Does beating a guy FIRST make it a better win?

Discussion in 'General Boxing Discussion' started by Hut*Hut, Mar 15, 2012.

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  1. Slice N Dice

    Slice N Dice Big stiff idiot

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    I'm at work so I can't finish this right now. BUT THIS IS NOT OVER.
     
    Slice N Dice, Mar 16, 2012
    #61
  2. steve_dave

    steve_dave Hard As Fuck

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    <iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/qbqNiysMcqY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
     
    steve_dave, Mar 16, 2012
    #62
  3. loadedgloves

    loadedgloves "Twinkle Toes" McJack

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    lol@flashdance fitness video
     
    loadedgloves, Mar 16, 2012
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  4. Slice N Dice

    Slice N Dice Big stiff idiot

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    I'll give you that one. I laughed :lol:
     
    Slice N Dice, Mar 16, 2012
    #64
  5. Hut*Hut

    Hut*Hut The Mackintosh of temazepam

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    If Slice's taste in boxers was a building it'd be a Polish brutalist tower block. Grotesquely functional.
     
    Hut*Hut, Mar 16, 2012
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  6. steve_dave

    steve_dave Hard As Fuck

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    :lol:
     
    steve_dave, Mar 16, 2012
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  7. Slice N Dice

    Slice N Dice Big stiff idiot

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    So be it. I'm a fan of winners. However they win. :bears:

    If I were a boxer, I'd rather be an efficient winner than a loser who does everything "the right way". Lets not pretend that Joe was just a guy who ran hills, threw alot of slaps and that was it. That wouldn't get you anywhere. The guy could fight. He had skills, and the ability to adapt mid fight, work things out, and get the job done. That's boxing. Viva Calzaghe.

    :Thumbs:
     
    Slice N Dice, Mar 16, 2012
    #67
  8. mexican wedding shirt

    mexican wedding shirt The Greatest of Are Times

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    I'm no Slappy Joe fan, but he was a skilled fighter no question. He thought about what he was doing too, and could adapt well.

    He's just not very likeable and throws lots of slaps.
     
    mexican wedding shirt, Mar 16, 2012
    #68
  9. Free Ike

    Free Ike WBC Silver Diamond Emeritus Champ

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    jOE'S KAYO percentage was near 70%. He is very underrated. He looked ugly when he fought like Vitali does. He was still a good fighter.
     
    Free Ike, Mar 16, 2012
    #69
  10. Double L

    Double L Book Reader

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    not in general. and by that, i don't mean, not usually. i just mean, there's plenty of examples in which a win over a fighter that pre-dates someone else's win may not be better.

    one example is Manny Pacquiao. the win over him at fly-weight cannot be considered better than a win over him currently.
     
    Double L, Mar 16, 2012
    #70
  11. Anthony

    Anthony Admin Staff Member

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    Just like a win over a 13 year old cant be considered better than a win over him when he is 30.
     
    Anthony, Mar 16, 2012
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  12. Double L

    Double L Book Reader

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    yep.
     
    Double L, Mar 16, 2012
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  13. steve_dave

    steve_dave Hard As Fuck

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    Or a win over him when he's eleventeen and a win over him when he's a toaster.
     
    steve_dave, Mar 16, 2012
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  14. Double L

    Double L Book Reader

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    How about when everything's said that needs said, there's only mindless dribble left to say?
     
    Double L, Mar 16, 2012
    #74
  15. steve_dave

    steve_dave Hard As Fuck

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    What are you, a fork?
     
    steve_dave, Mar 16, 2012
    #75
  16. Double L

    Double L Book Reader

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    :lol:
     
    Double L, Mar 16, 2012
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  17. Anthony

    Anthony Admin Staff Member

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    Hotdogs and sour apples on Friday
     
