Chavez Jr. to retire?

Agreed!

 

At least Chavez Sr. was fighting top ten contenders while in his twentysomething fights and won a title in his 30th bout. Junior has 37 bouts and has not faced a top ten fighter yet!

 

Lets compare Chavez Jr. & Miguel Cotto. Both started pretty much around the same time. Junior has a record of 37-0 (29 KOs) and has faced nobody worth mentioning. Cotto has a record of 32-0 (26 KO's) has won titles in two divisions and has faced elite opposition. Does Junior needs any more tune-ups until he steps up? Oh, I forgot, he is retiring...::

 

Yeah, Junior fought in the Olympics, though, while Cotto turned pro without much amateur experience...so it's hard to compare the two like that.

 

Other way around on the names, but that's exactly right.

 

I was being obvious in my sarcasm.

 

So what? We are talking about pro-boxing here. How many amateur fights Randall Tex Cobb had? Zero. Yet he fought Larry Holmes and Earnie Shavers among others. Junior had a few 'exhibition' fights before he turned pro. On his first 'exhibition' bout, on the same 'card' his sister fought too. She was a bloody mess btw.:laughing:

 

come on.. he could go WAYYY lower ::

 

::

 

partially true - his lack of heart was his greater achilles heel, though. In fact I'll even argue that it contributed to his poor training habits.

Chavez Jr, on the other hand, is clearly hurting his own progress by not training very hard, if even at all. Arum kind of deserves what he gets for milking the kid's name and keeping him tucked away in Mexico, but the truth is that it's not helping Julio one bit.

People refuse to admit, but his skills were at least developing even while feasting on Midwestern's finest through his first 4 years as a pro. Now putting him in a situation where he believes every fight is a gimme doesn't do him any good, in fact is literally hurting his career.

 

So then why were you defending him so much when I was stating the same sh*t a year back? Look at your sig. Only now are you figuring out the obvious. We know the kid is a manufactured joke and he's NEVER going to fight let alone beat a real legitimate fighter.
But you were so quick to defend his phony ass, saying he's gonna beat my favourite fighters.::
Sh*t's blowing up in your face now eh, Jake? I guess you were also quick to jump on the Dominick Guinn bandwagon 5 years back like a lot of other members.

 

Hanz, first off, what fighters TODAY do you like? I've never once heard you talk favorably about any active fighter, so once you establish that, I'll offer a more detailed response to your usual gibberish.

 

That wasn't really relevant to the subject. Our argument was about Chavez Jr's opposition and his wins over mediocrity. Some people thought he had the goods, others thought he was a hype job living off his old man's name and fighting nobodies who were alot smaller and weaker than he was. Those who thought he was special are the ones desperately looking for a new young face to make an impact in a flagging sport who fail to see reality. Those Chavez Jr fans were the same ones who looked at Dominick Guinn as the saviour of the heavyweight division 5 years ago when nobody else came up. They looked at Guinn's so-called technical excellence, his speed, his power and thought he was THE ONE. They looked at Chavez Jr the same way.
What they didn't realize is that anybody can look good on a punching bag or against a dead opponent who offers no resistance. That was the case with these two.
As for my favourite fighters, we have to talk about fighters who fight anybody, true warriors. Warriors like Morales and Barrera and Marquez and Pacquiao, guys who come to fight and not pad their records against easy safe opposition.
Chavez Jr may have a famous surname but he's no warrior. Warriors are born, not made. This kid is no warrior, he's just a baby, spoonfed and hyped for the sake of making money and ripping off the public. We get a lot of those in boxing.

 

Depends what you expect. I feel he is matched appropiately for his amateur experience, age, skill. The problem is that he fails to beat these opponents more impressively like a blue chip prospect would do. His offense ain´t that bad, many of his punches look hurtful, technically sound. It´s his atrocious defense and disregard for improvement in that department, that will get him stopped on accumulation over 12 rounds.

