Fightbeat top 20 p4p of all time.

Oh and Ray was only 30 when he came back. Floyd is 32 now and you still want him to fight teh whole world plus superman. If Ray could come back and fight fading Hearns and Duran who were contemporaries to the fighters that I listed..and you not crticsize him for that...you're being hypocritical.

 

Dude, Benitez was shot when he was 25. Tyson was half the fighter he was by the time he was 24 odd. Hopkins & Archie Moore were 95% the man they were at 40. Ray was badly declined by the late 80s. Floyd isn't. Some put their left leg out and they shake it all about.

Bottom line, when your career is finished you get judged on what you got done & what you proved. If Floyd had been declined when he came back against Marquez it wouldn't have invalidated what he'd done earlier, luckily for him he hadn't in any noticeable way so he has a couple more years to try and catch up to what greater fighters have done.

 

If they're looked back upon as equivalent challenges in their resumes then it says everything about the quality of their resumes. Corrales was a fantastic win, but it's more equivalent to Curry beating McCrory than Leonard beating Hearns.

 

Lets NOT....Leonard fought Benitez, Duran, Hearns and Hagler...

Mayweather fought Corrales, Castillo, De La Hoya and Hatton...::::


it's not even close...

Leonard retired because of eye problems..I THINK..

Mayweather retired because he would eventually have to fight someone dangerous...either Cotto, Margarito, Mosley, Williams....

and when the time came for him to fight his DURAN/HEARNS/HAGLER/BENITEZ he started asking for special drug testing....

 

Lets not turn this into another discussion all just about Floyd's choices of opponent please, guys. It happens too easily.

 

BroadwayJoe, Meetthefeebles and REEDS lists are apparently imminent. Especially curious to see REEDs perspectives on these things, could go any which way.

 

Yes LETS NOT...

 

:atu::laughing:

Either you're trying to drive me out of my mind deliberately by pretending to not follow the point....THAT YOU STARTED..which I'm addressing...which is that Corrales and Hearns are equivalent from the point of view of the best and most dangerous challenge in their weight class at the time (you're sayin that Leonard took the challenges and Floyd ducked them)...or simply put you're a FUCKWIT! :notallthere:

 

Wat

 

No, I don't think you're getting mine. You have to prove greatness, one way or another and a win over Diego Corrales isn't enough. Beating Hearns, Duran & Benitez proved Ray's greatness unequivocally. Beating Corrales is very good start (like Curry beating McCrory was), but it's only a good start, whether he's the best fight out there at that moment or not. It doesn't demonstrate greatness on that level.

And hopefully without dragging us down the Floyd rabbit hole I'll mention: there were also Freitas & Casamoyer at 130 at the time who were regarded as big challenges. Dominating both of them woulda gone a LONG way. Then there was Tszyu a little later, woulda been a huge, HUGE fight for Floyd, never got made. Instead he falls to his knees crying after beating Arturo Gatti and moves up to 147 and we know what's happened then (though to his credit it looks like he's manning up now). The degree of greatness Floyd has PROVEN versus the guys most others have above him just doesn't warrant him being as high as you place him.

But I'll grant you - the Corrales win was FANTASTIC. Wins like are the bricks great fighters are made of. Most of what's happened after the two Castillo fights isn't quite though.

 

ok...I know you don't want to go off the topic and so I'll respond to this in another thread. I'll just say this:

Floyd called out Tszyu..but floyd was HBO and Tszyu was showtime. Then Tszyu lost to Hatton and the rest is history.

It's easy to say that Floyd didn't fight certain fighters but once you dig a little deeper you find out more information and then realize that some things were out of his control. Gatti was the available 140lb titlist to him at that time and that's why he fought him.

Statistics are like a bikini: what is revealed is suggestive but what is concealed is vital.

Ask yourself this:

Why woudl a man who fought Corrales when he was undefeated, fought Castillo in his first fight at lightweight and would later move up to 154lb to fight De la Hoya...deliberately "duck" Tszyu and Margarito?

