James Kirkland vs Joel Julio on March 7th!

how could anyone enjoy mayweather jr's 'chess match' with goyo vargas but then say he stunk it out vs baldomir?? both fights were equally awful to watch.

 

I think I'd take El Perro over Kirkland.

 

Why, do you think it's just a matter of him being able to stand his ground and nail Kirkland with his own power shots?

Or is there more to it?

 

Yep. Angulo throws nice, crisp, relaxed combinations, and is very accurate. Kirkland is certainly alot quicker than Angulo, but Kirkland's D is so poor that Angulo will have no trouble finding him despite El Perro's lack of handspeed. Angulo by late TKO.

 

For me is, despite Kirkland's stamina and evident pressure I think Angulo has the better offensive arsenal and in a sure brawl that will make the difference.

 

This fight should really happen.

 

Absolutely.

Remember right before Saturday's fight between Kirkland and Julio? Kellerman was telling the boxing fans watching to call their friends and get them to watch.

I was looking forward to the fight but i didn't have the anticipation he did. (yeah i know he's a broadcaster and paid to hype things up)

Still, Kirkland-Angulo would be a fight that i can't see being anything but great even if it only lasts a couple of rounds.

 

definitley a brawl, a lot of punches square in the face.

good times

 

Not for a few years, thanks.

 

Do you think it's worth it to wait?

I say match them up while they're undefeated and staples on HBO.

 

Are you that sure either one or both of them will make it a few years?

 

He said the same thing before Juan Diaz-Michael Katsidis.

Fortunately, I ignored him.

 

Nope, but I also don't see the need of reason for a fight between them any time soon. Not unless belts are on the line.

 

And possibly lose one of them in the process? Makes no sense.

 

I know where you're coming from, and honestly, I can see it both ways.

Good talk.

 

I'm not advocating they fight now, either, just asking whether when you mentioned a few years, you actuallly thought they'd both be there at that point.

In terms of belts, Kirkland may end up fighting for the IBF one soon. It's vacant, he's one of the two hightest ranked at #3 (behind Bundrage), and Anuglo's on the doorstep of the WBC and WBO, so they'll have their chances soon enough.

Though I should say, as far as entertainment value goes, I think it'd be better now than later in their carerers.

 

Tam, there seems to be a very small window of time where a match up is OK with you ::

I'd like to see the fight right now.

I wouldn't know who to pick.

I think Angulo is overrated. Certainly I think Ortiz is a much, much better prospect/contender.

And if anything Kirkland is slightly underrated, due to his lack of seasoning. He has qualities that make up for that though.

Why do people say Kirks has a suspect chin?

 

Doesn't the same ring true for almost any two fighters though? When they're young, hungry and eager, fighters tend to make for better fights when matched with guys of that same ilk.

So from a purely selfish fans perspective, sure, lets see them fight right now, because I agree with you that it would be a better fight not than in two or three years. However the caveat is simply that they are not on an even playing field, IMO.

Angulo is the more seasoned guy, even with far fewer rounds/fights under his belt.

 

I don't think Kirklands chin is suspect at all. He's a tough dude who eats a boatload of clean shots.

That said, I chose to ignore your first remark. You missed the window for my humor mood today. Thats small too.

 

There's nothing like 2 young, hungry undefeated, aggressive fighters going at it.

I would love for that fight to happen now, and you KNOW it would be better right now than a couple of years down the road, where there were possibly belts, future paydays on the line.

Angulo IS more seasoned, but I wouldn't be remotely surprised if Kirks beat him up. I just don't think Angulo is anything special.

Kirkland might be underseasoned but he is fierce, determined, powerful, good stamina, and a fair bit quicker than Angulo.

I can't say much about either's chin. Never seen Angulo clocked hard, and Julio was hitting Kirkland with arm punches for the most part.

 

I say match em both now whilst thier still in thier primes. We all pretty much agree that neither one of them is bound for greatness, just match em up right now and lets see a great action fight! Winner goes on to probably a title shot, and the loser will still get HBO dates, provided they perform well.

Idk why you dont wanna see now Tam.

 

Kirkland's chin isnt suspect, but its definitely not great either. Same with Angulo.

I think El Perro's technical superority gives him the edge, but Kirkland would be very live... mainly because Kirkland is just a vicious guy, and a "hard man" so to speak. In other words... when the going gets tough, I doubt Kirkland would turn bitch like Juan Diaz.

 

Kirkland has strength where Angulo has weakness and vice versa. They fight with a similar style, yet Kirkland is far more aggressive and about five beats quicker. That would matter a whole lot more if James had Alfredo's accuracy and timing. So right now, we have too young, aggressive...yet green fighters, who some day soon might be among the best not only in the division, but perhaps the sport. Some day that might be a huge fight.

Yet you want to see them fight now? I just don't get the rush. Neither kid is going to be rushed into a fight they can't win any time soon and the TV network that counts has their eye on both.

