Is it time to call Pacquiao the GOAT?

Wherever you rate Duran on the all time lists, Pacquiao should be at higher.

I don't care if that is duran at 40 and pacq at 39 or if it is duran at 4 and pacq at 2. Pacq's career is better and he was a better fighter.

Gosh dammit. Losses matter. ::

 

but..but..but..of all those guys Pacquiao really has earn his all time status...Roy Jones had All time Great talent but his resume is poop...Floyd Mayweather look on his wayyy to it back in 130-135..but after the Castillo scared he has really turn into a bitch...

 

agREED. Good post.

 

Nope. He is AS good as Duran, but so far Duran has a slightly better resumé, and has beaten a better opponent than anyone Pacman has fought - Leonard.

 

Top 10-15 and it's not debatable.

Once history has a chance to evaluate what he's really done through 10 weight divisions, he'll probably be Top 5 or more...

 

AgREED

RJJ SHOULD have been a top ten ATG but his resume just doesn't hold up to that exacting standard of scrutiny. Mayweather started like he meant to be special but, by his own admission a week or two ago, 'legacy don't pay the bills' and he has long since stopped giving a fuck about anything but money.

Manny is making money, of course, but he is doing it by beating the BEST at their preferred weight (or at least close to it). Barerra, Morales, JMM, DLH (at 147), Hatton (at 140), Cotto (at 147ish ::)- the top of Manny's resume reads like a portion of 'whos who' for modern champions.

Of course, I agree with those who are urging caution, because as Jaws' excitable opening gambit shows, its very easy to go over the top and start spouting nonsense. But Manny is a very special guy, a top ten ATG for sure IMHO; we might not see the likes of this again for quite some time.

MTF

 

The main flaw in Noble's post is that only true nutriders have ever seriously declared any of those guys the GOAT. So that whilst I agree with the spirit of it, to my mind he's railing against a very tiny minority of oddballs and, well, Jaws...

MTF ::

 

Manny's career to this point is unprecedented. Id love to hear the names of 5 people who have a better resume.

 

What an amazing coincidence to see you resurface at this point in time...

MTF :kidcool:

 

Another good post. I especially agree with Manny not being a natural "diaperweight". It's not exactly rocket science that as Manny matured he would grow into a bigger and stronger fighter than he was as a teenager. Just because a fighter, especially a very young one, began his career at a lower weight doesn't mean that is his "natural" weight.

 

Why is that? ray:

 

First off I picked Cotto to win. I just thought that size would matter. We all saw that when Manny is in the ring nothing matters. Anyways What more does he have to do. Who else does he have to destroy. The dude is a fucking monster. He may not be GOAT be he damn sure is top 10 if not top 5! I'll Holla 5000

 

People will look back at Manny's career in 20 years and rank him alongside Robinson/Duran/Leonard.

Some of us are ahead of this dumb waiting period.

 

145 is Cotto's Weight Class???...147 was a Middle Aged Dela's Weight Class???...



REED:dunno:

 

dammit, losses matter.

And Duran lost and lost and lost to guys who were not that good. That matters. Hell, Duran always gets boosts from his cheerleaders for beating Barkley and Moore, guys who wouldn't make Pacquiao's top 10 best win list.

Duran has a single better win than any of pacq's, but he also quit in the rematch and then got shutout in the tired rubbermatch.

Pacquiao > Duran.

 

You talk a staggering amount of shite. ATG dominant reigns in an original 8 division and wins over prime Ray leonard two weights above that matter more. Pac's closing in, but he isn't there yet.

 

:cheer:

 

I have watched boxing since I was a boy in the 60's. I witnessed (on tv of course) prime Ali, Duran, Leonard, Benitez, Chavez and many others. I have NEVER seen anything like Pacquiao is doing now. This pinoy is a nature freak. he is not human. He damn sure is top ten GOAT easily, if not top five. If he beats Floyd like he beat Cotto last night, I'll crown him THE GOAT in my book!

 

You fall back to 'original 8 division' as if that means jack shit in a hail storm, then you transition to 'two weights above', conveniently ignoring the 'original 8 weights' in the same friggin' sentence and I talk shit? ::

I guess Junior Welter can be counted because it was sort of an original 9? Come on.

The only thing Pacquiao is missing compared to Duran's resume is more losses.

 

Personally I think he still has unfinished business with JMM, the only guy that has really beaten him aside from Morales. He needs to convince the people that he's better. If Pacquiao fails against Mayweather, the only option left is JMM. Otherwise I regard Marquez up there with Pacquiao. Let's not forget how he destroyed Diaz and Casamayor.

Cupey

 

I'd also watch pac-mosley, assuming the latter gets past Berto, which i wouldn't be too sure about at this point...

 

Um I said original 8, not only 8, Einstein. And I mention it because having the greatest ever reign in one of the original 8 is a far bigger achievement than the others since there far more 'ever' to beat. If you need me to explain this highly complex issue further let me know.

 

Oh Christ. Using your logic let's put this in a little better perspective. When Duran was the same age Pac is now, Duran had two losses. One to an All-time great which he had beaten earlier and another to a very good fighter which he avenged.

Pac has lost 3 times............twice by KO which he never avenged and once to a one-time All-time great in the middle of a 1W 5L streak.

It's all about the losses dammit!!! :nono:

 

I can't believe people hold his early losses against him. That was a very young, different fighter.

 

Agreed.

 

I don't hold his early losses against him. Just arguing against a particular line of logic raised in this thread.

 

Call him greatest you've ever seen then. GOAT is a completely different argument.

 

If Pac KO's PBF, then he should be in the top 10 IMO. Big IF.

 

I agree. I'd put him there even if he wins a decision over Floyd. I've got no problem with Top 10, Top 20 arguments even without fighting Floyd.

GOAT is ridiculous to even bring up however. No offense Jawsy.

You're welcome to write an article stating your case though. :bears: