Is Canelo racist?

Do you mean ROID Jones?

 

Bump.

MTF

 

Define the highly subjective"world class fighter"

While you're at it, define the subjective prime age of fighters.

Thanks in advance.

 

Try a name and we'll take it from there. And you're welcome.

MTF

 

Might be unpopular but I definitely think Saunders was world class. Yes there's level to it, and Saunders definitely not on the higher end, but imo, it takes a world class fighter to toy with Lemieux the way he did.

 

I'm taking back my thanks because you didn't answer. That was the requirement.

You have been reported.

 

So you can't offer a name. Gotcha.

MTF

 

You can't give a definition to the questions you asked.

So basically you don't know. Gotcha.

Reported.

 

I don't think anyone else would consider Saunders 'world class'. His best win is probably Eubanks FFS.

MTF

 

A grown man posted this.

MTF

 

Especially since you have no idea what world class is.

 

A grown man is asking for answers that include terms in which he has no idea to their meaning.

 

Sigh. Yes it is subjective, so there is no point in defining it. Instead, I asked for the name of someone who we could debate instead. You don't have any names, so bully for you.

MTF

 

There's lots of threads there about lower weights. Far more than here, although obviously it's got far more traffic than here.

It's not quite as bad it I've seen in old threads; but Eastern bias is still ridiculously high. In fact I've literally just seen someone call Inoue the perfect KO machine and that he's both greater than and would destroy Wilfredo Gomez.

 

If you have no idea what 'world class' means, why do you want to debate it?

I thought you said it was subjective? What is your definition?

MTF

 

My three favourite fighters in the world are Estrada, Usyk and Prograis. Dunno how I'm a racist.

 

So your question contain terms that can't be defined and you admit is subjective, I'm not sure why such a question would be asked.

But I'll just throw a recent opponent out there for your entertainment, Caleb Plant. Undefeated champion in his prime. Maybe. His prime could be when he was 7 and putting teeth under his pillow. You admit this.

 

You don't understand why people ask questions about the resume of champion boxers?

Who has Caleb Plant beaten that merits him the title of being 'world class'? The bookies obviously didn't think much of him: he was about +500 to beat Canelo. Who else sports your view that he is 'world class'?

MTF

 

He slapped around a guy from Canadia. So the brothers dim will hype him by proxy

I despise saunders but he has a much better resume than plant. If plant wins his next fight against dirrell it will be his best or second best career win

 

No. I don't. Because EVERYONE'S resume can be broke down to look like crap. Because like I said, it's all subjective and pointless.

Plant like I said was an undefeated world class champion in his prime. Is it actually true? Who the hell knows.

It's pretty simple, it's not the biggest or second biggest win or "world class" it's actually the TOTALITY of the resume. That is what makes Canelo's the best. Is Teo's resume top 5 because he beat Loma?

 

In this forum's prime, meaning like 15 years ago, there were more discussions about lower weight fighters and a more diverse group of greats discussed in general.

As for ESB, the early 2000s neo nazis that used to overflow that place turned off a good deal of older fans. A lot still have the impression that ESB is the way the it was in 2002.

It's not as bad today.

 

That's good to hear, but even though more talk about the lower weight classes has happened whether it be here or there, the smaller weight classes are just not as popular. The casuals don't know who Gonzo or Fenito are. The people here, like you and I, are the only ones who GAF. So, with that said, the claim of Gonzalez being remembered as the better fighter will not happen.

I checked out ESB early 2000's it of curiosity and after what I seen, never returned.

 

ESB was a horrible, horrible place in the young Klit, and Michalczewski era.

After Wlad got KO'd by Corrie Sanders, and Michalczewski got beaten by Gonzalez, a lot of those fanbases disappeared and never came back.

 

Exactly ive heard nothing but bad things about Eastside Boxing. Ive never posted there for that reason. Heard its a bunch of white racist. And this guy acting like that boxing forum is the final authority in boxing . What a joke.

 

Horrible indeed. Glad it's gotten better, for the sane people there

 

So what makes Plant a 'world class' fighter, looking at the TOTALITY of his resume? Alternatively, using the TOTALITY of their resume, who is the best fighter Canelo had been in, say, the last six years?

MTF

 

Go back and read my post never once brought up race into it you did by saying I dick ride Canelo and "Mexican" fighters. How fuck would you know who my favorite fighters are. You're the one stereotyping me saying I dickride Mexican fighters just cause im mexican. The truth is there are only a handful of Mexican fighters I follow. My list of all time favorite fighters is all over the place. I used to be a Ricky Hatton fan back when he was coming up, I became a boxing fan watching Mike Tyson fights. It wasnt until the Chavez vs Camacho fight I started giving a shit about Chavez. So you shouldnt make blanket statements it just shows your ignorance.

 

That's your definition of being a world class fighter?

How many people in vegas have made fortunes betting on the underdog. Vegas odds have nothing to do with being world class or not dont be so simple.

 

I thought I was being clear. The TOTALITY of Canelo's resume is unmatched.

Plant was a undefeated champion. So was Saunders. So was Smith. So was GGG. So was Bivol. Add in Kovalev, Jacobs, for your six years question and take your pick.

Please refer me to a better resume in the 6 years you picked by any active fighter today.

If being an undefeated champion isn't "world class," AGAIN what is????

 

You place a lot more weight on being 'undefeated' and 'a champion' nowadays than I do. There are about eight 'champions' in each weight class nowadays and pretty much all of them are 'undefeated' through twenty fights or so. Being a beltholder and undefeated doesn't automatically mean you are actually any good. It never has - history is littered with boxers not much better than good who have fancy records and baubles.

I've watched every single fight Saunders and Smith have had on TV as pros. I've also watched a good number of Saunders' ammy fights, too. They are both absolutely average at elite level. They built flashy records and collected belts because they were carefully matched and because 168 is at its weakest point, arguably ever . If they were around ten years ago, when 168 was filled with actual world class fighters, you'd have never heard of either of them. The same applies to Plant and Jacobs. They are fodder for world class fighters. It is simply their good fortune that at 168 today, there aren't any about.

Canelo lost to Bivol. He also flat out lost the first fight to GGG, regardless of what some judges claimed. Pretty much anyone who watched that fight thought so. I thought he lost the second, too, though it was closer. GGG was 35 in their first fight. Conceding that 'prime' is subjective, do you nonetheless agree that it is highly unlikely that GGG was 'prime' at 35, on the basis that basically no fighter ever has been 'prime' at that age? Kovalev was 36 when Canelo fought him and he practically retired straight after that loss. Are you suggesting he was 'prime'?

On paper, Canelo's resume looks good. But once you get into it, especially the last few years, it's full of wind and piss.

MTF