 

I don't think Mayweather is a ducker. Never have. I just think he's reluctant to make the effort to make the significant fights happen because he already thinks he's the greatest ever and thinks anyone who doesn't agree is a 'hater' or 'doesn't know the game'. A combination of a bad attitude and bad luck has meant he hasn't achieved nearly enough to be ranked as high as you have him, IMHO. But then there's no problem with my criteria and your criteria for the rankings being different. You've a good eye for fighters and if you're convinced Floyd ranks as high as you have him without him proving it, I respect that, though obviously I don't agree.

 

Floyd called out Tszyu? When?

Floyd knew Corrales. He had fought him in the amateurs. He knew how strong he was (or wasn't).

Floyd saw Castillo's fights with Stevie Johnston.

The reason you duck Tszyu or Margarito is because they are much stronger physically than the first two and a different type of challenge. Similar to Castillo, but different in that they are both bigger.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEHF5HX6Jb0


De La Hoya at 154lbs was UNDOUBTEDLY a more dangerous and imposing challenge than either Tszyu or Margarine....

 

Cummon guys, we all know each other opinions on Floyd.....lets not get on this train.

 

Yeah...I'm still waiting to hear the reasoning for the list that had Floyd Patterson.

 

Ok, Ok...

1. Ray Robinson
2. Roberto Duran
3. Ray Leonard
4. Muhammad Ali
5. Willie Pep
6. Sandy Saddler
7. Pernell Whitaker
8. Carlos Monzon
9. Eder Jofre
10. Ezzard Charles
11. Julio Cesar Chavez
12. Alexis Arguello
13. Michael Spinks
14. Marvin Hagler
15. Archie Mooore
16. Jose Napoles
17. Evander Holyfield
18. Bernard Hopkins
19. Roy Jones Jr.
20. Thomas Hearns

Every time I try one of these lists, I find myself changing them over and over 'cause I am sure I am missing someone who belongs. There are plenty of great fighters are on the bubble and by tomorrow I may have changed my mind about some on the list.

 

Not a bad list actually. not bad at all...

 

Wow. That means...well...not a lot...but thanks.
::

 

Thanks. That's not really calling out, though.

dlh prime might be more imposing than tsyzu or margarito, although I'd still disagree. At the time floyd finally fought him, it wouldn't compare to prime tszyu or margarito, imo.

 

::

I thought you'd appreciate a compliment from me....not. ::

Seriously though..good list.

 

Unprompted: "I would love to fight Kostya Tszyu"

Sounds like a callout to me.

We'd have to disagree regarding The De La Hoya at 154lbs that Floyd fought vs Tszyu or Margarito.

I, for one, as a Floyd fan was nervous about him going up to 154 and fighting Oscar. i wouldn't have been nervous at all if he fought Tszyu or Margarito. But that's me. Oscar's combination of size, power, speed, chin and skills was better than either Tszyu or Margarito..even at that stage of his career.

 

Shit. I forgot Spinks.

 

Quite a handsome list if I do say so.

 

Yeah, but then you wouldn't have room for Winky Wright. :laughing:

 

Finally somebody giving Cory his proper respectartie:

 

He might as well have said, "I want to fight the best!"

I think of call outs as being what Witter did to Hatton or what Edison Miranda does; not the ordinary, "sure, I'd love to fight xx". Something with a little more substance.

call out
1. To cause to assemble; summon: call out the guard.
2. To challenge to a duel.

 

I am no good at this but here goes, no particular order:

Henry Armstrong
Ezzard Charles
Rocky Marciano
Sugar Ray Robinson
Sugar Ray Leonard
Jimmy Wilde
Thomas Hearns
Oscar De La Hoya
Joe Calzaghe
Evander Holyfield
Bob Fitzsimmons
Roy Jones Junior
Muhammad Ali
George Foreman
Ricardo Lopez
Julio Cesar Chavez
Roberto Duran
Manny Pac
Shane Mosley
Willie Pep

 

The topic called for best fighters since 1940, so some of your choices don't belong.

 

i dont think floyd ducked anyone.(save margarito and pacquiao to a degree) however...

corrales was a debatable top 5 lb 4 lb fighter at the time (maybe) and was a big puncher but obviously (even then) a limited boxer.

hearns was the undisputed pound for pound best in 1981.

your point stands though of both of the guys fought the best available challenge at the time. but corrales was no hearns. especially not a circa 1981 hearns.