THOUGHTS AND COMMENTS ON TONIGHTS CARD

One of the best cards in a long time IMO. Excluding the first match it was awesome. Even watching Chavez Jr destroy a walking punching bag was nice. There's something beautiful about watching guys get destroyed to the body and we got it several times tonight. Anyway here's some thoughts and opinions from me:


Cotto - Won spectacularly, but I thought he didn't look too sharp. The way he was throughing his punches didn't look as crisp and sharp as usual and at times he even looked winded and sloppy. His toughness, and mental strength was spot on and he's one of the best at keeping his composure and even though it was a very good performance by him I know he can look better than that.

Judah - Should make 1 of 2 choices. Either move down to 135 or retire. He was scared of Cotto by the 2nd rd and it's clear now more than ever that Judah is nothing more than a loud mouth punk. If he's going to get too intimidated to fight back, by people the same size as him or bigger, he needs to go to a division where his talent will over come his mental and physical lack of toughness, not to mention his size.

I don't know if Zab's confidence has been shot due to his recent losses or if he was just down right scared of Cotto but the fact is he's a pussy.

Soto - Has moved into one of my "favorite fighters" position. I love the way he throws crisp hard shots with mean intentions. Can't wait to see him against either JMM, or Pacman.

Chavez Jr - I was seriously considering starting his anti bandwagon tonight simply because I'm sick of this guy snatching up PPV spots just because his dad shot him up his mom's vagina. This guy would be struggling to get an ESPN card if not for his name. Also he doesn't look a thing like his father in there. He looks clumsy and even goofy with the way he moves around the ring. Chavez Sr was methodical and textbook in every way and could intimidate just by the way he moved in there.

 

Yes. Not enough of it boxing IMO. Head Kos are great but there's something about bodyshot KOs that I love. You can see that they want to get up but their body just won't let them.

Thoroughly enjoyed the Chavez fight for that reason. You could see that guy wince everytime he got hit to the side and you just knew it was over.

He still shouldn't be on PPV. :nono:

 

People want Judah to move to a division BELOW the one he started in?? This late in his career???:dunno:

 

He's done. He doesn't have his head in the game. He must have at some stage but that was long ago.

 

Yeah :eeeek: , yeah:eeeek: , yeah :eeeek: we don't want him to be 'weight drained' do we?..:crafty:

 

He should if he ever wants to have a meaningful career. I was never a fan of him moving up in the first place and to be honest Cotto is too short for 147 too. But Zab is the bigger problem here because he continues to lose for no other reason than he's too high in weight. Put him at 135 and his talent will outshine his deficencies in weight, height, and most of all toughness. The guy has no confidence left to be fighting guys bigger than him. If he's going to stay at 147 he's going to be nothing more than a stepping stone for up and comers and as you saw tonight, he'll gladly play his role of the menatally challenged punk. Hell, all a guy like Chavez jr would need to beat Judah would be a good chin.

 

I'm not too sure Lb. I don't think he's playing above his weight at all. He seems to carry the weight well and it hasn't affected his speed or stamina. He just doesn't want to fight anymore. If he can't bomb them out early he gives up.

I'm serious. He could have beaten Cotto had he stayed determined. He just gave up IMO.

 

I have to completely disagree with you. This has been the perception for years, and I think everyone's biggest problem will always be that he'll never be JCC Sr. My argument will always be: what fighter CAN claim to be the next Chavez?

Taking Chavez Jr's career at face value, I think he's a solid prospect, perhaps a year away from being a contender. A Gatti fight later this year MIGHT be a little too much, but I think it's a worthwhile move. It probably won't silence any critics, who will instead insist that Gatti's shot (which he is) and that JCC Jr. is still a fraud (which he isn't).

Like I said last year, I like Jr's chances against anyone from Season 2 of The Contender. I'd even take him over a prospect like Mike Alvarado, whom a lot of people seem to be high on (and I'm even one of them).

 

Seriously disagree with this. Stayed determined? Whats that meant to mean? He gave up because he was getting his ass beat down brutally and had no chance of winning. Also Judah is one of the worst finishers in the game.

