Chose this division for its great familiarity with everyone. I was thinking of a Lightweight or Light-Heavyweight version, for the great depth of those divisions, but thought this would attract more interest in the end. I'll keep the combatants relatively few, to make the whole thing manageable. I'll post the results in a response to this thread after I'm done writing this, so feel free to add your own results & how you think the League would go, what sort of interest it would attract in the real world, the betting odds, who would be crowd favourites, & anything else you can think of! Here're the principles... 1. All fights scheduled for twelve-rounds, sans the Final, which is over fifteen. 2. Combatants are awarded no points for a defeat, one point for a draw, & two for every victory. No additional points apply for beating your man inside the distance. 3. At the end of the League, the Finals will begin, the cut-off for which is the top-four. 4. Bouts are on a Home-&-Away basis, with all fights taking place in one or another combatants' hometown. 5. Three-knockdown rule is in effect for all bouts. Entrants: Larry Holmes Record: 69-6-0 (44 KO's) Hometown: Easton, USA Alias: "The Easton Assassin" Record vs. Other Entrants: 1-1-0 (1 KO) Betting Odds: 3-1 George Foreman Record: 76-5-0 (68 KO's) Hometown: Houston, USA Alias: "Big George" Record vs. Other Entrants: 2-1-0 (2 KO's) Betting Odds: 4-1 Joe Frazier Record: 32-4-1 (27 KO's) Hometown: Philadelphia, USA Alias: "Smokin' Joe" Record vs. Other Entrants: 1-4-0 (0 KO's) Betting Odds: 9-1 Muhammad Ali Record: 56-5-0 (37 KO's) Hometown: Louisville, USA Alias: "The Greatest" Record vs. Other Entrants: 5-2-0 (4 KO's) Betting Odds: 2-1 Jack Dempsey Record: 62-6-9 (51 KO's) Hometown: Manassa, USA Alias: "The Manassa Mauler" Record vs. Other Entrants: 0-0-0 (9 KO's) Betting Odds: 8-1 Joe Louis Record: 66-3-0 (52 KO's) Hometown: Detroit, USA Alias: "The Brown Bomber" Record vs. Other Entrants: 0-0-0 (0 KO's) Betting Odds: 2-1 Sonny Liston Record: 50-4-0 (39 KO's) Hometown: St. Louis, USA Alias: "The Night Train" Record vs. Other Entrants: 0-2-0 (0 KO's) Betting Odds: 6-1 Mike Tyson Record: 50-6-0 (44 KO's) Hometown: New York City, USA Alias: "Iron Mike" Record vs. Other Entrants: 1-0-0 (1 KO) Betting Odds: 7-1
Someone is vastly overrating Louis and underrating Tyson. Where is Lennox Lewis ? You got Sonny Liston and no Lewis??
Fixtures & Results: Round 1: Holmes TKO12 Foreman Ali UD12 Frazier Dempsey TKO2 Louis Tyson KO4 Liston Round 2: Holmes MD12 Frazier Ali UD12 Foreman Tyson TKO4 Dempsey Liston TKO6 Louis Round 3: Dempsey KO6 Holmes Tyson TKO4 Frazier Ali SD12 Louis Foreman KO4 Liston Round 4: Louis TKO11 Holmes Liston TKO5 Frazier Ali UD12 Dempsey Foreman KO2 Tyson Round 5: Louis TKO9 Tyson Liston KO5 Dempsey Holmes UD12 Ali Foreman TKO4 Frazier Round 6: Tyson TKO3 Holmes Foreman KO3 Dempsey Ali UD12 Liston Louis TKO4 Frazier Round 7: Ali TKO12 Tyson Liston KO4 Holmes Dempsey TKO4 Frazier Foreman KO4 Louis Round 8: Foreman TKO3 Holmes Frazier MD12 Ali Louis KO8 Dempsey Liston KO5 Tyson Round 9: Frazier UD12 Holmes Foreman KO2 Ali Dempsey KO6 Tyson Louis KO10 Liston Round 10: Holmes SD12 Dempsey Frazier TKO12 Tyson Louis UD12 Ali Liston KO4 Foreman Round 11: Holmes UD12 Louis Liston TKO4 Frazier Ali UD12 Dempsey Foreman TKO3 Tyson Round 12: Louis KO7 Tyson Dempsey KO6 Liston Ali D12 Holmes Foreman TKO3 Frazier Round 13: Holmes UD12 Tyson Foreman TKO4 Dempsey Ali UD12 Liston Louis SD12 Frazier Round 14: Ali UD12 Tyson Holmes TKO10 Liston Frazier SD12 Dempsey Louis KO3 Foreman Season-Proper Table: 1. George Foreman (10-4-0, 20 Pts.) 2. Muhammad Ali (9-4-1, 19 Pts.) 3. Joe Louis (9-5-0, 18 Pts.) 4. Larry Holmes (7-6-1, 15 Pts.) 5. Sonny Liston (7-7-0, 14 Pts.) 6. Jack Dempsey (6-8-0, 12 Pts.) 7. Joe Frazier (4-10-0, 8 Pts.) 8. Mike Tyson (4-10-0, 8 Pts.) Finals Series: George Foreman (1st) vs. Muhammad Ali (2nd) Joe Louis (3rd) vs. Larry Holmes (4th) Preliminary Finals: Ali UD12 Foreman Crowd: 28,963 Scorecards: 115-112 (Ali), 115-112 (Ali), 116-111 (Ali) Particulars: Ali cut over left eye in 3rd. Foreman down once in 10th. Louis KO12 Holmes Crowd: 25,201 Scorecards: 107-102 (Holmes), 106-103 (Holmes), 106-103 (Holmes) Particulars: Louis down once in 2nd. Holmes down twice in 12th. Ali advances to Final. Holmes eliminated. Grand Final Qualifer: Louis TKO4 Foreman Crowd: 33,478 Scorecards: 29-29 (Even), 29-28 (Foreman), 29-29 (Even) Particulars: Louis down once & cut in 1st. Foreman down once in 1st, & three times in 4th. Grand Final: Louis TKO11 Ali Crowd: 48,879 Scorecards: 95-94 (Ali), 95-95 (Even), 95-94 (Ali) Particulars: Louis cut under right eye in 4th. Ali down once in 2nd, twice in 11th.
To clarify, this isn't necessarily the best eight of all-time. I am just selecting eight of the best. This isn't to say this League comprises my personal top-eight. By, "over-rating" Tyson, I assume you mean the odds I posted. Again, though, that's more an indication of betting markets being ruled by all sorts of sensical & non-sensical decision on the part of punters, not necessarily representative of my view, as such.
To eliminate bias, I tried to be, "spur-of-the-moment" with the results, just going on what I thought might or could happen (not necessarily picking the favourite in every fight, according to me), to keep who would finish where spontaneous. I didn't want to have a final table which mimicked where I thought these guys place all-time --- that would have been too predictable. Keeping it loose that way, I was never sure who would make the cut until I finished writing it, & tabulated their records.
This is a good thread...but its too much work for me to partcipate. I'll just say that Ali wins. :hammert:
Double agreed. I don't see him even winning a fight in this lineup, let alone leaving behind a path of destruction.
If you asked me to pick a winner between, say, Dempsey & Louis (to name one of the criticisms here), my pick would not be, "Dempsey TKO2 Louis." What I was attempting to convey with this (& some of) the other results was that this is a realistic league in the so-called, "Theater Of The Unexpected," & results can surprise. Do I think Dempsey could catch Louis very early with an electric ribshot-&-hook combination, & use his expert finishing skills to set Louis down a path to perdition very rapidly & unexpectedly? Sure, I do! Fights between all-time legends, things can happen like that --- everybody's that good, anything can happen. I picked Louis to win their other fight, to recognise the fact I would personally favour Louis to beat Dempsey, best-on-best. However, as each man faces one another twice, I thought it would be far, far too predictable for me to simply pick the fighter I favour both times. I like Tyson to stop Frazier early, for instance, maybe four or five times out of six, but you will notice they split their results in the league. Not everyone is at their best every time out, things happen & preparations are not perfect. This league is more indicative of a real-world Tournament than a Mythical Match-up scenario, where two men are at their absolute peak, & you invariably pick your favourite. I hope that helps to clarify somewhat. If I just picked the favoured fighter each time out, Dempsey & Frazier probably wouldn't have won more than one, two, or three fights. Because they're such great fighters, though, I wanted them to win at least one from two against men whose chances I thought would be at least reasonable. As for Dempsey, "leaving behind a path of destruction," he lost more fights than he won, didn't claim a double over a single opponent, & failed to make the Finals.
