What are Floyd and Shanes keys to success?

if, If, IF Marg was "Better" it was MARGingally...MUCH Like Baldomir, Marg was a Face 1st Brawler w/Little to NO Defense...NO, they're NOT Built Exactly Alike, but Guys Like Marg, Baldomir & Even Librado Andrade Can ALL B Lumped Together...

Marg has INVITED Reasonable Doubt into EVERY FACET of his Career, so REED is LEERY of Calling him "Better" than Anybody...

Last But Not Least, REED ISN'T Upset...YOU'RE the Guy that's Been Pissy from Thread to Thread on Various Fightbeat Forums...REED is the Guy that DOESN'T Give a Shit WHY U Feel that Way...



REED:mj:

 

C'mon man, Margirito is a better fighter than Baldomir and it's not even open to discussion. Now way Baldomir beats Cotto, Clottey & Cintron. His best wins are over an unfocused Judah and a shot Gatti, ffs.

 

Margarito has WILLINGLY Thrown ALL of those Wins into QUESTION By Virture of his Own Actions...Shit, Allow Baldomir the LUXURY of Loading his Handwraps & HOW Do U Know he WOULDN'T Beat Cotto, Clottey & Cintron???...

Baldomir Already HAS a Win Over Clottey, if REED's Not Mistaken...



REED:hammert:

 

So he does! News to me....:doh::: In fairness it was 7 years before Clottey became any kind of factor at world level.

 

Margarito is better...way better than Baldomir.

 

Exactly. Floyd would simply "Corrales" Margarito, minus the multiple knockdowns.

Floyd would have been given no credit for that victory by his h(anz)aters either.

 

Owned!! :atu:

 

I know exactly where you are coming from. But don't let it upset you.

From a MARKETING stand point, how else can you SELL a Mayweather? Reality is he is a defensive wizard, not a KO artist, a technician, a safety first, win at all costs, doesn't give a fuck about boos and action for the fans, does all the SPINNING AFTER the fight. Promises blood, sweat and tears, drama and all out war and comes in dragging the fight to a screeching halt.

But he is an all around exceptional fighter, he can do it all when he finds it appropriate to show it. Against danger, he folds into his cocoon and stay untouchable because of his speed. Not fan friendly at all.

So he makes it up by picking and choosing very carefully his opponents. A loud mouth to promote his fights and his undefeated record. He is doing his thing. Talking big but avoiding fights with riskier opponents.

You could see how that has affected overall opinion about him. I personally don't care if I ever see him fight again. What's good for Mayweather, is not what's good for fans of the sport, with the exception of about 18% of die hard fans.

 

I give margarito credit for beating Cotto and Cintron, loaded gloves or not. But Margarito is still a face first pressure fighter in the mold of Baldomir and so Floyd would have had little difficulty with him. The point is Baldomir (and Judah) was a more meanigful fight for Floyd at the time.

Margarito was completely IRRELEVANT. Floyd didn't "duck" him. An Antonio Maragarito fight simply wasn't necessary. Judah then Baldy then De La Hoya was a reasonable string of opponents considering the time.

Let me remind those who seem to have problems with their memory (this is why..*sigh* the Sly one is sometimes forced to return briefly):

Judah was the last undisputed Welterweight champion, after stopping Spinks who beat Mayorga who twice beat Forrest (including a stoppage) who DOMINATED Mosley.

Judah was then upset by Baldomir...but most people thought it was just because he didn't prepare properly and underestimated the tough Argentinian. Judah was still considered TEH MAN in that division at the time.

As such...since judah still had an alphabet title...Floyd elected to fight what was generally considered to be the TOUGHER fight...and took on the dangerous and incredibly quick Zab Judah (who he had hoped to fight before the upset).

After beating Judah the media and fans claimed that Floyd is just a paper champion at Welterweight because the REAL champion is still Baldomir....so what does Floyd do? He fights the REAL Champion and dominates him like a sparring session.

Still not enough for the haters..as they now claim that "Baldy" is crap (haha) so Floyd elects to challenge himself at a weight he was naturally too small for...154lbs and fights none other than Oscar De La Hoya..who proved in his last fight that he still had alot left (dominated and stopped mayorga with absolute ease...something Mosley would STRUGGLE to do years later)..and beat him.

Where does...no....where THE FUCK does Margarito fit into that picture? Floyd didn't duck shit!

i don't wanna hear any more abou tthis logic from anyone on this site unless they can give a tangible argument to justify their position.

you can't play around and get away with bullshit at the moment..the Sly one is here to keep you honest! :kidcool:

 

Without loaded gloves, I don't think Plasterito beats any of those three.

Without the cement in his gloves, Plasterito looked like a fucking bum against Mosley. His punches looked pathetic too.

 

You have a point there, Mex but I think there were a number of factors as to why he looked so sh*tty against Mosley.

 

Do realize, this post gives credibility to everyone who said Floyd ducked Margarito.

 

Well he did. Whether it was because of Arum or whatever but he wanted no parts of that guy.

 

exactly. Fraud ducked Margarito! He wanted no part of the guy.

