Valero's opponent lasts the distance!..

this might be true, but when someone says something as stupid as Karl does over and over, he deserves for everyone to rip on him, instead he's got a moderator backing his take.

that and Slystaff denegrating indians and deleting his own thread after being owned like crazy, im just curious if this is normally allowed behavior of moderators

 

If Valero hooks up with a top flight trainer say Ronnie Shields for instance, he may turn out to be a pretty good fighter.
Ronnie or say a Roach, Nacho, or Steward would have to have plenty of patience though to take this kid to boxing 101, and they'd want a whole lot of money for their time and troubles.
He has real good power and good handspeed, but again -- doing two things well and the rest not well dosen't make one a good fighter.
I think I could do a better job of training Valero than his current trainers, and that is not a knock on them, either.
You can tell he loves to fight, and you have to admire that quality, like Forman loved to fight, but he is even more open than a young George was.
The first thing he needs to do is to not have his chin exposed and not to punch with both hands at his waist, and to quit bringing his left foot in front of his right foot when punching.
Marciano did the same thing except in an orthodox manner when he started his career off, and that is where the great Charlie Goldman started tying his feet together with the shoestrings to keep him focused on being balanced.
But as it stands now, Valero is going to get hurt badly in the future if he dosen't get a new set of trainers/advisors.

 

Karl I have to ask... and I say this respect... why do you say Daniel Ponce De Leon can fight and not Edwin Valero?

 

That's a good technical post Karl.

 

Valero have to fight like that because that's the only way he's getting recognition.....by word of mouth. He can't fight on the US, so the only way to get people to go to his fight, the only way he could made noise, was to do what he does best, KO everyone that stands on his way. He risks technical proficiency because that may not be the best way to put pressure on the US commisions to give him a licence, or to get a chance to fight for the title. Get people talking, and then the doors will open. I don't see how you can bash israel vazquez for quitting, and valero for going for the KO everytime he fights, seems like a contradiction on your part, karl.:dunno:

 

I just want to focus on this guy one final time and not some others, he probably won't listen in the gym or in the ring and is allowed to do whatever he wants in there as he is winning.
But again; he is gonna bite it big time coming up jumping in wide open with his chin straight up in the air like he does, it's just a matter of time before this kid is really hurt pretty bad in there.

 

Karl, you and I agree completely about how flawed Valero is. The only thing I don't agree with is him becoming a 'pretty good fighter' if he hooks up with a top flight trainer.

I think Valero, after 23 pro fights, is what he is. I don't think a combination of Roach, Steward, Mcgirt and Shields working with him 24/7 for several years would help at this point. They may instill SOME technical improvement, but Valero's propensity to wing wild looping shots with total disregard for his chin or his post-punch balance won't go away.

What's really amazing is that Valero had a relatively lengthy and storied amateur career. He beat Bojado in the ammies. Usually guys that spend several years fighting international amateur competition are far more technically proficient than Valero is currently displaying.

And you are right, once his competition level steps-up, he will be beaten ridiculously.

 

Yeah, that tends to happen. When a fighter faces the best in the world, chances are that he eventually loses. However he already has captured a major belt and knocked out credible opponents in the progress, so even if he got knocked out in his next fight, he still has had better career than most.

 

Or maybe, and just maybe, he has found a way of fighting that suits him the best? He beats up everybody, so what if it LOOKS flawed? Vitali Klitschko also fought with pretty "good" (=orthodox) technique as an amateur, as a pro he changed his style to a unique one. And yet, he kept beating up everybody. For how long does Valero have to keep winning for you to give him a pass?

 

There are many, many, many talented fighters between 126-135. When he beats JUST one of them then I will give him the credit he deserves. Seriously, has he beaten anyone that YOU would consider quality?

By the way, your point about styles is solid. It may just be that Valero is fighting the only way he can to achieve any success.