    Anthony, Mar 16, 2012
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  18. cdogg187

    cdogg187 GLADYS

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    Take your passion.... and maaaake it happen:hammert:
     
    cdogg187, Mar 16, 2012
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  19. cdogg187

    cdogg187 GLADYS

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    Fuck Calzaghe

    Bob Foster knocks his head off... The one-way head flight would depart Cardiff and touchdown violently somewhere near Hut's neighborhood up in Glasgow
     
    cdogg187, Mar 16, 2012
    #79
  20. cdogg187

    cdogg187 GLADYS

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    "Is this motherfucker tryin' to slap me?"
    -- Foster, contemplating the Jennifer Beals-trained Welsh guido before him, prior to decapitating him
     
    cdogg187, Mar 16, 2012
    #80
  21. Slice N Dice

    Slice N Dice Big stiff idiot

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    Foster is irrelevant in this discussion.

    My point stands. Ward knew before he got in the ring with Kessler that his opponent had had questions asked of him previously that he wasn't able to answer. No matter what anyone says, that will provide just a smidge of confidence. Calzaghe didn't have that luxury, it was unknown. Of course this is just an example, and there are plenty of cases where this doesn't apply, but this is something that should be taken into account.
     
    Slice N Dice, Mar 16, 2012
    #81
  22. cdogg187

    cdogg187 GLADYS

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    Calzaghe was a Lt. Heavy on fight night... that means he gets to take a dip in that pool "myth-wise" with all of the fighters of a great division pre-day-before-weigh-ins
     
    cdogg187, Mar 17, 2012
    #82
  23. cdogg187

    cdogg187 GLADYS

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    Ward did exactly the same things he always does
     
    cdogg187, Mar 17, 2012
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  24. Jake

    Jake WBC Silver Diamond Emeritus Champ

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    I honestly couldn't disagree more. Cotto was a monumental step up in class at the time for Paulie, whose resume was paper thin. All he proved in that fight was that he was capable of taking a beating.

    He was far more improved (and proven) by the time he got to Hatton, doing proven against a better class of opposition. Whether or not he ultimately fought the wrong fight (and I admit, he was 100% correct in kicking McGirt to the curb afterward) doesn't really help your argument - in fact, the insistence that he fought the wrong fight only supports the claim that he was a better fighter at the time than the one who showed up.

    I will say that I'd never pick any version of Paulie to beat any version of Cotto. But Paulie stood a much better chance of beating Hatton at the time of their fight ('08) than he did in '06.
     
    Jake, Mar 17, 2012
    #84
  25. Slice N Dice

    Slice N Dice Big stiff idiot

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    Yeah but I never said anything regarding his standing at light-heavyweight.
     
    Slice N Dice, Mar 17, 2012
    #85
  26. Slice N Dice

    Slice N Dice Big stiff idiot

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    Yes but my point stands that knowing the guy you're facing has lost previously, and recently, will instill a bit more confidence in your ability to complete the task. Like it or not there IS something of an aura over an unbeaten, elite fighter. It's obvious that there would be more trepidation when attempting to do something which hasn't been done before, whether it's boxing or otherwise.
     
    Slice N Dice, Mar 17, 2012
    #86
  27. LOK

    LOK I'll eat your asshole alive

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    At times this is true, good example you bring up. When Floyd beat Hatton, Hatton was 40-0 and super confident that's different then when PAC beat him
     
    LOK, Mar 17, 2012
    #87
  28. steve_dave

    steve_dave Hard As Fuck

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    Same result for Ward if Kessler is undefeated though.
     
    steve_dave, Mar 17, 2012
    #88
  29. Slice N Dice

    Slice N Dice Big stiff idiot

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    Forgetting the Calzaghe-Ward comparison for the time being...

    I've heard you say before that Antonio Tarver KO 2 Roy Jones Jr is the best win of the last 20 years, which I agree with. But why is that? Why not Glen Johnsons win? His win was more dominant, with a more brutal knockout, and was only one fight later.
     
    Slice N Dice, Mar 17, 2012
    #89
  30. Irish

    Irish Yuge, Beautiful

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    Fuck Ward and his fans.
     
    Irish, Mar 17, 2012
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