is Lewis a "top 5 hw of all time" ??

this comes from another thread where some wacko said that Lewis is a top 5 heavy in everyone's mind but mine..

for me personally.. I think he is no where NEAR the top 5.. I'd probably have him in the bottom 5

 

In my opinion he is, or at least very close to it. To me the top-5 is Ali, Louis, Johnson, Holmes and Lewis

 

that's arguable. he beat EVERYONE he ever faced. if it werent for his KO losses and gay british accent, he'd probably be held in higher regards.

 

His hairstyle also wasn't all that

 

I'm not going go anywhere near as far back as pre-1960 cos I havent seen that many fights, but I will list my Top 5, 1960-2000:
Muhammad Ali
Mike Tyson
Joe Frazier
Larry Holmes
George Foreman

Then take your pick from:
Sonny Liston
Floyd Patterson
Ken Norton
Evander Holyfield
Lennox Lewis

 

Mike Tyson number 2!!? :laughing:

 

lewis should be rated higher than foreman

 

Agreed, and also clearly higher than Joe Frazier.

 

Not in any order.

 

Honestly, you guys all know I hate Lennox.. but as un-biased and logical as I can be.. I can not see him cracking the top 5 at all!! I just can't see it

his only big wins were over guys in the twilight of their career (Holy) or WAY past their time and drugged out (Mike)

he had VERY questionable wins (mercer)

and was KO'd by McCall and Rahman

 

are you being Serious Joony?? :doh:

 

The 'KO'd-By' losses go against Lennox Lewis as an all-time great in the same way they go against Wladimir Klitschko as a 'decent-heavyweight-in-it's-worst-ever-state' analogy.

 

Much like many other champions. Larry Holmes being one example, Mike Tyson also.

That is ONE win and it was no more questionable than Holmes-Witherspoon, Holmes-Williams, Louis-Walcott or plenty of Ali's late fights

And he also avenged those losses. Also he was never outboxed in his life which is pretty rare

 

aside from knocking out little Joe and brittle Moorer, what other top heavy has foreman beaten?

lewis, despite his two flukish KO losses, avenged both and beat EVERYONE he ever faced. he had two separate reigns, second of which lasted a while.

foreman in his supposed prime, got knocked out by a faded ali, got outboxed then dropped in the end by jimmy young.

you're telling me lewis wouldn't have KOed frazier and norton?

 

mercer inflicted some damage, but it was lewis who was landing more shots. it was the way lewis reacted to certain punches that made mercer appear to have won the rounds that people may have given it to.

 

F no!

you say Foreman KO'd "little Frazier" like Frazier was some bum

you are saying Lemmon would KO Joe Frazier but somehow got KO'd by McCall and lost to old ass Mercer?::

 

saying he is top5 is certainly more plausible than saying he is one of the 5 worst heavyweight fighters ever.

 

McCall is a big guy with deceptive handspeed and power. Frazier was a midget compared to Lewis and Lewis would've kept him at bay w/ his stiff jab.

you're in the minority who thought mercer won that fight.

 

Lewis clearly is a top 5 heavyweight.

 

I'm not totally with Lok on this but I really see his point. I think a prime Foreman just butalizes Lewis. You can say Frazier was a midget and he was definitely smaller than Lewis, but smokin Joe was a beast in the ring. He would have kept coming at Lewis. Lewis's jab better be on because if it isn't Joe gets inside and destroys him with a left hook to the jaw.

 

lewis would've fought cautiously against foreman. imo, foreman would've fatigued down the stretch before getting KOed or losing on points.

lewis was also bigger, technically superior, hit just as hard if not harder.

i also rate holyfield higher than foreman.

 

I remember watching Frazier deal with one of the best jabs in the history of the sport in 1971 and not being 'kept at bay'.

Lewis had a long, effective jab, but it was no where near the sharp, fast, razor-like left hand that Ali owned.

 

People tend to forget how powerful Foreman really was back in the day. Are you telling me that:

1) Lewis doesn't get hit by Foreman

or

2) Lewis doesn't get hurt by Foreman


I find both hard to believe considering Lewis was hit, and knocked silly, by lesser punchers.

 

ali's jab was sharp and faster, but lewis' was a lot harder. he would've stiffed frazier.

foreman may or may not have been able to knock lewis out, but i certainly see lewis beating him as the more likely scenario.

i dont really care for mythical matchups, but i just think that lewis was better/greater both from a head-to-head and achievement perspective.

 

You're missing the point. Frazier found a way to work around Ali's far more accurate jab. Personally I think he'd make the slower jab by Lewis look stupid.

I can remember Frazier ducking and bobbing under and around the educated jab of Jimmy Ellis and nailing him with monster counters.

There's not a jab invented that would keep Frazier completely at bay. When he was young, he was a difficult SOB to hit with a jab.

 

thank you, in the midst of this thread Frazier and Foreman are both being vastly underrated

 

Top 15 yes , but five is a elite group of guys from a better era. Not to take away from Lennox he ducked nobody and went out on top.:clap:

 

maybe top 15.. .even then I personally wouldn't put him in but I could see why people would..

top 5 as you said is an elite group

in this thread alone names like Ali, Foreman, Frazier, those 3 for sure are above Lennox

I'd put Holy and Mike about him as well

I'd put Joe Louis, Rocky Marciano above him

5 is a small group... I haev trouble picking the 5 I want but Lennox is no where near the choices IMO

 

He is certainly top 5.

He beat everyone he ever fought. He lost to McCall, "by getting brutaly KO'd" even though he was up at 7 and it was a controversial stoppage at the time (something people seem to forget)

In an immediate rematch he beat the living piss out of McCall. Against Rahman, he got hit with an absolute hail mary punch that would've KO'd ANYONE. And then in another immediate rematch?...he KTFO Rahman.

Apart from that he beat Evander Holyfield thrice (fuck you eugenia williams), and beat a bunch of solid HW's that came up in the 90's.

There is no argument that Foreman or Frazier or Tyson or anyone besides Ali and Holmes could be ranked above him from the last 40 years. He is apparently severely underrated by many.

 

A key punch for Lewis against Joe would be the uppercut. Lewis had a vicious right uppercut (although it sometimes seemed like he held the guy with his left hand around half of the time he landed the right uppercut).

I never liked Lewis, but him being a top 5 HW is not completely out of this world.