 

Well, he thew a good combo early on that stunned Cotto. Did he follow up? No. He threw the left uppercut to great effect early on. How often did he throw it after? Not very.

Cotto ate every uppercut Zab threw and Zab STOPPED THROWING IT. Cotto did nullify it in part by turning southpaw but Judah in the end stopped throwing.

Lack of determination(will) cost Zab a good chance at a win today. He just seems to come up short in the heart department.

**EDIT**
No chance at winning is very, very misleading and honestly makes me wonder if you watched this fight impartially at all. I dislike Zab and have never seen Cotto fight before today and I saw Zab do quite well when he applied himself.

 

Kermit Cintron is soooo slooooow!...I actually like Zab's chances! :eeeek: make it happen!, make it happen!.

 

Still disagree. Judah had his chance early when he caught Cotto cold with the uppercut in round 1 and the left hook in round 2. They didnt put Cotto away and the methodical beatdown began. At which point Zab gave up any chance of winning. If Zab threw more punches, thers no doubt in my mind Cotto takes him out earlier.

 

I must say more about Judah here. He gave an absolute horrible account of himself, I mean I don't know why he acted so hurt for those lowblows because you got to have balls for the punches to be effective. I couldn't believe how scared and quickly he went into his mental collapse. Basically the fight was over in the 2nd rd because he was just petrified of Cotto. I also can't believe how weak and soft Judah is. He can't take it to the body anymore than he can to the chin and probably less so. I was so amazed by his lack of toughness that when he took a knee in the 9th I screamed out in front of everyone at work "YOU BITCH". When he was hugging his father after the fight I thought he was crying because he put up such a horrible fight. I was shocked he had the stomach to give a post fight interview. This guy is from Brooklyn? He won't even be able to walk down his street alone after that fight. He was an absolute pussy by huge standards.

Oh and by the way, taking a beating like he did doesn't mean he has heart, because he was actually just too scared to fight back. Already being in a fight whilst getting beaten up and still afraid to throw punches because you're so intimidated is not a sign of heart or toughness. I laugh now when I think people actually thought this guy would have beat Mosley, but then again I understand, because nobody knew at the time how soft Judah really was/is.

 

I watch all fights impartially. Thats the problem, youre saying when he applied himself, Zab is a notorious quick starter who looks a million dollars in the early rounds and slows after about 4 rounds, his punch output drops and he stops throwing combinations. There was no problem with Zabs determination in this fight.

 

You've agreed with me. Zab didn't put Cotto away and gave up. That's my point. How often did you see Zab throw that uppercut after then? Don't say that Cotto was beating him down because there were plenty of occasions Zab just didn't pull the trigger. That's what Yoel was saying the whole fight.

There's no doubt in my mind that if Zab could hurt Cotto the way he did but followed up, Cotto at least hits the deck. Zab's confidence soars and we could have a very different fight on our hands. We'll never know though because Zab is now a 4 round fighter at best.

 

Zab faked massive hurt from low blows and stopped throwing punches with any degree of regularity and you think there was no problem with his application?

I'm not argueing that Zab doesn't do that often, I'm saying that he gave away a winnable fight because of the way he fights.

 

Lib four Lib please, it's just the wrong Zab showed up is all :dunno: , it might be the right Zab next time, remember, the guy has blurring handspeed, and he's fast and good and fast. Remember, you haven't proven yourself 'worthy' until you beat Gatti, you haven't proven yourself a SUPERSTAR until you beat Zab Judah, it's just the way it is.

 

:dunno: All im saying is Zab had his chances early and Cotto took the punches, if Zab wasnt such a horrible finisher maybe he couldve dropped or even stopped Cotto (which I doubt). Even when Cotto was hurt those times, he didnt hold, he didnt run, and seriously he didnt do the greatest job covering up. Zabs just not a good finisher. Zab didnt pull the trigger because he was getting fucked up, he knew anytime his hands were away from his body/head and was going to get ripped with crisp punches.

