How hard can Floyd punch?

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Tito was a big welter, no doubt. He looked like a legit 5'11 at least, and wasn't exactly scrawny.

But I don't know if he struggled to make weight or not.

 

Yeah, Tito was 5'11. Same size as Oscar.

 

And my point is that there is more than one way to get "dropped". Some guys take a knee when gassed or hurt, other guys walk freshly into single shots that put them on their ass.

 

Oscar was shorter and noticeably slimmer in the thighs.

Trinidad was the naturally larger man.

Compare Oscars and Titos progress at 154 and 160.....only one of them looked like he was pushing the boundary too much. In the run up to Quartey-DLH, Oscar declared that his body-type would allow him to fight as high as 175. Well...he got to 154 and looked like dogshit there.

Joppy was a competent middleweight and he referred to Trinidad as "fat", believing that Trinidad was gorging himself into 160.

Of course, Trinidad towered over Joppy too and had a noticeable power/strength advantage.

 

Pea wasn't gassed or seriously hurt most of the time when he was dropped, neither was Tito for that matter. But yes, I'm aware that there are several ways of getting dropped.

 

Oscar started at 130 so yes, Tito was the naturally larger man. But Oscar couldn't have been shorter by that much. He looks as tall as Tito is and is listed at 5'11. And looks it in person.

 

Kenneth, have you seen Oscar in person? You think he looks 5'11?

I didn't think so. I thought Tito was 5'11, and Oscar an inch shorter at 5'10.

And in his fights with Floyd and Manny, he looks more 5'10 than 5'11 IMO.

 

Oscar I think is 5'10.5" listed height, which means he is 5-10, for all intents and purposes.

He was always shorter than Trinidad, he was always slimmer in the legs and fleshier in the arms.

 

Stilettos and the right nylons can make anyone look tall.:nono:

 

Huh? He's listed at 5'10 and a half which is 5'10? Who taught you to round off? And you mean to tell me he's a half inch shorter than Tito? WOW!

 

Not when you wear them bent over, hands against a wall.

 

Fighters are almost always an inch shorter than their listing, unless they really are tall, like Tall Paul.

For example, people say that Mosley isn't 5'9, and more like 5'8, and Musze seems to think Floyd is 5'7, not 5'8, Pacquiao is more like 5'5 than 5'6 etc etc.

But sometimes they are legit, Chris Eubank for example, is a legit 5'10. And I think Tito is one of the few that matches his listed height.

I think the general rule of thumb is anything over 5'10 is usually not exaggerated because we're no longer in short territory, any 5'9 listing or less is generally exaggerated, to seem less small.

 

Then Oscar would fall in that rule. Oscar is one of those few guys who looks Tito's height but even if he was shorter, the difference is negligible.

 

didn't Floyd once KO a horse?

 

No, that was Roger. All the best fighters come from the midwest, except Duran, who is the best Latin fighter of all time. Naturally.:notallthere:

 

Duran was a Phillipino you fucking Armenian!,..:doh:

 

:laughing:

MTF

 

I have pics with Mosley and Mayweather...I'm 5'9" and Floyd is easily two inches shorter than I am. Shane's a little shorter as well, but definitely taller than Floyd.

For what it's worth, Roy Jones is listed at 5'11"...he's legitmately that height...I'd say he, Oscar and Trinidad are all the same height.

I've never seen Oscar in person, but I've got a pic with Trinidad...in my estimation he's the height he's listed.

 

I'll take 5'10 for Oscar, but no more than that :kidcool:

In all the photos I've seen of them together, Trinidad looks at least an inch taller. In their fight too, Tito looked an inch taller.

 

Agreed.

 

What? No Gavin Rees?

 

Quartey? not a chance, and Duran isn't a given.

 

The Duran of the Palimino, and 1st Leonard fight rapes Floyd! No ifs, ands, or buts.

As for Quartey... Floyd has a chance there, but Ike's jab would cause BIG problems for Floyd.

And Floyd will beat the current Mosley at 147, but I have a hard time seeing him beat the 2000 Shane at 147.

From 130-140, theres only a handful of guys in history who beat Floyd. But at 147 the numbers increase.

 

Exactly X! Fraudweather would die against all of them! The f*cker BARELY got through a totally shot part-time promoter in Oscar for f*ck sakes who was so past his prime, it wasn't even funny.
F*ck Fraudweather and his sh*tty overhyped record.

 

If anyone is a given on that list it's Duran.

In fact, the two that I would have no doubt about at all are prime Duran and Leonard. Those 2 Floyd stands no chance.

And I agree with Xplosive, at 130/135, there's certainly less fighters that would beat Floyd, but Floyd hasn't exactly set the world on fire since moving to welterweight 5 years ago. His biggest win is a split decision over aging, part timer Oscar.

The only two on the list that I would confidently pick Floyd over with no hesitation would be Quartey and Trinidad.

 

Bullshit.

It was that same type of reasoning why a majority of people thought that Duran would "rape" Hearns before they fought.

You know the logic..

