You're confusing talent and skill again. Arguello had perfect balance and leverage on every shot. You can't SHOW somebody how to throw a punch like Alexis Arguello or Joe Louis. Those are physical gifts at least as much as technical gifts. The leverage Micky Ward achieved on his left hook to the body can't be taught either; he probably dropped his sparring partner with it the first time he walked into the gym. Skill, ie boxing fundamentals, are transferable and learnable, body mechanics, balance, reflex', all of which are usually put down to 'skill' and all of which contribute to the effectiveness of a fighters punching technique, footwork and head movement are not. Let's just say this - I really enjoy watching Gomez, for whatever crazy, individual reasons I may have (I think he's thoughtful and well schooled), you and REED don't, and we'll leave it at that.::
Can we add a couple more statements and "then" leave it at that? 1. Gomez has shitty technique 2. Gomez is among the last fighters a young fighter should emulate if he wants to have good technique 3. I'm not sure you've properly distinguished talent from technique. 4. You contradict yourself when you say that mechanics cannot be transferrable or learnable; by definition, mechanics are just that. It's why Henry Ford was able to mass produce cars - because it was a question of mechanics. At the end of the day, I think you've summed it up well. You enjoy watching the guy. I just get the feeling you're not sure why.
Look man, if you're gonna be a pompous, condescending prick about things at least put your brain into gear before making nonsensical disanalogies. Seriously, the mass production of cars as an analogy for individual anthropometry? Really? They should close down which ever production line your cpu came off. Body mechanics & leverage are individual. No two individuals will punch with identical leverage and mechanics even if they were taught by the same trainer at the same time. Since you're gonna be like this, lets just go back to the status quo and agree to agree on SFA.:doh:
Whatt??? Double acts like that???? No way! :: With all the whining he does about it when he feels it is directed at him??
"MAN" you've got a hard-on for me, don't you? I can't say anything without a poking and prodding little smart ass remark from you. You're just a dick. It was not my intention to be condescending to Hut-hut, I was simply debating his statement that Gomez has good fundamentals, but is without the talent to really make use of them. I couldn't disagree more. That's all I was trying to say. But you. You don't even give a shit about the topic. You just follow me around sniping me every chance you get. You know who acts like that? People with inferiority complexes. They get a "hard-on" for someone, follow them around like a damn border collie, and bug the shit out of them all fucking day. Why don't you leave me out of your little so-called "battle," you petti jerk.
:laughing::laughing: Poor, poor Double. I could tell you were trying to talk down to hut-hut and so, apparently, could he. Admit it, you were being a bit of a jackass. And of course, your only recourse when called on it...is to call names like a 5th grader. "You're a dick" :: Is that the best you can do...really??
Good thread, although I don't agree with the praise in his technique. Gomez has rarely been in a fight where he was the more gifted fighter in the ring. But he was given the gift of some mammoth sized balls, and sometimes, that's all it takes. Guys like Robert Guerrero and Victor Ortiz can learn a thing or two from someone like Gomez.
Oh well. Maybe I'm wrong, it wouldn't be the first time. But to my eyes he has really good solid 101 and is thoughtful with it. He's just slow, clumsy, has poor reflex' and isn't very strong or powerful, so he's never gonna look smooth like a classical technician. I think the fact he's made the top 15 or so of his division despite being so remarkably ungifted is evidence enough that must be doing something right, and I don't think it's just shear bloody minded courage or toughness. But anyway, my appreciation for him is now documented for posterity, I'll leave it at that. Alfonso Gomez:bears:
I usually likes and appreciates you DL, but in this case, you just don't know what the fuck you are talking about, Ruiz is a fucking warrior
Ruiz is a warrior, watch his fights with Chagaev and Golota where he dugged deep and outwilled his more skilled and talented opponenet in the later rounds. Or his fights with the very boring Valuev, he's the only fighter who outmanned Valuev and made him watchable, the others who beat him or gave him a tough fight outfinessed and outmaneuvered him. Not ruiz, he went in there and brawled with the giant. Or what about his slugfest with ''lights out drugs in '' Toney, where while he was getting beat up in the later rounds, his will was never broken and still fought hard enough to fool some people into thinking he had won the fight. Fact is, Ruiz never quit and apart from the Jones fight, never gave up on himself in a fight, sure he had a couple of boring fights bu imo, it was more the falut of the opponent, who usually wouldn't try to punch when he was coming inside, than his
So U Can't VOUCH for Ruiz's "WARRIOR" like Qualities???...Sounds like a Subtle, Anti-Ruiz Opinion to REED... REED:hammert:
This is my favorite part "sure he had a couple of boring fights bu imo, it was more the falut of the opponent, who usually wouldn't try to punch when he was coming inside, than his" ::
Ruiz, ever since getting KTFO by Tua, has done nothing but show contempt for the fans with his grappling and holding. I don't know how he won some of the fights he did; I don't know how he got the TV coverage he did. I'll say one thing for him - for having a weak chin he's taken his opponents the distance a lot and if I remember correctly, hasn't been KO'd since the Tua fight. Then again, he hasn't been involved in a watchable fight since the Tua fight either (save for the Toney fight which he clearly lost, Toney's steroids not withstanding). Steroids or not, you have to give Toney credit for neutralizing Ruiz's neutralizing style and landing clean and hard shots throughout the fight.