 

I realise we'll all have to see how Margarito does without the brass knucks,.. but Badlomir is an attrocious scrub,.. I think not long after Forrest shut him out, he lost to some bonafide club-fighter,.. now Margarito might not have the enhanced power he used to have,.. but I could never, ever, see him losing to anybody at such a low level despite it.

 

Yeah, it's almost insulting to compare that flash in the pan with someone who was the longest reigning title holder at welter last decade. If Zab Judah had two cojones, would anyone care about Baldomir?

 

Such as?

Let me say one thing first of all. Mosley fought brilliantly. Best I've seen him look in years, and I was so happy to see it, because I love Mosley.

But without wanting to take anything away from Mosley's win, Plasterito looked fucking awful, I mean literally like a borderline bum.

Part of it must have been Shane making him look like a bum, the way Nard did to Pavlik, but part of it was just Plasterito fighting like shit.

If you know other factors - do tell - but to me the two crucial factors were...

1) - He didn't have cement in his gloves, and his punches looked like they had nothing on them.

2) - Getting caught and fighting without the loaded gloves that he was (probably) used to must have affected his confidence, and increased Shane's confidence, and would no doubt make Plasterito a little "preoccupied" to say the least, having been busted that very night.

So let's assume that factor #2 was probably particular to the Mosley fight, factor one isn't.

And we'll see now, but I can't see him being half as effective as he was.

As for Baldomir, well... surely he is still better than Baldomir, cemented gloves or not ::

 

Indeed Kenneth, he was a scrub, who was at the right place at the right time. Cheers to this uneasy alliance as of late, just because I have perverted desires to drug and consume the flesh of good looking black men, doesn't mean we can't agree on a messageboard on a range of things. :bears:

 

FLOYD DUCKED MARGARITO!!!!! STOP WITH THE F*CKING BULLSH*T ALREADY! He's a coward and a pussy! He retired like a bitch for 2+ years and avoided real challengers. He's a farce!

 

1. Margarito is waaaaaaaaayyyyyyy better than Carlos Bumdomir.

2. Clottey vs. Bumdomir didn't Bumdomir win that fight by DQ, and wasn't he losing the fight at the time of the stoppage...?

3. Mayweather ducked Margarito...no other way around it. Sure Mayweather groupies can say he fought Bumdomir for the same $$$ and DLH for Mega Millions, but that doesn't change that he ducked/avoided fighting Margarito along with Williams, Clottey, Cotto, Mosley, Cintron, etc..etc...

 

::

 

Kauki, how much do you fancy Kenneth compared to Jermain?

 

One, he killed himself to make weight and didn't train as hard. Really got fat off the Cotto win. Plus, he wasn't motivated - remember he really didn't want the fight; the money was low and Mosley wasn't very highly regarded. Margarito took that fight on a couple months notice and the word floating out of his training camp was that he didn't appear to be the same. Countless wars, coupled with the brutal one against Cotto certainly didn't help either. Neither did Mosley.

 

Yes, who could forget Goossen's expoooosed wise-crack about 8 million and 'one' dollars to help out Fraud's distressed rep in the lime-light, quite an amusing little memory you spawned there Vida.

 

He fougth DLH and Hatton the easiest fights were out of the way...now he had to take on the real challengers...guys like Margarito, Cotto, Williams, etc...

Sure Floyd and DLH was talking about REMATCHING before he retired but both new the rematch would not be as successful as the original..can't play people twice.

 

It's an eery possession, I don't know how the 'presumed' ghost of Jeffrey Dahmer wriggled into the course of our debates but it has caused some mental instability, so I feel obligated to let Kenneth know that it's not my fault, and it's just a fluctuating interference from the underworld.

 

There was a lot of people saying after Cotto vs. Margarito that Cotto would never be the same. I was one of the people saying that Margarito might be worst for wear of the two, he took brutal punishment for the first 6-7 rounds. And every punch from Cotto was to the head, he was turning all his body into left hooks, and uppercuts credit to Margarito chin that he was able to walk through 'em. Margarito punishment of Cotto was all over the place body and head, late in the last few rounds he concentrated on the head.

ONE of the main reasons Margarito got destroyed by Mosley was because he did not have his the plaster in his wraps. In the Cotto fight you saw just tap Cotto with punches and hurt him, he wasn't putting much behind the punches. Against Mosley, Margarito was loading up with his punches and missing badly which cause him to get tired.

No Plaster+Missing w/ his shots+Mosley body punching+Mosley swimming w/out getting wet= Margarito getting destroyed..

 

maybe "etc..." was a viable foe. is he an arum fighter too?

 

Mosley wasn't highly regarded?

Well I know Plasterito was favoured to beat Shane, but surely Shane was still considered the 3rd best welterweight at that point? At 147, only Cotto had beaten him since Vernon.

He looked motivated enough against Cintron in the rematch too, and there's no way Cintron was as highly regarded as Shane, by anyone, plus Marge had already beaten him.

It seems hard to believe that he would be unmotivated against a fighter as good as Mosley, basically the joint best fighter of Plasterito's career alongside Cotto.

 

Yep, I totally agree.