It'll happen.

PS: Angulo was all fucked up vs Guttierez, but he battled through it pretty well.

 

I like them both... but I cant envision either one getting a sniff at the P4P lists in thier careers.

BTW - Angulo was hardly "fucked up" against Guetierez brah. He was simply stunned. Not unlike when Chop Chop stunned Floyd years ago.

 

Angulo was hurt. Clearly and could have went down. I also think Mayeather was hurt by Corley too. I don't go into all this differeing levels of hurtness. Buzzed, queer street, drunk, faggy...its a waste of time. He got punched in the head, his legs went shit, he wobbled....he was hurt...he recovered and sunk his fists into Gutierrez' guts and won the fight.

No biggie.

 

I really think it rings more true for these two than most, because of they're styles, and what they lack (and what they'll continue to lack, no matter how much experience and seasoning they gain in the next year or two).

I don't see either really getting all that much better than they are right now, they're both vulnerable as they step up, and their styles are such that they're going to get a lot of miles, hard miles, early.

 

Kirkland was dropped, and hurt pretty badly, against Allen Conyers.

Great one round action fight on Shobox a while back.

 

Of course not. You´d have to hate Kirkland as much as Diaz to say that, since you imply Diaz caught a career-altering beating in his last fight, but also quit in the very same fight. :doh:

 

Thanks Mitch, I didn't know that. To be honest, I've only seen both these guys a few times, their most recent few fights.

As I said before, Julio was mainly throwing arm punches, but the odd time he did sit down on his shots, he stopped Kirkland in his tracks, but didn't hurt time.

And Tam - I guess my sentiments are similar to Xplosive. Neither one of them are destined for greatness I feel, just two solid action fighters, so why not match them up while they're at their peak?

In fact I'm pretty surprised at your suggestion of the possibility of them being the best fighters in the sport. Not only can I not see that at all, but I seem to recall you not being that high on either one of these guys?

For example, I questioned why Kirkland has been brought along relatively slowly seeing as he turned pro in 2001, and your response seemed to indicate that he wasn't that good, or was very green, and that's why.

Being that he did turn pro 8 years ago, and has 25 fights, I think what you see is what you get with Kirkland. I don't think he's green.

Angulo is pretty seasoned, he won't improve much either. Naturally, they'll both become more experienced, and gain a few more tricks of the trade, but honestly I don't think we'll see a radical improvement from either of them.

And because of how aggressive they are, they could have short primes, so why not match them up now?

And as you said Tam, their strengths/weaknesses are in different areas BUT, they are both aggressive fighters, so it's a very interesting matchup that's all but guaranteed to be a good action fight.

They seem to be naturally the same size too, it's a great matchup.

 

If they're Not Careful, Angulo-Kirkland Could End Up Being like Jermain Taylor vs. Jeff Lacy...A Few YEARS Ago, Most Fans SALIVATED @ the Notion, but Everybody had the Idea of Letting the Matchup SIMMER, Figuring the Fighters would Only Get Bigger & BETTER w/Time...Admittedly, REED was 1 of the Fans who Thought this Way....

Next Thing U Know, Lacy Takes a POUNDING from Calzaghe, is NEVER the Same & Looks WORSE N Each Ensuing Bout...Taylor Actually WINS a Title, Looks UNimpressive N a String of Defenses, Gets WAXED by Pavlik then UD'ed by him N the RE...

So by the Time Taylor-Lacy Actually Transpired, it was More of a CASH-OUT, "Loser Leaves Town" Type of Bout, Instead of the HIGHLY Anticipated Affair it COULD have Been a Mere 2-3 Years PRIOR...

Angulo vs. Kirkland Needs to Happen Sooooooner Rather than Later...Like N the Next Year @ the LATEST...Like Others have Said, NEITHER Man has an EXTENDED Career Ahead of Him...REED's Becoming a Pretty BIG Fan of Angulo's, but he IS Limited...He's Going to have LOSSES Along the Way, which'll Chip AWAY @ his Luster Somewhat...This will Happen to Kirkland to a HIGHER Degree...w/His LACK of Technique & 1 Dimensionality, 1nce the "Book" is Out on Kirkland, he's Gonna Fall Off DRAMATICALLY...

REED's Point is, NEITHER of these Dudes has "Lb for Lb'der" Stamped on him...Angulo POSSIBLY, but LOWER Top 10 if That...w/N their Next 5 Fights Alfredo Angulo & James Kirkland Need to FIGHT Each Other...They have the Right STYLES & the Right NETWORK Behind them to Make it a MEMORABLE Event...

If U Wait Tooooooooooo LATE, it'll B more like Taylor-Lacy or even WORSE, like Fernando Vargas vs. David Reid; A Matchup that Kept Getting Pushed Back to the Point that it Became IRRELEVANT Altogether...



REED:hammert: