*ahem* The "I NEVER Was Impressed with Mikkel Kessler" Bandwagon...

Much Ado about NATHAN...

CLEARLY, U're a FRUSTRATED Calzaghe Crotch Swinger...Even TODAY, Fans QUESTION just how GOOD Calzaghe was, DESPITE Retiring Undefeated & Kessler was YOUR Way of Keeping Calzaghe's Name in Good Standing....So @ EVERY GIVEN Opporunity, YOU were Amongst the 1st PRAISING Kessler, Speaking of how he was "Clearly" the Dominant Supermiddle, a "Great" Fighter & All that Other UNPROVEN BULLSHIT...

The TOTALITY of Calzaghe's Accomplishments is why REED Praised him Post-Kessler...10 Years Undefeated, the DESTRUCTION of Lacy (who REED Picked) & a Come-from-Behind Win Over Another Undefeated Title Holder in Kessler (who REED Picked)...@ that Point, Being Proven WRONG in Calzaghe's BIGGEST Fights to Date, REED Thought to Himself, "Maybe U've Been WRONG about Calzaghe All Along"...& In the Post Fight Comments that YOU Dug Up, that was PRECISELY the Tone of REED's Thoughts...

But Where Or WHERE Did REED EVER Say he was IMPRESSED w/Kessler???...& WHEN has REED EVER Been VAGUE or LESS than Forthright in his Boxing Opinions???...Look, if YOU were Impressed by Wins Over Mundine (Who Managed to Get KO'ed by SVENfuckingOTTKE of All People) & the HUMAN SPONGE Known as Librado Andrade, that's YOUR Business...But DON'T Tell REED that HE was Impressed...REED KNOWS what Impresses him & What Doesn't & Kessler Most Certainly DID NOT....

REED's Been Disparaging Kessler for the Past Year or More to COMBAT the UNJUSTIFIED Praise Being Heaped Upon him by the Likes of YOU, w/HIDDEN Calzaghe Related Agendas...Similar to how U Persist in PATHETICALLY Clinging to the ASSinine Notion that Ricky Hatton would've Fared Better Against Mayweather @ 140...NUTHUGGERY @ it's Fucking WORST...

So EVERY SINGLE Time U've Picked a Guy to Win a Fight, it's Because U were IMPRESSED w/Him???...Now THAT "Defies Logic"...

If this is all "Childish, Moronic, Bullshit", the WHY Did YOU Spend a LUNCH BREAK in a FAILED Effort to PROVE Something, Mr. MATURITY????...If U Find this "Childish, Moronic, Bullshit", then by All Means LEAVE the Fucking Thread Altogether...But Leave it KNOWING that REED was NEVER EVER Impressed w/Mikkel Kessler...




REED:hammert:

 

In situations like this I do what Frank Drebin says "Well, all I know is never bet on the white guy". Naked Gun 2 1/2

 

::::

 

I said all of these things MONTHS before Kessler agreed to fight Calzaghe and they were based on his dominant performances in the preceeding few years, his perfect record and the fact that he had barely lost a handful of rounds in his entire career to date. My praise for Kessler was based on ALL of these things and was echoed by a number of other credible observers, including many people here.

The fact that I like Joe Calzaghe is known by all, here and elsewhere, and has no fucking bearing on my opinion of Kessler. If anything, I should have been keen to play down Kessler prior to his fight with Joe, seeing as I am a 'Calzaghe nuthugger' with some hidden agenda.

Hidden agenda my ass ::. The world and his fucking dog knows how much I defended Calzaghe and did so BEFORE the Kessler fight.

You insist on telling anyone who'll listen that you were never impressed with Kessler, yet you picked him to beat a ten year champion coming off a career best, signature win over a much touted American fighter.

You first dismiss these FACTS as irrelevant and then, in the next fucking post, use these FACTS to justify your elevating Calzaghe to p4p No.2 (above Pacquiao) after he beat this 'unimpressive' bum.

