Is Arthur Abraham good enough to beat Jermain Taylor?

105-103, 107-102, 106-102, all for Abraham

No way Taylor was ahead. He won four rounds at most

 

he's got all the panache and flair of a drunken frat boy. he's got allot of natural talent and fair enough he comes to fight, but he does so like his coach stopped teaching him anything after a fortnight.

 

No Offense, Brother X, But REED is SICK & TIRED of All the ASSumptions that Kessler Beats this Guy or that Guy...U Haven't Done it, but SEVERAL Posters R ALREADY Calling him a "Great" Fighter, but WHAT EXACTLY has he Done???...He MIGHT Beat Abraham, but REED CAN'T Sit here & Say that Kessler "Would" Beat Abraham...

agREED that a TALL, MOBILE, QUICK HANDED Fighter (Dirrell, Ward) would have a LEGIT Chance of Outpointing Abraham, as Does Kessler Admittedly...Abraham would Definitely have to STEP UP his Activity Rate Against that Type of Opponent...But his SPEED, ACCURACY & POWER Give him a LEGIT Chance of STOPPING Anybody...



REED:mj:

 

We're both entitled to our opinions. I'd pick Kessler, you'd pick AA... hopefully we'll find out for sure in the final.

 

Other than the HIGH GUARD, Abraham is NATHAN like Winky Wright...He's FASTER, Punches Infinitely HARDER & is QUICKER in REED's Opinion...The Comparison to Wright is SUPERFICIAL @ Best...Abraham, Wright & Josh Clottey All Implement the High Guard, but w/DRASTICALLY DIFFERENT Results....



REED:mj:

 

REED Thinks Abraham is UNpredictable...Sure, he'll Operate Behind the High Guard, but U NEVER Know when he's Gonna UNLEASH...U Know that Eventually WILL Unleash, but it's Impossible to Predict WHEN...


REED:mj:

 

Nah...No Way was Taylor Winning...


REED:mj:

 

The scoring for Froch-Dirrell is debatable, but ANYBODY that thinks Taylor was winning going into the 12th against AA should never judge a fight again. Thank god AA knocked him cold. Or else there woulda been a few blind mice saying that JT got jobbed.

 

AA is winning this whole tourny

 

I thought the fight was dead even. Abraham fucking sucks. He went life and death with a shot fighter. Abraham was gettign outlanded 4 0r 5 to one. tHE JABS THAT hit is guard and face count. Winky Wright fights like that except ha outlansded his opponents. Abrahm throws 5 punches a round. Here you guys go saying this clown is a puncher. JT has been kayoed in what 3 of his last 6 fights. JT needs to retire.

 

VERY
TIRED
SCHTICK


REED:shit:

 

:doh:

 

Basically, I think all four fighters fucken sucked pretty much,.. Arabham may have looked the most potent,.. but he was fighting the guy favoured to finish in last place,.. there was nothing 'dominant' about Arabham, and what's worse is that,.. what the fuck was up with doing absolute minimal... and then running the last 20 seconds out of each round?....it was a bitch tactic, a 'German house' kind've tactic.

 

What schtick? Abraham is not effective in winning rounds. I had even only because I had to take a point for the bullshit point deduction which was a 9-9 round because Taylor won it. Abrahm fights literally 30 seconds a round. I felt he only clearly won about 4 rounds and almost all the others were debateable or Taylor. Taylor landing 15 jabs to 4 hard AA jabs puts JT ahead in close rounds, imo. There is nothing effective about AA's aggression. He throws wild bombs that miss 90% of the time and stands there and patially blocks jabs for 230 seconds of a round.

He only fights like that because he is in Germany and knows that he can't lose a decision. Even with the point deduction on judge had it 105, 103. You guys drink the Kool aid about this guy. I saw a young guy strugggle with a shot fighter. The kayo punch was a beauty though. It was aperfect shot. AA still looked awful for the first 11.75 rounds.

 

U Simply DON'T Know How to Score Fights Then...Fights R Scored on CLEAN, EFFECTIVE Punching, RING GENERALSHIP, DEFENSE & EFFECTIVE Aggression...

Quite CLEARLY, Abraham Landed the More EFFECTIVE Shots, he CONTROLLED the Pace of the Fight (RING GENERALSHIP)...There was NO Fast, Impressive Start from Taylor, like we're Accustomed to Seeing Because he Found Out VERY EARLY that Abraham could Counter & KO him for his Bravery...REED Can't Recall EVER Seeing Taylor Fight Soooooooo PASSIVELY...

Abraham's DEFENSE was Impeccable...Taylor NEVER Solved the High Guard...NEVER Punched THRU the High Guard...& Taylor ISN'T Really the Type to GIVE Ground Unless he DOESN'T Like what he's Being Hit w/...Taylor was in RETREAT Mode More than Abraham was...

As for your Schtick, the Over-the-Top Negativity is PLAYED OUT, Dude...A Year or So Ago it was SOMEWHAT Humorous, but the Shelf Life of that Schtick has Now EXPIRED...Abraham "Fucking Sucks"???...

Yeah, O.K...



REED:shit:

 

I was wrong on Abraham, he fought a smart fight. I was impressed with his punch economy. Not sure how effective it will be against someone who can sustain a higher work rate.

 

Reed please,.... if the top priority in scoring was really 'cleaner, harder punching' .. for a start there is no real way to gauge how hard punches are, Pavlik is a heavy handed clubber but his punches dont look like much, whereas Cory Spinks strikes with a FLASH,.. but there's not much on it,.. also, if it's about landing cleanly,.. how could anyone defeat a fighter behind the high guard??... Winky shouldn't have a loss on his record..

Aggresion and workrate have to be rewarded first and foremost,.. the only way 'defence' can trump offense is if you defend the aggresion and land MORE punches in return, you dont award the odd clean pot if you've been scuffed and bruised with 20 knucks.

 

I only watched the last 4 rounds and was going on what i could decipher from the german commentating

 

Nonsense. You go with who put more hurt on the other guy in the 3 minute, period. That simple. Is there an element of subjectivity in that - of course - but rather that than turning boxing into a mindless game of rock em sock em robots like scoring fights with your mindset soon would.

 

Although rockem sockem robots is always entertaining, in the sense of Gatti-Ward, you can be a skilled aggressive fighter and defend just aswell as you can attack, an aggressive, accurate, defence savvy fighter is the most precious as you can get, and under the criteria I have emphasized, scoring would be in his favor,.. ofcourse if you visibly hurt your opponent, you will most likely win the round, but if you back up and cover up, and run off the back of a single pot-shot while being scuffed up with 10, and win the round, then it obviously encourages a strict, counter-punching, running, bitch-style,..and that is bad for boxing, it sears the already frustrated eyes.

 

My perception is that you cannot score a fight to save your life.

 

In the Case of Jermain Taylor it's APPARENT when an "Effective" Blow is Landed...For Better or Worse, there's NO Pretense w/Taylor...When he's Hurt &/or Bothered by a Shot, it's OBVIOUS in his Body Language...Taylor Very RARELY Gives Ground, Unless he's Been HURT...

So while there's SOME Truth to what U're Saying, it DOESN'T Apply to the Taylor-Abraham Bout....

Guys that Use a High Guard have TORSO's, Don't They???...& a Guy that Can PUNCH Can BREAK THRU the High Guard...Even w/the High Guard, a Fighter has to Either Use the "Ear Muff" Approach (Leaving himself Open DOWN THE MIDDLE) Or the "Peek-a-Boo" Approach (Leaving the Sides of his Head & Torso OPEN)...

If the High Guard was an IMPENETRABLE Defense EVERYBODY Would Use it...



REED:hammert:

 

July 20, 2021: Arthur Abraham, weighing in at 171 lbs, retained his WBA, WBC, IBF, and WBO cruiserweight titles for the 45th time and his WBA, WBC, IBF, and WBO heavyweight titles for the 33rd time by knocking out 2-time heavyweight gold medalist Pedro Gonzalez (now 55-1 (53) as a pro). Abraham's supermiddleweight and light heavyweight titles were not on the line as Gonzalez came in at the cruiserweight limit of 200 lbs.

Abraham lost the first two rounds, but came on and stopped the Cuban with a brutal, one-punch KO in the 7th round extending his record to 112-0 (106)....

(as posted at Fightbeat.com right after Abraham's win...)

Free Ike: Abraham is the worst 'champion' I've ever seen and can't punch for shit.

 

You still dont land 'clean and hard' with the high guard, Winky, Arabham, Clottey,.. if punches truelly landed on them with full force at will, without being partially deflected or blocked, they'd be damaged and retired by now, Roy used the high guard shell against Tarver in thier first encounter, Tarver unleasched everything he had on Roy, a few snicks and nicks got in,.. but it only took one single blow in the rematch, and he wasn't behind the high guard at the time.

 

:: ???..

 

:: Good stuff!

 

So In Addition to the Shoulder Roll, Should we just BAN the High Guard as Well???...How Bout This, ANY Semblance of "Defense" (Blocking, Ducking, Moving, etc.) Should B ERASED from the Rule Book Altogether???...

Instead of Calling it "The Manly Art of Self-DEFENSE", Call it "The Manly Art of NO DEFENSE"...Instead of "Hit & DON'T Get Hit", let's Call it "Hit & GET HIT"...



REED:shit:

 

:: Reed please,..,... I've always said, that the high guard defense was refreshingly LEGAL,.. and it is,.. but if you want to win a fight behind it, you've got to attack in equal measure, you cant just cover up and back up while your opponent flails away, by thinking you're going to ride out the round on one or two clean pot shots, ie the apparent 'cleaner, harder punch or two which automatically wins you the round'... ^:: you have catastrophized the point I was trying to make, and it made for good REEDing, but I'm just trying to help people understand a fundamental scoring emphasis that would encourage a more even blend of defense and attack, and not allow way too large an avenue for the negative fighter to be comfortable in.

 

Why6 was his face red then? Those punches did land and they do count. You guys really can't score a fight. Throwing a punch hard and hitting the arms does not count for 20-25 punches that land on the face. He blocks them, but they do get in. I don't care if you count it as a half punch, Taylor outlanded Abraham in most rounds.

I will say again. Abraham is one of the worst long reigning betlholders in the sport. He is an average puncher as well. He stopped a guy who simply cannot take a punch anymore. IMO, the only good fighter in this tournament is Kessler and to use a line of yours(although I will be proven right and you were proven wrong) you will see how far from elite Abraham is when he fights Kessler. He won't win a second.

Are you gutys serious? Abraham does not throw enough punches to clearly win most rounds. All of his rounds are close or he gives them away. I never saw the effective aggression as you say except for 2 rounds. One he hit JT with a punch right on the jaw and stunned him. The other was the 12th. Other than that, he hit JT's arms and ate partially blocked jabs all night while doing nothing back. Sorry, a fighter should not be rewarded for salting away 230 seconds of each round.

Abraham is average, average puncher, average skill and below average output.

 

You just lose all credibility when you say he has average power. Thats like saying Pacquiao has average handspeed.