

no there isn't

There is substantial evidence of Panama Lewis saying "Gimme that one... The one that I mixed"

There is NO visual evidence of Pryor being in danger of losing that fight or being "dead tired" at ANY point

There is also no visual difference between the Pryor who laughed off to BOMBS in round 13 and finished the round strongly and the Pryor at the tart of round 14

 

Andrew Golota received a lidocaine injection prior to fighting Lennox Lewis.

 

I have read that the damage Willard actually received was much lesser than what usualli is reported. The stories about broken cheeks, jaw and nose were probably made up to make Dempsey sound more fearsome

 

exactly:bears:

 

I didn't claim Pryor was in danger of losing, nor did I claim the historian's take on the fight is accurate, because it isn't. Much like Ali/Foreman people remember it in a made up stupid light that anyone with a TV set can laugh at.

What there is, is proof that Pryor cheated on camera. "The bottle that I mixed" and the subsequent disciplinary action taken against his trainer, a known cheat, makes this an analogous comparison.

"You don't mix water with water"

It would take a load of dreaming and turning away to look at that situation ad think Pryor was clean.

 

i don't think Vernon had developed his shoulder problem by the time he fought Mosley. i think it happened afterwards.

 

Let me give you an example... Larry Holmes had a water bottle taken away by officials during one of his fights... guess what it was? water and HONEY... now lets say that was never disclosed... we could all ASSUME that it must have been something performance enhancing... obviously drinking honey isn't a performance enhancer by any appreciable length

Furthermore, guilt by association is not a viable prosecution

Again all we know is that the water bottle had SOMETHING in it... but what? Pryor thought it was some booze (peppermint schnaps) to help calm his nerves (Jake LaMotta was known to use a similar tactic on a few occassions) which wouldnt exactly enhance your performance (ever seen a drunk fight someone sober?)

Furthermore the idea that it was Cocaine and he was drnking it is beyond ridiculous. First off you don't DRINK cocaine (there are some people crazy enough to mix a small amount of it into some hard liquor but this is extremely dangerous... the only time cocaine is mixed with water and out directly into the body is through needle injection or through a nasal spray (see Thomas "Hollywood" Henderson during Super Bowl 13) .. you don't swallow it... especially when you are exerting yourself in one of the most physically taxing activites known to man (a 15 round boxing match) ... if you drink a bottle of water laced with cocaine while exerting yourself in that manner, you will be in the hospital before the fight is over... There was no way Pryor was drinking a water/cocaine combo... All you can PROVE is that Lewis gave him a some sips from a water bottle that had water AND SOMETHING else in it... no one has any evidence of WHAT that something else is... it could have been cat piss for all we know... Like I said, Pryor thought it tasted minty so he assumed it was peppermint schnaps... but there is no way it was cocaine... you dont drink cocaine and water between rounds (he drank from the "mixed" bottle numerous times, not just the 14th round)

 

Just asking, isn't water, cocaine and baking soda free basing?

 

Its a step towards there

after that you need to heat it up

but you don't DRINK it

 

EXCELLENT Breakdown!....

& the THing is, Pryor Granted Arguello an IMMEDIATE RE & Stopped him even SOONER....Yet Peeps like to Dwell on the "Bottle" from the 1st Fight???...Did that 1 Sip CARRY OVER to the RE as Well????....



REED:dunno:

 

Frans Botha has been brought to my attention elsewhere. He's now added.

 

Name your sources.

 

Thanks, REED:kidcool:

Good point, he wasted him in one-sided fashion in the return match

That must have been some MIX he had::

 

or be branded an abject coward:kick:

 

phonetap agrees that it most likely wasn't cocaine in that bottle, however you can drink cocaine (small amounts). wasn't that one of the original main ingredients of coca cola before it became illegal? anyhow, phonetap digresses...carry on.

 

I will not name names.

 

it was a trace amount in coca-cola, the amount has grown over the years as the legend has become more popular...not enough to get "high" from

 

You're in contempt!

 

dsimon writes:

Cdogg is right on as usual... Trace amounts can give you a buzz but with cocaine heroine and a lot of those other potent and processed substances the amount you would have to ingest for an effect that is equal to other methods of ingestion is what makes it prohibitive. You have to use a lot more... a lot.

 

Honestly, I agree with you. I would rather believe that Pryor did not cheat because I'm a big fan.

But come on, something had to be in that bottle. ::

 

Sure, maybe alchohol. and I never said there wasnt something in it, but there are limitations as to exactly WHAT was in there and if it had any REAL positive impact for Pryor

but it damn sure wasn't Cocaine or any other "hard drug"

 

I think it was half a kilo of heroin.

 

:atu: