Is drying out & piling weight back on worth it?

So obviously the two best fighters in the sport don't really cut & rehydrate much weight (Floyd moves 3 or 4 lb, now, post 'retirement' comeback). And throughout their careers both Hopkins or Roy Jones stayed pretty close to fighting weight, too. Meanwhile among the guys renowned for big weight jumps between weigh in and fight time very few have really been upper echelon fighters. Sergio Martinez might be alone in it.

So basically the question - is this a case of 'well he's Floyd/Roy, he can do whatever he pleases and still succeed in spite of it'? Or is there something to be said for just fighting at weight without putting your body through those scale swings?

 

Pacquiao and Floyd are pretty much the exceptions, but there is something in it sure.

Hopkins is another guy that was just lucky to be able to stay near fighting weight. And that's a good thing.

Think about it, Nard is a fucking BIG middleweight, but between fights probably only strayed to what, 175 max?

He cut less weight than a lot of smaller fighters, yet was big for his weight.

Everyone has a minimum weight they can get down to without losing too much water or muscle.

Manny and Floyd and Hopkins just happen to stay very close to that weight.

More fighters probably should. Put on less, lose less.

If I became a pro fighter, I couldn't imaging losing all that weight then pumping myself full of creatine etc, I'd want to stay pretty close to fighting weight.

Hardcore weight cutting can have it's advantages though. If you're tall anyway and have a big frame, you're going to be extra huge for your weight class if you can boil yourself down to whatever weight, even if you're slightly drained doing it.

Such as the likes of Caballero.

 

You're a Duran fan right?

 

Obviously too big and blind a one to get the connection here.....:dunno:

 

I dunno maybe I'm too tired today to understand what you're syaing but didn't Duran blow up between fights and still be an upper echelon fighter?

 

Duran fought in the days of same day weigh ins. I doubt he came in much heavier than contracted weight in his prime.

 

Sorry, aye, I mainly mean the practice of drying out weight rapidly just to make scale weight then bloating back up in the next 36 hours. Like a guy like Castillo who is 150lb in fighting shape but sweated out (or pissed out) 15lb in the couple of days before the weigh in then gained it all back again. Aka the standard practice in world class boxing since day before weigh ins, to lesser or greater extents.

But aye I agree, Duran did his longevity no favours with his crazy party lifestyle between fights.

EDIT - I've changed the thread title, Sly, you're right it didn't really make it clear what I meant. I should probably start reading my threads before I post them, actually....:scared:

 

How much does Donaire get up to?

I swear this dude looks gigantic next to every bantam he fights. He looks bigger than Pac to be honest, in both height and frame.

 

Yes, it is worth it which is why everyone does it.

 

yes but Hopkins had to train every day and live on an orange a day....that's no better :nono:

 

That's what Im inclined to think, but when the very, very best don't and remain the very very best....it raises doubts.

 

True, but i think there's limits to it. If a fighter has to absolutely kill themself to make weight a lot of their training is going towards shedding pounds and not boxing itself.

 

In mY ideal world, you would get weighed in no more than 10 minutes before you stepped into the ring, cage, or mat. I hate weight cutting and I hate the advantage that it gives people because of the ridiculous amount of time that fighters are given to put weight back on.

However, I don't hate it in the same way that I hate steroids/PED's. Cutting weight is not cheating; cutting weight is taking advantage of stupid rules that permit it.

 

I think same day weigh-ins is good enough.

It would be nice if they went back to it but of course they never will.

 

Fighters regularly run the risk of lasting damage to their bodies, so in a broader sense, is it worth it? That's more open-ended than it may appear --- a life without Boxing usually means a penniless one for most Boxers, or even one without their freedom. There is more on offer than simply putting clothes on their back, too. Elite Boxers aren't jeopardising their long-term health for a job on par, financially, with a Middle Management gig, the riches are enormous for the select few.

Obviously, most fighters don't truly weigh up what the dangers are & just get on with the business of what they're doing, but if they really educated themselves as to what they were doing? My guess is they would all still be doing it.

 

I agree with this 100%! i'll Holla 5000

 

Luck had nothing to do with Hops' weight, the guy is one of the most disciplined athletes of all time. I recall hearing before his move to light heavy that he hadn't eaten a cookie in 15 years.

Anyway, I agree with mikE..

 

It's worth it when you're young.

 

In a world where nobody dried out, Floyd and Pac would be even more dominant than they already are. I don't think either fighter gets enough credit for the fact that they are basically 1970s welterweights fighting modern welterweights. Well, I guess Pac does, since his fans (when it suits them) will portray him as a flyweight fighting welters. But Floyd doesn't.

 

I'm not saying you are right or wrong. I'm not sure. But if all of their competitors were coming in at their natural weights, I think that Floyd and Pac would be up against different challenges. Weight cutters vs non-weight cutters is a lot like rock, paper, scissors, I think. Most weight cutters are rocks and most non-weight cutters are scissors so the weight cutters win. Floyd and Pacq are like paper and do well against the rocks. Not sure they'd have the same success against a bunch of scissors.

(yeah, that was a little forced)

 

I just think it's simply a case of being in shape in the proper weight class. It's no coincidence that guys who are in the right weight class and have not struggled to make weight tend to gain the least amount of weight after the weigh-in.

Look at James Toney before he fought Roy; he gained 18 pounds! The night of the fight, he hardly broke a sweat because his body was feeling the effects of the rapid weight gain. As we now know, James should have been out of the super middleweight class, even before he fought Roy!

 

Not really sure I agree with the analogy.. regardless of everything else, if weight cutting stopped tomorrow, Floyd and Pac would still be welters and they would be fighting guys who are currently junior lightweights and lightweights. Very few, if any of those guys would be able to compete worth a damn.

edit: I do get what you're saying, though

 

I think MikE's point may apply more to Pac than Floyd. Pac really seems to thrive on the added foot speed advantage as much as the usual comparative advantage of size and strength. He's pretty unique in that as far as i see though.

 

It may give you a size advantage but being slightly drained can be much worse. The problem with cutting and using creatine is consistency. You are messing with your health so you are bound to have good days, and not so good, jittery days. For a professional fighter consistency is very important and so is your health. I'd say it's not worth it at all.

 

I imagine Arturo Gatti would feel it's worth it. It's how he ended Joey Gamache's career.

 

Didnt help him against anyone good.

 

I don't think that's accurate. He probably wouldn't have been as successful if he had fought guys closer to his regular weight. He probably would have had a career more comparable to his brother, Lightning Joe Gatti.

In Joe's most memorable fight, he lasted less than a round against---wait for it---Terry Norris.