There seems to be growing myth that Louis was too small to beat a Modern day BIG heavyweight. Of course this is unfounded nonsense: the creation of young fans that have no knowledge of boxing history. Joe Louis had beaten his fair share of fighters that were 230lbs and above: Bubby Baer - 250lbs Abe Simon - 255lbs Primo Carnera - 260lbs Size is overrated. Skills pays the bills. Jack Dempsey destroyed Jess Willard even though he was outweighed by roughly 60 pounds. Anyway...of course valuev is bigger than even Carnera or Willard, but....SO WHAT? John Ruiz is hardly any bigger, naturally, than Joe Louis was and he couldn't even TRULY beat Evander Holyfield who is basically a blown up cruiserweight....yet he gave Valuev all he could handle. Anyway... Joe Louis does to Valuev, what Jack Dempsey did to Jess Willard. Anyone disagree?
So where are the 6'2 210 lbs guys these days who keep knocking the big guys out? Why is it that these days guy of that size can only be succesful by being a moving boxer?
Why is that? Did they know more about punching technique then, did they have better steroids back then, what is it? Why did many 210 lbs guys knock out those big fellows you listed but now we don't have them?
This post is so ignorant, it's beyond me. Why is that? They don't have his power, simple. Chris Byrd, wouldn't have been knocking out Primo Carnera or Max Baer either...because he's NOT a powerful fighter.
Yeah, so where are the powerful 210 lbs guys now? Why are there none, when in the 1940s most of the big punchers were that size and usually smaller? Is it just possible that you can't be powerful enough these days being 200lbs or so? Video tapes don't tell you the truth man. Sure, Louis looks impressive in them whacking out guys, but then again, jesse Owens looks impressive too
Number one: Are you trying to tell me that Nikolay Valuev would have beaten Joe Louis? Also...you think Byrd and these guys hit as hard as Joe Louis did? Secondly SCALES are the same, and as I said before, Carnera, Baer and Simon (and Willard) were as heavy as the guys nowadays....and Louis and Dempsey took'em out.
You're making great points Ugo :bears: :bears: :bears: Joe Louis was a great fighter FOR HIS TIME. If Valuev fought in the 50's he'd be put in the same category as Ali. He'd be a freaking unbeatable monster in mythical matchups. What's next you're gonna pick DAVID over a modern day commando just because back in the day he slayed a giant? just remember everything looks more impressive in black and white. There is a certain aura associated with black and white film ::
:eeeek: So let me get this right: Valuev would have beaten Joe Louis and dominated the 40s? :laughing:
Well, let's see. Mike Tyson was 5'10" (with an afro on a windy day) and in his prime weighed 215-220. David Tua is 5'10"; and in his best years was 210-225 lbs. or so. Joe Frazier was 5'11" and weighed under or at around 210 lbs. for almost his whole career. Earnie Shavers - 6'0" and from 200-215 for practically his entire career (thought of as likely the biggest hitter EVER at HWT). Michael Moorer - 6'2" and under 220 most of his prime years at HWT. Tommy Morrison - 6'2" and around 220. Oscar Bonavena - 5'10" and 200-210. George Chuvalo - 6'0" and 200-215 at his best. Sonny Liston - 6'1" and anywhere from 200 - 218 or thereabouts. Ray Mercer. Bert Cooper. Folley. :dunno: Being a mammoth boxer is STILL a rare occurence, even in today's game...and is not a guarantee that you will not be KO'd. Now, even guys that are 5'10" - 6'2" or so tend to weigh a bit more these days (210-230); but I would submit to you that alot of that is simply under-training...or the erroneous perception that they "need" the weight to compete. And most of the guys above are by no means "movers." Were there other factors back in those days? Sure, there were some. But Louis' power had ALOT to do with his natural talent - and excellent punching technique. I think it is easy to overlook just how special Louis' power and accuracy and timing were. Now, damn, of course, Valuev represents a huge size disparity for Louis in both height AND weight, and that will pose problems. But I don't think Valuev would have "ruled the division" back in "those days" - not because he wasn't big enough, but because of TALENT (or lack thereof). Fact remains that Ruiz beat Valuev (I had it 115-113); Chagaev beat him (6'1"; 228 lbs) and wild-swinging Barrett (6'3", 222 lbs.) gave him all he could handle. Do you think it's THAT much of a stretch to think a 6'2" 210 lb. Louis could have beaten Valuev? Joe was faster and a MUCH better, more accurate puncher. And it's not as if Valuev is really hard to time or that it's difficult to see his punches coming. I don't think Nikolay hits that hard, to be honest. Yeah, Carnera and Firpo really looked impressive in black and white. :: Peace.
Every time wild-swinging Barrett let his hands go - which was rare - he clocked Valuev clean; and I thought there were alot of close rounds.
How many rounds are we fighting to? If he was still standing Valuev wouldn't be able to make it beyond 12 through exhaustion. In the 50s Valuev would have had his ass handed to him by Walcott, Charles, Marciano, Johanson and a washed up Louis.