Duran outslugged Leonard...Leonard outslugged Hearns...therefore Duran outslugs Hearns.

Well we all know that Hearns in fact outslugged Duran (all of those fights were won because the loser couldn't handle the aggression of the winner...boxing ability was secondary).

Floyd would not have fought Duran the way Leonard fought him in that first fight. Floyd would have outboxed Duran cleanly. (Don't forget XPLOSIVE that it is well documented on here that you pick based upon who you like more....don't let me remind you that you picked Lacy to RAPE Calzaghe).

 

Floyd stands no chance against Duran. Duran was exactly the type of fighter to beat Floyd. Aggressive, quick, unpredictable, but intelligent with great defense. Floyd would stand a better chance against Robinson than Duran.

Hearns beat Duran with power, and for whatever reason Duran looked like he didn't even want to be there.

I also suggest you rewatch Duran - Leonard 1. Duran didn't outslug Leonard, he controlled the fight. Even when they were in the center of the ring at mid range, Duran was getting the better of it.

 

"Outslug" is a very simplistic term for what transpired...i agree. It wasn't a Gatti-Ward kinda mindless slugfest.

What I meant was...Duran won on agression more than boxing.

Also...

As I've said before people tend to put waaaaay too much stock on the first Castillo fight with Floyd where it "appeared" that he struggled.

Firstly.....

If you turn off the commentary and ignore Harold Lederman's stupid scorecard you would realize that Floyd won the first 5 rounds of that fight and teh two point deduction rounds (which lederman both gave to castillo) went to him as well. Floyd also won the 11th. Floyd won the fight PERIOD.

Secondly...

Floyd was INJURED in that fight. Not just based upon what he said after the fight...but also during the fight you heard Roger in the corner talking about his shoulder, rubbing it and then you often saw Floyd UNCHARACTERISTICALLY switching to southpaw. He was obviously only doing that to protect his left shoulder. You also saw Floyd stand and trade with Castillo late in the fight...because his boxing ability was impaired due to not being able to comfortably jab.

All in all...people please don't assume that Floyd has trouble with tough wild intellgent brawlers just because of his performance in a fight where he was injured but won anyway.

 

I was a Floyd fan at the time and I had it a draw.

As far the point about X's posts blinding him due to favoritism...by FAR the most guilty person in this thread is you, Sly.

As much as I detest Floyd, I can be reasonably objective about the guy.

 

Funny you say that, I happened to watch the Floyd - Castillo 1 fight the other day, with the sound down, because I was talking to my girlfriend at the same time.

Floyd won the first 2 rounds clearly. 3 and 4 were close. Castillo won the middle rounds clear as day. Castillo was the aggressor, Castillo landed far more shots, Castillo was the champion, and Castillo won the championship rounds.

At the time I thought Castillo won, but I didn't think it was a flat out robbery. On second viewing, I thought Castillo was flat out robbed. He won that fight clear. The most you could possibly give Floyd is 6 rounds, and that's being very generous, VERY generous. Castillo landed literally 3 times as many power shots, was the champ, and was the aggressor.

But you know, I don't put too much stock in it. I'm not basing it on Castillo. Afterall Floyd did win the rematch (though it WAS still close). Just like I wouldn't base the matchup around Duran - DeJesus 1, where Duran looked pretty crap, and clearly underestimated Esteban. Obviously the rematch and rubber match were very different.

The thing is, Duran has the style to beat Floyd. He wouldn't let Floyd get into his pot shotting rhythm, he would be on Floyd's arse every round. And where as aggressive fighters like Hatton have absolutely shit defense and run into punches, Duran had the best defense in history for an aggressive fighter. He could come forward throwing, and simultaneously slip punches (something Pacman has been doing recently too, only not quite as well).

And also, Floyd could outmuscle people like Hatton on the inside. Floyd has underrated strength, and is a pretty good infighter. Duran was one of the best infighters in history. He was quick, clever and powerful on the inside. Floyd isn't going to be pot shotting Duran, Duran is far too aggressive and unpredictable for that, and he isn't going to be outfighting Duran on the inside either.

And have a look at prime welterweight Duran to see just how good his defense was, say against Palomino and Leonard. His head movement and reactions were blazing fast, he would slip whole flurries by Leonard, punch by punch. He also had underrated handspeed, he almost matched a peak Leonard for handspeed. Especially his right hand, it would launch at high velocity, and come out of nowhere.

As you can probably tell Sly from some of my recent posts about Floyd - despite my intense dislike for Floyd, I am objective with him. I know he is a great fighter, and would beat a lot of great fighters in history. He wouldn't beat Duran though, not only is Duran arguably the best fighter of all time, but he has the style to beat Floyd.

Even more so than Pacquiao IMO. Duran and Pacquiao certainly have similarities, but Duran was much better inside, and had better defense. Pacman is a bit like a faster, southpaw Duran, but with not as good defense and much worse infighting.

I wouldn't be surprised in the least if Floyd decisioned Pacquiao, but I seriously couldn't see him beating a prime, motivated Duran.