Rank these three lunatics in terms of potential

Rank these three psychos in terms of the potential they had if they didn't blow it:

Ibeabuchi
Ayala Jr
Valero

Ike seemed to be a lot better than the other two, and was more proven, so maybe its just a question of Ayala vs Valero.

 

My personal opinion.. I think Ayala was more talented than Valero, but would have fared worse because he had a much deeper pool to try to swim in.

 

The age of when they fucked up has to be taken into consideration as well. Wasn't Ayala really young when he fucked up?

 

Yup. He was 20. He was scheduled to fight Davey Moore.

We'll never know how that fight would have gone down, but Ayala would have gone in as a solid favorite. The general feeling at that time was that Ayala was gonna destroy Moore.

If he did beat Moore, he would have been the youngest junior middleweight champion in history, and that record would still stand today.

 

Valero was gonna fight Bradley - I'm surprised that so many people forget this. Valero would have gone in as the favorite, but knowing what we know now, Bradley would have kicked his ass.

 

Yeah,.ike is the clear number one. Id rate ayala and Valero as 2 and 3

 

I actually think Ayala was extremely talented, but he was in deep shit with the likes of Duran, Hearns, and Hagler around him.

The 20 year old Ayala would do very well today.

I think he would beat the fuck outta Jermell Charlo in all honesty.

 

Ike only had on division. Even if it was weakish it's harder to cherry-pick. If he didn't fuck up outside the ring he'd probably pull an Oliver McCall inside it. Valero would have more talent to contend with but would also have a lot more options. Hard to call.

 

Ike would have smashed Grant. That much is certain.

The better question is Ike vs Vitali.

 

Ike would get to Wlad but probably gets picked apart by Vitali. Valero would crush some guys who stand better than him historically but he'd run into his own version of Hamed-Barrera then go downhill.

 

he was gonna fight bradley? he was at 130.

 

ayala was actually hurt pretty badly in one of his early wins. i'm not so sure he goes as far many think. he was a guy whose every fight would be hard .

 

Wrong. He was at 135. He had just beaten DeMarco.

Top Rank's plan was for him to move up to 140 to fight Bradley, with the ultimate goal of making Pac vs Valero.

If I remember correctly, Valero vs Bradley actually had an official date and all.

 

Ike FOUGHT Better Opposition Unquestionably, but REED Thinks Tony Ayala Jr May Have Had More POTENTIAL Via a CLEARER Path to a Title...

Believe it or Not, Roberto Duran Never DESTROYS Davey Moore June of '83 if Ayala Jr Doesn't RAPE a Woman Early '83...Ayala Jr Last Fought (In his PRIME) November '82 and was Arrested Early '83...

Moore Had a GIMME Already Scheduled for Early '83, Fully Intending on Defending His WBA Title Against Ayala Jr Next...Instead, Ayala Jr's Arrested, Moore Wipes His Ass w/the GIMME, Then Loses to Duran 5 Months Later...

Ayala Jr was FAVORED to Not Just Beat, but KO Davey Moore..

REED

 

Mario Maldonado is the guy you're referring to. Dropped Ayala and badly hurt him, but to Ayala's credit, he responded well and proceeded to destroy Maldonado after he recovered.

It was Ayala's 9th fight, and he was 18. Canelo was nearly KO'd by Cotto's brother at 18.

 

I vaguely remember some talk about Pac-Valero but obviously it was a longer term plan. Don't recall it being Bradley but it makes sense thinking back. I believe Valero claimed he was the one who bashed Oscar in sparring before the fight with Manny but i don't put much stock into stories about sparring.

 

I think he would have KO'd Moore.

Davey was just too hittable.

 

Anyways,

Ayala
Ike
Valero




REED

 

How come nobody in his camp advised him not to rape?

 

Ayala threw beautiful combinations. There now seems to be a misconception that he was just a left hooker, but he was extremely offensively talented.

 

Here it is! I knew I wasn't losing my mind. The date wasn't official official, but I see no reason why it wouldn't have happened.

Valero vs. Bradley on June 5th? ⋆ Boxing News 24

 

Ayala was the most talented. Ibeabuchi was good. He’d have beaten Grant and Golata, but not Lewis.

 

I wonder how Ike vs Tyson goes in 2000.

Ike probably wins, but 2000 was the last year that Tyson was an elite heavyweight. He still had very good speed in 2000. Nothing like the 80s, but he still had the fastest hands in the division. It would have been a good test for Ike.

 

Its unfortunate that mike fought so few top guys in the 2000s. Really hard to gauge how good, or bad, he was

 

I don't think he'd win, because by 2000 he was a 4 round fighter. But I think he'd be dangerous for Ike those first four rounds.

 

I think Tyson looked really good vs Golota. Sure, he was a far cry from rhe 20 something terror he used to be but still very very competent. Wasted these last few years with long layoffs and gimme fights. Looked like crap a year later vs Nielsen though and completely shot vs Lewis

 

Mike had a three fight period - Francis, Saverese, Golota - where he showed some vintage Tyson flashes. But yes, as you said, the Golota fight was it. He got old and fat after that fight.

 

TBH, I think Ike beats the fuck out of any version of Tyson he could've fought. He gets lit up by a post prison Tyson, but from the night he fought Tua until 2000, I think he beats any Tyson, and it isn't pretty in the late rounds.

 

Thru Matchmaking, REED had the Pleasure of Developing a Bit of a Relationship w/Tony Ayala Sr...Sweet, Fun Loving Ol' Dude...Wore a Depend Undergarment By That Stage of his Life and Would TELL People He Did...

REED Didn't Have the Balls to EVER Bring Up Tony Jr., But Sr. Occasionally Would...Never Argued His Son's Innocence, Showed Remorse for "All the Women He Hurt", and Swore on EVERYTHING Tony Jr. Used to Beat Up Davey Moore in Sparring @ the Olympic Training Center and Would Make EASY WORK Of Him in an Actual Fight...

REED Did Ask Tony Sr What his Biggest REGRET Was, Regarding His Son's Career and EXPECTED an Answer Consisting of Wasted Potential, the Titles He Could've Won, the Money he Could've Amassed, etc...

Instead, Tony Sr. Said his Biggest Regret was the NAME Itself..."He Fucked Up My Name. I'm Tony Ayala Also. I was Tony Ayala 1st"...It was Clear His Son's Baggage Hurt him Still and Every So Often People Mistook him for the Rapist Tony Ayala...





REED

 

Never even really though of it that way. Pretty sad. As an example Chavez Jr. is a massive disappointment but that's not in the same league as Ayala Jr.