How Would You Rate Mayweather, H2H, at Each Weight?

Disagreed so much. Cotto would have put Marquez in a body bag

 

About the only thing Cotto does better than Marquez is take shots. He's bigger and stronger.

I don't see him stopping Marquez.

 

I think Pacquiao would disagree about who took a better punch between those two.

 

H2H i favor Cotto pretty clearly over Marquez but i don't think it would be a demolition job.

 

Marquez resume outside of Pac (and he only 1 managed 1 win) is solid but far from overwhelming. His best wins are probably Salido, Gainer, Medina and Diaz. I cannot give him a lot of credit for the Barrera nor Cassamayor win since I felt he would have lost them had those two been fresher. Then add the couple of ugly losses to Bradley and Norwood (and Chris John if you want to be spiteful, though a lot of people swear the decision was legit). Great fighter undoubtedly, top 50 of all time, in a sport with an history as deep as boxing, is fucking insane though.

Btw, Pac isn't much greater than Matquez because he was a much better fighter than him (nor was he much better than Morales). Pac is on another level than those two because he was able to stay dominant in over 8 divisions, and sometimes, against much bigger and younger fighters. Off the top of my mind, the only other fighter in boxing history who came close (in term of jump in weight) to doing something similar was Henry Armstrong. Marquez, in the other hand, is basically Tarver +1 (and to be perfectly honest, his ko of RJ ranks above Marquez signature win imo)

 

@this ignorant frog discounting marquez's victory over Barrera yet mentioning Bradley marquez

 

Yet he was the favorite and his best ever win, by a enormous margin, came less than a year prior to it. But hey, another sad little trolling attempt is basically par for the course for you

 

Well it seems fightbeat's ''dream'' matchup is about to come off :)

Source: Marquez, Cotto set June exhibition bout

 

only a hypocritical dunce references a fight 20 years into a guys career, at age 40, in attempt to diminish his accomplishments. and in the same post knocks down a victory over a hall of famer who wasnt "fresh".

 

I wonder why this sad little troll is able to spew racial slurs continuously with no consequences...

 

If people are suggesting that Cotto beats JMM at 147-154, I can get on board with that, but I don't see how Cotto is better than JMM in a P4P sense. I think JMM is a far better fighter, and I really like and rate Cotto.

MTF

 

I don't think Marquez belonged in the ring with any full-fledged welters. He could successfully compete with Pac because they were closer in natural size, but he wasn't as well-suited to overwhelm bigger men the way Pac was.

 

Absolutely. He moved up to chase big money fights and Pac. He is a naturally small man - her only started to look more comfortable at the higher weights when he started eating all his vegetables and protein near the end of his career.

MTF

 

I don't think Marquez ever really belonged above 130. He looked poor in almost all of his outings at 135+. I think a lot of people gloss over how long JMM fought at featherweight for. He was eleven years into his career for the first Pacquiao fight - where I've seen him called inexperienced - and fifteen years into his career for the second fight.

 

funny how someone made the claim that marquez w0uld have lost to "fresher" versions of barrera and casamayor so those victories are discounted. as if barrera, morales and hamed wanted any part of marquez at featherweight.

 

Hamed ducked him shamelessly. The others ducked him fairly openly.

MTF

 

I wouldn't go so far as to say he "looked poor" - he obviously sacrificed some of his speed and reflexes, but in exchange he seemed to be hitting harder than at any previous stage of his career.

I also thought his 3rd fight with Pac was possibly the best pure boxing clinic of his career - and one of the worst robberies in recent memory.

 

I don't mind the racist insults as I''m far beyond getting rilled up by some random loser behind a keyboard. What I do mind though is how the mods (and in fact, basically everyone here) have been tolerating this shit for years while they were continuously on Mustards's or Irish ass whenever they toed the line (and ar least these guys were a bit witty/funny and not going around calling other posters coons or biggers ditectly). And please, I don't want to hear the ''we did'nt see it'' line cause we all know it's bullshit

 

Poor is a bit of an exaggeration, but I think it's pretty clear that he was worsened at 135+. His added experience seemed to make up for it, like Hopkins' at light-heavy, but I think he was clearly a level below what he was at 126 & 130.

And while I agree that Pac-JMM III is as good a boxing performance Marquez ever gave, I don't think it's a horrible robbery at all. Some very respectable scorers I know had it for Pacquiao. @roughdiamond for one.

 

I know it's cool and all to hate on Hamed but
IIRC, HBO stated that Hamed made an offer to JMM who declined it. Sure it was probably short notice but kind of put a dent in the claim Hamed was worse than the others

 

That's not how I remember it at all. You got a source to that?

MTF

 

I think it was on the telecast for the Augie Sanchez fight

 

its some bullshit. marquez was the wbo mandatory for 2 years and hamed refused to fight him.

that is where the shameless public ducking took place.

 

BBC SPORT | Boxing | Little men to the rescue

Marquez continues to astound at age 37 - The Ring

Marquez has earned his keep

MTF

 

Classic Matchup: Marquez vs. Hamed

Prince Naseem Hamed deserves HOF election

All say it the way I recall it. For completeness, I did find the HBO broadcast claiming Hamed hadn't ducked him:

Know who I think is more credible, here, though.

MTF

 

Well to be honest, it s not like if you are objective when it comes to Hamed (and this is coming from someone who dies not rate him that much). So if course you are going to take the version that suits your agenda

 

What agenda do I have? I loved Hamed growing up. He's one of the reasons I got into boxing.

But when one source (the one paying Hamed) says one thing and about six others (who don't) say the opposite, it doesn't take a leap of faith to imagine which is the more reliable source.

The fact that I was instantly able to show that your proposition was a minority view and that you swallowed the HBO Koolaid seems to have got your knickers all twisted.

MTF

 

Well in this case, the only source that really matters is the one that his fronting the $$$ (HBO in this case). No way Merchant and HBO would go on air with this if it wasn't true. As such, I don't see how anyone honest can claim Hamed ducked JMM shamelessly when he offered him his highest purse ever (at the time). But I know it doesn't suits your agenda so I suppose it's easier to pretend, without any proof, it isn't true.

To be perfectly clear, do I believe the offer was completely fair? Of course not, but JMM has an history of over evaluating his worth (think of the fiasco in Indonesia) and he should have jumped on it (though in hindsight, he managed to have a great career, a bit like Hopkins who's longevity helped us forget his ''early'' career mismanagement ).

 

They threw him a pisstake offer which they knew he would turn down. Marquez was his mandatory for 22 months and that was the best bone they threw his way. When he wasn't dumb enough to take it, Hamed vacated.

I don't have to tell you how obvious it is what happened there. It's one of the oldest ducking trucks in the book.

MTF