Both of these positions are completely contrary to one another:

1. Either you took NO account of these considerations and elevated Calzaghe to No.2 p4p as a result of the Kessler fight only (your first position) which is a very odd thing to do if Kessler has never ever impressed you anyway and is thus not a very meaningful win, or

2. You took account of these considerations (your latest position) and STILL picked Kessler to beat Joe, which is strange considering that he was facing an unbeaten, ten year champion and that Kessler was completely unimpressive.

The contradictions here are beyond all logic, and no amount of twisting, spinning and other bullshit changes this simple FACT. You picked Kessler to win a MAJOR, UNIFICATION match against a guy who you elevated to p4p number 2 in the immediate aftermath of the fight but then state that you have never been impressed with him. Oh yeah, that makes a whole heap of sense... :shit:

You STILL, I see, cling to this Ricky Hatton business, some two years after the event and bring it up over and over and over again. Just let it go, for fuck's sake. Hatton lost by brutal KTFO at 147. Is it really that far beyond possibility that he would have faired better at his preferred weight? How could have faired any worse? :dunno: You would think I said he would have won at 140 the way you go on, and on and FUCKING on about it. I didn't. I said he would have faired BETTER. Better than being KTFO in a one sided contest. That is all. Let it go and move the FUCK on.

Your fixation with this is the only assinine thing here.


And let go this notion that I spent 'hours' or 'my lunch break' to argue with you. I spent five minutes replying to a post by Broadwayjoe. I usually spend my lunch break on these forums. It's how I spend a fair bit of my spare time, because I enjoy reading and replying to you crackers. You aren't that important, dude. Get over yourself.

The day you see me start a thread to call YOU, or any fucker else for that matter, out after a fight is the day you can start giving me this bullshit about 'Mr. Maturity'. Until then, take the root vegetable out of your ass, put your dummy back in and try to relax. You'll live longer.

MTF

 

Great win by Ward. Its great for the tournament too, especially after Dirrell's non-performance, it keep american interest strong.

Kessler has some great strengths, but I had niggling doubts after the Calzaghe fight, when he was outfoxed after rd 4 or so and never managed to adapt, and it was confirmed this weekend that he doesn't handle confident movement and pressure (who does though) well and shifting gears is not his forte.

Too bad Ward isn't more interesting however, he's got the personality of a bin bag.

 

So Let's Cut to the Chase...R U a Fucking MIND REEDer or Something???...R U the Fucing PRIME MINISTER or the PRESIDENT???...It's Awfully PRESUMPTUOUS to Not Only TELL a Person when they're "Impressed" Or Not, but Now U're CONTINUING w/the IMPOSSIBLE Quest of Trying to PROVE it...

For about the 30th Time, SOME but Not ALL Boxing Fans EMBRACED Calzaghe After the Lacy Fight...Others WEREN'T Convinced & STILL QUESTIONED him...It WASN'T Until AFTER the Kessler Fight, a BIG Fight Against a YOUNG, Undefeated, BIGGER Guy, that Calzaghe Began to Receive Almost UNIVERSAL Praise...Nonetheless, Even TODAY, Fans STILL QUESTION just How GOOD Calzaghe was, Do they Not???...

As Such, SPARE REED your Loooooooooong Winded BULLSHIT Because AGAIN, TO DATE, Many STILL WONDER How GOOD Calzaghe REALLY was...Nonetheless, by Beating Kessler, he'd Basically CLEANED OUT the Division for All Intents & Purposes...On that Premise, Being Fairly Objective, REED Felt there WASN'T Much More to B Asked of Calzaghe...He CLEANED OUT his Division, Thus Gaining the ACCEPTANCE of REED...

So for the LAST Time, the Acceptance of Calzaghe WASN'T about ANY SINGULAR Bout, it was the TOTALITY of his Supermiddleweight Existence...The BIG Picture...& The Eventual Acceptance of Calzaghe Said NATHAN for Mikkel Kessler, as Much as U WANT it To...Individually, VERY LITTLE of Calzaghe's Days @ 168 is Impressive, but the BULK of it Is...The TOTALITY of his Supermiddle Reign...