 

Yeah, but I'm not saying he is a horrible prospect, I'm just saying he's getting way too good of an oppurtunity based on his name. I agree the Gatti fight is too much too soon. I mean even if he beats Gatti where does he go from there? He needs to continue feasting on bums for now since he's basically learning on the job and at our expense. Still though, that was a nice fight he put on, it's the main reason I decided against making the anti-Chavezjr bandwagon. Well that and a bit of laziness.

 

I think he's too high. He gets intimidated and flat out beat by guys who are bigger than him and he doesn't have the toughness to take it from the guys this high in weight. Sure he can make the weight no problem and physically perform, but my point is, if you're his manager you send him down 2 weight classes and let him win of his talent, because that's all he has. He doesn't have toughness, he doesn't have fortitude and he doesn't have confidence. All he has is talent and the only way he can (maybe) stay on top with just that is to go to 135. The problem is could he even make that weight if he wanted to.

 

I disagree with you completely. First of all, I don't think Cotto was as hurt as it appeared and 2nd, confidence and Judah don't belong in the same sentence. Judah a 4 rd fighter? Ha! he was a 1 rd fighter last night. He was mentally done after 1 rd, 1 rd that he arguably won. I will never give this guy any chance of winning a fight again. His confidence is done.

 

Damn I actually forgot about a point I intended to make earlier.

the complaint against him is that he steals PPV time slots from more deserving fighters. But then look at a card like last night. Normally, guys like Yuri Foreman and Anthony Thompson get bumped in favor of JCC Jr. Then you watch their own head to head fight and say "Why the fuck are these guys on TV?"

Considering the current PPV template - where most promoters only air three fights - Arum is actually just preserving the 4-fight format. No, it's not the same as when King would host 4 title fights on one show. But those are the old days - peep my sig for my thoughts on that.

People compare JCC Jr's showcasing to Butterbean and Mia St. John, I think it's extremely unfair.

 

I don't necessarily disagree. Considering his Derek Fisher-like flopping, he looked like he wanted to cash out after the first low blow. He had a good first round, had his moments in the third and again in the 7th, but otherwise yeah I agree after the second round you never had the sense that Zab would ever rally back and win.

 

Whoaa! Hold on Jake. That first bad fight wasn't Thompsons fault, it was Foreman's. Thompson wanted to get it on but just wasn't allowed to because of Foreman's constant hit and hold technique. He made John Ruiz and Hatton proud. Besides I'd rather see a boring fight that means something than a prospect beat up a guy with no chance. That was nothing but a glorified sparring session. Yeah it was good but it was also a waste of time and told us nothing.

 

That is my point Lb. I know Judah WON'T start fighting with confidence because that's the way he is. I'm saying that if he had he could have beaten Cotto or at the very least lasted the distance.

He has all the talent and natural ability but not the will to keep fighting and that is all I've been saying the whole time. Cotto did NOT walk through Zab's punches so please let's not make this into a Cotto superman thread. Cotto was hurt alright, good and proper and a better boxer would have dropped him at the least.

Zab just doesn't have the will nor the attitude. He reminds me a little of Tyson in this regard.

 

I'm not so sure he could make that weight comfortably anymore. How long has been fighting above 135? 7-8 years? At this stage in his career it would probably do more harm than good. He'd more than likely get the success but he would certainly be looked down on as a bigger fighter picking on smaller guys.

Once Roy Jones got comfortable at 175, he ceased to be a blown up super middle weight. I always hated that excuse. Judah is at the right weight IMO but doesn't have the tools to get it done at the highest level. I doubt we'll see much more out of him.

A good start might be getting someone other than Yoel in his corner.

 

Start? Come on, Judah is at the other end of the race. He started long ago. That dog is going to be real hard to teach anything new to.

 

Agreed. I think he's done but he'd be better off getting a fresh perspective IMO than trying to drop in weight at this late stage.

 

I thought Thompson won, and yes Foreman's clinching was disgraceful. But if Thompson didn't punch like he was apologizing, it would have been a different ballgame, and at least a watchable affair. Instead we got a shitty fight, and a shitty decision. What's worse the type of fight Arum has gone out of his way to condemn "No more business fights!"