 

Vitaly most certainly didn't beat 'everybody'. :nono:
In fact, he lost to the only two world heavyweight champions he ever faced, not even lasting the distance in either of those fights.
Sure, I agree that Vitaly's boxing style was unique ( who else can claim to quit in amateur bouts, quit in professional bouts, and even quit repeatedly before a fight started?), but to claim that he beat "everybody" is a flat out lie.
'

 

the current version of valero fights pretty much like de leon, except even the sloppier punches he throws/lands inflict damage. he also has quicker handspeed and appears to be a bit more accurate with his punches.

the guy he fought on saturday was a bum, but he had an awkward style and only managed to survive through the 3rd round because he was crouching down to avoid punches.

the guy linares fought was the dude who upset guerrero a few years back, and he gave linares a rough fight for the most part, but was simply outclassed and KTFOed by running into a vicious right hand counter.

i'd like to see both valero and linares step up their competition in 2008. it's doubtful for valero who will probably never get a fight in the U.S., but linares certainly has viable options at 126 against guys like guerrero, chris john (if he ever decides to step up), and contenders/pretenders like salido, enoki, matsuda and solis

 

You wanna see me abuse my mod powers? One more peep out of you about me supposedly attacking indians, which is a lie and unfounded...and you're outta here! Got that? Just ONE MORE.

My reason: I never attacked Indians ever, I just said i want Amir Khan beaten....because he's overrated. So your accusation is inflammatory.

So one more ppe out of you on this issue and you are out out out!

 

khan is originally from pakistan, not india. ::

regardless, he looked real sharp in decapitating that club fighter earl, who stunned katsidis a few times when they fought.

 

why you hatin' on indians sly?

 

I know you're kidding..but for the record...wanting a guy to lose doesn't mean that I'm hating on people of his ethnicity. :doh:

 

let me guess, your best friend is indian. keep hatin' brother.

 

Well since that thread where you and someone named phonetap took shot after shot about Indians/Pakis never producing a half-decent fighter has disappeared, I guess we'll never know.

This place is a total joke, we have moderators talking shit flailing mod powers around.

Why don't one of you get laid, just once, so you can get over your little dick/closet hentai loving complexes

 

:dunno:

hentai is not bad at all.

 

Myelmers, you are perfectly within your rights on a public message board to give your opinions on boxing, fights, and fighters.

Or are you telling me you have never, ever criticized a boxer for his style, or lack of technique, or a faulty fight plan...or their antics in or out of the ring?

I certainly have. And will continue to do so.

Whether you agree with it or not, any poster has the right to offer their opinion and assessment of a fighter. Period.

Just like you do.

What is unacceptable is breaking forum rules.

As long as Karl or anyone doesn't break the rules of the forum, they are free to espouse their opinion on a fighter, no matter how severe or acerbic - whether we happen to agree with it or not.

If you don't agree with that, I'd be happy to ban you next time you critique a fighter. :dunno: :doh:

I'm not "backing his take". Dymi is offending a poster directly and his behavior is repetitive and pernicious.

When Karl crosses the line and threatens to beat someone up or insults them, he will be warned - and banned - as well. He was actually suspended 2 weeks ago for exactly that.

Peace.

 

I was away and missed that thread...if indeed it was insulting a specific ETHNICITY - not an opinion on a FIGHTER, but insulting an ethnicity - I would most certainly have locked it, whether it was started by a mod or not.

Will ensure this does not happen next time.

If there is no moderator intervening, feel free to PM or email us to get our attention.

Peace.

 

I remember the thread ...(IT WAS IN TAAA) and to my knowledge it wasn't deleted it's probably on the second page or something.

Hanzy was taking a shot, in jest at black athletes and Phonetap responded about indian athletes. There was nothing malicious about it and this Mike Myers character is just trying to build a case that doesn't exist.

He's trying to relate that thread, initiated by Hanzy and responded to...to me saying that I want Amir Khan beaten...and then act like I hate Inidians.

I mean....it's tiresome.

With these characters coming on this site and trying to stat this shit, I'm losing the love for posting...

 

hahaha..awesome...as I was reading through this thread, this exact thought crossed my mind.

Personally, I like both of them and don't dismiss them at all.

 

Karl left and has already seen his stuff published on another site.