It WASN'T Hard Elevating Calzaghe to # 2 Lb for Lb Because if Memory Serves there WASN'T Much Going On @ the Time...Pacquaio HADN'T Moved Up to Beat Dela, Hatton & Cotto...Shit REED Isn't even Sure if he'd had the RE w/Marquez yet...& Marquez HADN'T KO'ed Casamayor or Diaz Either...There was Floyd & NOT MUCH Else, Lb for Lb Wise...Bernard Perhaps, but he was ALREADY in his 1nce a Year Fight Mode...

If Anything, Calzaghe was FORTUNATE to have Cleaned Out the Division when he did, but U Still CAN'T Hate on a Man for Cleaning Out his Division...

So Where EXACTLY Is the Boxing Fans Handbook???...& In that Book Where EXACTLY Does it State that a Fan MUST B "Impressed" w/a Fighter to PICK him to Win a Particular Fight???...EVERY Time REED Spews ANTI-Kessler Sentiments, YOU Surface w/the Failed Prediction he Made...THAT's Why REED "Called" YOU Out in this Thread, Because YOU Kept Getting Bent Out of Shape Whenever REED DIDN'T Share your UNjustified LUST for Kessler....

All that Prediction "Proved" is that REED Got that Particular Fight WRONG, No More, No Less...But According to YOUR Wisdom & "Logic", we're ALL BOUND to a Fighter that we Predicted to Win a Fight???...Got It:shit:...

Bottom Line, There's NO Contradictions or Spinning Here & it All Makes PERFECT Sense...REED has Explained in in DETAIL for what Amounts to the 273rd Time Now...SPARE REED your PsychoBABBLE & AMATUERISH Attempts @ REEDing Minds, Palms &/or Twisting Words for YOUR Purpose...

This ISN'T a Bible Verse...REED's Words AREN'T Open to B Interpreted Any Way YOU Wish...REED's Words R CLEAR & there's Very Little if Any Wiggle Room for MISinterpretation...REED has NEVER EVER Been Impressed w/Mikkel Kessler, REED has NEVER EVER SAID he was Impressed w/Mikkel Kessler & Unless U Provide CONCRETE EVIDENCE of him Doing so, Take a Deeeeeeeeeeeeep Breath, SHUTthefuckUP & Let it GO...



REED:hammert:

 

As the Super Six tournament has demonstrated already.

Except it hasn't.

 

I agree with all that's said about Calzaghe here. The Kessler fight went a long way toward raising Joe's profile.

The question looms as to how good he was...in fact, I'd say it's pretty much universally believed that Joe was fortunate to catch Hopkins and Jones when he did. Most wouldn't give Joe any realistic chance of beating either guy in their prime.

 

I don't think Hopkins was that far removed from his prime when he fought Calzaghe.

 

Hopkins is smarter now, but the guy that beat Trinidad is far better than the version we see now.

The Tarver and Pavlik fights were perfectly made for him...guys who stand in front of him and don't move around.

Hopkins has problems with speed, but Calzaghe was more of a slapper than anything. The first round knockdown showed me that with a little more handspeed, Joe would have walked into the same punch at some point.

Hopkins' reflexes didn't allow him to get off that shot as the fight wore on...even in that respect...some thought he won that night.

 

Agreed on Jones, less clear on Hopkins. That wasn't the best Calzaghe either, although at 36 he hadn't lost as much as Nard.

 

Well, that approach would tend to lead to a short, boring, predictable and simplistic thread, wouldn't it?

Who would bother to even click on it if your holier-than-thou hogwash became the expected norm?

:notallthere:

 

Well said! Carry on then!

Can we get 15 pages or is that asking too much?

 

MTF.. why are you so frustrated man? just cuz your hero Kessler got whupped? get his nuts out your mouth man

 

Kessler got beaten like a drunken bum on the street and the nuthuggers (Euros) are coming up with excuses::

 

Nah he ´s frustrated, because Ward took the shining light of Calzaghe´s career-defining win. You have to understand these brits think Calzaghe is the best european fighter of all time and top 20 p4p all-time. And now all it takes is a Carl Froch win over Kessler next and Calzaghe won´t even be the best british super-middleweight of all-time. :atu:

 

I always considered Kessler the best at 18 and I think he remain's Calzague's best win of his carreer.

