The Jones vs. The Super-Six thread got me thinking on this one...who are they? Cruiser: Evander Holyfield (U.S.A.) Won the title in the space of a dozen fights, & in a gruelling war with a very capable fighter, no less. Set the tone for a brilliant Cruiserweight career, cut short by HW ambitions. Exhibited knowledge beyond his years at the weight, & erased any doubts as to his supremacy at 190lbs. in crushing Qawi in the return. Super-Middle: Roy Jones (U.S.A.) Instincts, power, athleticisism...& my, what speed. Such swiftness, his every movement reminded you of a 147lber. Didn't neglect his skill-set, as many fast fighters do, as well. The division's all-time #1, IMO. Jr. Middle: Mike McCallum (Jamaica) Unlike Holyfield & Jones, McCallum only edges into the top spot for mine, ahead of his chief rival, Hearns. The best & most consistent bodypuncher of his time, & everyone feared him for it. I think he topples every other 154lber there's ever been, Hearns inclusive. Jr. Welter: Niccolino Locche (Argentina) This is a surprisingly steep division, despite a stuttered existence. Locche is deserving of high praise to snare the top spot, but he is not out of place at the top of the 140lb. tree. Beat all but one man he faced at the weight, including Antonio Cervantes. Reigned for nearly five years. Jr. Light: Sandy Saddler (U.S.A.) Brutal & rangy, with the best inside game of any big man you can name. Some contend he would have always beaten the legendary Willie Pep, with his savage fouling & precision-punch offense. Able to maul or slug-&-slam at mid-range, & tough enough to eat nails & ask for seconds. Saddler is the best 130lber of all-time. I'd be getting a little sketchy below 130lbs, so I will yield the floor to some of the lighter classes to another.
plenty of great fighters at jr. fly such as chung koo chang, carbajal, myung woo yuh, chiquita gonzalez, and yoko gushiken. jr. bantam had galaxy, watanabe, too sharp, and tapia. super bantam had wilfredo gomez, barrera, morales...
in my opinion... strawweight - finito lopez jr fly - chiquita gonzalez super fly - khaosai galaxy super bantam - wilfredo gomez
Calzaghe is the greaest supermiddle ever. RJJ is the best fighter to have fought there, unquestionably so, and I still think he was at his absolute best there, but he didn't stay there anywhere near long enough to establish himself as 'the greatest' at the weight IMHO. MTF
No question, on achievement, Calzaghe deserves the top spot. In this case, I was simply going for my top man, head-to-head, per weightclass. Under your criteria, you'll get no argument from me.
Roy's best win at the weight is better than anything Joe did, however. Calzaghe's reign at 168 was such a disgrace. I have a hard time callin him the greatest anything. He was what was wrong with the sport for so long.
Holy was the best ever at Cruiser, but I think people have forgotten, or didn't know because they were not fans then, how really poor the opposition was at that time...including the other title belt holders of that time. The Pre-Holyfield Cruiserweight division made the Pre-Tyson heavyweight division look like the best division ever. Jones was clearly better than Calzaghe, but his opposition was nothing special outside of Toney and he didn't stay long enough. That being said, Calzaghe gets points for the duration of his reign, but the quality of his opposition was low. McCallum won all of his fights at 154, but his opposition overall was OK at best. The myth-makers like to spin this tale of poor, poor McCallum being a modern day Charley Burley, but that is inaccurate. He was a very good fighter, but I would take both Hearns AND Leonard over him at 154. Locche was a great boxer, but I don't know that he gets past Pryor, Mayweather or Whitaker at 140. Saddler was great, but there are quite a few other greats at that weight as well...Arguello, Chavez, Mayweather & Nelson would all be very demanding challenges for him at that weight.
Actually I would say that Jones DID neglect the fundamentals to some degree in that he relied on his speed and athleticism, doing stuff like eschewing the jab. As a result, when he started to go downhill, the hill got really steep, REALLY fast. Now that I think about it, he didn't look that great in sparring with David Izon leading up to the Ruiz fight, but Ruiz didn't have the speed to catch him. He should have retired with that fight, but instead elected to move down to Lightheavy. Having to quickly lose all that newly-gained muscle probably didn't help him either. He didn't work on his skillset like Bernard did, so Roy wound up without a Plan B and started getting stretched.
Holyfield 6-0 at cruiser title fights...one is an SD Nelson 13-1-2 w an SD and an MD JC Gomez 11-0 al cole 6-0 Not so sure Gomez isn't the greatest.
Can you imagine the kind of pressure Evander would have put on Roy if you could have gotten prime Cruiser Evander against prime Roy (say, around the time Roy fought Mike McCallum)? That would have been one hell of a firefight.
Calzaghe is clearly the GREATEST 168-pounder that ever fought in that division, with Roy being the BEST. Also, his reign is no worse than Hopkins' string of defences at 160.
It's true that Hopkins' Middleweight reign is glossed over a bit. Most of the competition was decidedly lacking, & played a not-insignificant part in his eclipsing Carlos Monzon's record --- & by some way, to boot. It'll be a long time before someone knocks Hopkins off in this regard.
Holyfield was such a dominant cruiser that it was like he invented the division. Very little attention was given to those heavyweight wannabes before Evander came along with all the hype. He has to be at the top of this list just because he made fans take notice of the division. Likewise Mike McCallum locked down 154 and made much more popular fighters run in other directions. His top rival at the time was Hearns and even Manny admitted not wanting any part of McCallum. And I have to put Calzaghe at 3. As Feebles said, he owned a buck sixty eight like no one in history. Like McCallum, the fact that he was never beaten at a particular weight makes it pure speculation as to whom might have been better.
:shit::shit::shit: The Contrarian BULLSHIT Artist Strikes Again!!!!:shit::shit: REED COULD STOP @ Dwight Muhammad Qawi, a Guy that was Better than ANYBODY Gomez Faced @ Crusier, but he'll Delve Deeeeeeeeeeeper.... Holyfield Beat the Aforementioned Qawi a 2nd Time, Henry Tillman (Back when that MEANT Something), Ocasio AND Carlos Deleon, the ORIGINAL Crusierweight Champion... Loooooong Story Short, Gomez IS NOT the Greatest...Holyfield SHITS on him... F.Y.I., that "SD" was Against Qawi, in Holyfield's 12th Pro Fight...That's Akin to David Reid's Fight w/Trinidad, Only Reid Ends Up WINNING, as Opposed to Getting his Ass Kicked for the last 6 Rounds AND, Holyfield's Win was a 15 Round Bout.... REED
As a relative non-puncher, it's a shame Holyfield's endurance at Cruiser failed to follow him at Heavyweight. You have to wonder how some of those bouts might've turned out if Holyfield had the same petrol tank. Bowe I & III, Moorer I, even the second fight with Lewis, at an advanced age, came down partly to Holyfield running out of juice at the back-end.
And remember, aside from Qawi 1, Holyfield steamrolled the competition. The other two champions, while questionable perhaps, were on a different planet from Holyfield in terms of talent. But make no mistake, Ricky Parkey and Carlos Deleon were legitimate and worthy Champions. Holyfield made them look mediocre in retrospect.