Because Ward beat him with easy I won't pretend he wasn't as good.

People forget the potential Ward had even though his PRO carreer took a while to develop.

The guys hasn't lost a fight since he was 12 years old. He was a great amateur, Gold medal Olympian and now an undefeated wolrd champion.

I say he is right on track to fullfill his potential.

 

calzaghe was very good, but roy jones jr wouldve put a hurting on him if they had fought in the 90s. I have to question the knowledge of anyone who says otherwise

 

Shiitt... even Calz himself admitted he wouldnt beat a prime Jones.

 

I've just been reading, not writing. I only piped up then because you were inadvertantly promoting empty forums.

 

when did he say this? Not saying your lying. Is just that Joe comes off very arrogant alot of the times that is hard to inmagine him saying shit like that.

 

I dont think Joe would have beaten Roy at his blazing best, but to suggest that a tough, skillful, versatile, accurate, workhorse boxer like Calzaghe woulda got EXPOSED and shut out like a white European in the aftermath of this Ward fight, is just sheer hyperactive indulgence that shows a sinister element present around here.:crafty:

 

I think he said it before or after his fight vs. Jones....

 

maybe he was playing around. Because he always blamed Frank WArren for not getting him a prime Roy or prime Hopkins. He never came off as scared and always seemed like he wanted to fight them in their prime.

 

Apparently he says it in his book, which was written before the Jones fight materialised

 

It's fairly obvious what was up with Kessler last night. He hasn't fought since the Calzaghe fight and was obviously rusty. And please don't bring up that tomato can he fought a while back. That guy gave him absolutely nothing and you could even see in that fight that Kess wasn't very sharp.


Kessler needs to put in some serious gym work to get his skills back up to a world class level. As he stands now I'd easily pick Abraham and anyone else in the tournament other than JT to beat him. It wasn't just his offense that was off but his reaction to punches as well.

I predicted this might be the case before the Ward fight but I didn't make a pick because I didn't know enough about Ward. I even kept asking about Ward's chin but nobody seemed to know exactly where it stood.

 

He has fought Sartison for the title since, and defended against Haussler and Perdomo. He hasn't fought much but you're a bit wrong there.

In relation to Kessler's place on Calzaghe's resume, some fighters are lucky when it comes to hindsight. When Tszyu unified the titles and beat Judah, he was majorly acclaimed, but now posters donwplay the achievement based on Judah turning out to be a perennial fuck-up and Mitchell being dominated by Mayweather, Williams et al. All you can say was that it looked good at the time. Similarly, when RJ beat Hopkins in the early nineties, no one at the time would have thought he'd have a top 5 all-time middleweight on his resume; it worked out pretty well for him. Kessler was a monster going into the Calzaghe fight, and Joe outboxed him, the achievement shouldn't be shat upon just because he turned out to be a little less than we thought.

 

You make a good point there. However you have to take into account the fact that Kessler didn't look remotely like the fighter who blew out Andrade or even who fought with Calzaghe. Normally his punches look fluid and sharp but last night they just looked sloppy. Also his reaction to incoming punches was just amateurish.

Many will try to say that that was Wards doing but I disagree. Your opponent can make you look bad to a point but he shouldn't really affect your technique or sharpness. So 1 of 2 things is wrong with Kessler. He's either rusty or he's lost a step. I used to think it was rust but you pointing out him having those 2 other fights prior to the Perdomo fight (in which he also looked like crap) makes me think he's slipped. Badly.

So my thinking is Kessler was as good as we thought he was. He just isn't anymore.

 

Hardly

Calzaghe isn't even the best British fighter of all time, let alone the best European of all time. He's not even in the top two: behind CLEARLY both Lennox Lewis and Jimmy Wilde.

Again, anyone who has actually read my previous posts in this regard would know this well enough...

MTF :shit:

 

It is funny though that, were Froch to get past Kessler, arguably his best wins would have surpassed Calzaghe's in a fraction of the time