 

He hasn't fought anybody worth a damn. Let him step up to Antonio Margarito or Paul Williams. The kid will die!

 

I agree that up to and including the Sanchez fight, he was matched appropriately. But he's all but taking the year off - there's no reason for his comp to have levelled off. Matching him tougher will either force him to train harder or find a new job. Everyone telling him that it's another fight against a usual suspect doesn't do anything for him, and I've been very critical of his progress, or lack thereof, this year.

But I agree, his defense is going to hurt him in the long run, in fact already hurting him now.

 

If his last name wasn't Chavez, you would've dragged his name through the dirt and washed your hands of him completely.
Keep that sig up though. It's going to make it all the sweeter when Jr gets murdered! And another so-called saviour of boxing bites the dust!

 

My argument has always been that we need to separate the fighter from his surname. In most circles, he never stood a chance from jump - the moment he turned pro, everyone expected him to be his father and seem to take great joy in the fact that he's not and most likely will never be.

I instead opted to see him for who he was - a fighter with no amateur experience - and gauged his skills accordingly. From there, he made great strides, only once again, nobody wanted to recognize it because it's Julio Jr and Top Rank has little desire beyond milking his popularity down to the very last drop.

As noted in the post prior to this one (replying to El Terriblee), this year has been a letdown. Not only has his opposition level hit a wall, but he looks softer and softer in each fight as if his training camp begins and ends with merely making weight (which he hasn't even achieved with much success in his past few fights).

I've never denied that his career is a sideshow, but at the same time still contend that in a proper environment he can actually grow into a real fighter. Not the second coming of his father, but someone that can eventually fuck around and win a belt or two.

I don't know what Dominick Guinn has to do with any of this. People liked him for completely different reasons, not to mention that he had over 300 amatuer fights.

 

I´m sure Arum has no interest to put Chavez Jr. into a situation, where he has to choose between training harder and finding another job. At least not until he is 60-0-1. ::

If Chavez wants Arum to match him tougher and step up his competition, he´ll have to show him, that he can handle the Matt Vanda´s of the world. So it is all up to Chavez Jr. If his mentality is to cruise along, Arum won´t stop him for a while, some opponent might though.

 

I agree except its kind of the chicken vs. the egg debate. I thought Arum fucked up by not having him fight Gomez or Baldomir as originally planned. Saving Gomez for Cotto was pointless, as there were plenty of other welterweights Miguel could've beat on while awaiting a Margarito fight. Had Chavez Jr. faced either one of them, he'd have either been exposed, or he wins and bleeding vaginas like Hanzy would've had a little less to bitch about

 

:: If Jr really wanted those fights, those fights would've been made. It's a joint decision by Jr, his old man and Arum that he continues this piece of sh*t path of joke opposition. And now his stock is dropping even more and he hasn't even stepped up yet. Who the hell is Matt Vanda?

 

Even Chavez Sr. is a bit overrated and I think Mexican fans aren't the type to be snowed over. Mexican fight fans have guys like Barrera, Morrales, and the Marquez brothers who are legitimate great talents, so they don't need some punk rich kid with a famous dad to hang their hats on.

 

man.. I'd like to be a manager.. I'd find him some real stiffs..

I could go to a "mexican corner" where guys stand to get work.. handyman type stuff..

I'd get a couple and give them good names like "The Tijuana Terror" and I'd say how this guy lost his whole family and came here with nothing and how when he was a kid he used to steal from Chavez sr and jr now wants revenge

I'd dress him up and make him look real tough.. have him talk trash.. I'd really get the media worked up

then Chavez jr would startch him in 1 round

I'd do this like 35 times in a row and people would thing Jr was the baddest man around!!:hammert:

 

Brilliant! That's the way to do it!:bears:

 

Speaking of Camachita Jr., wasn't he being talked about as an opponent for JCC Jr. later this year?

JCC Jr. could at least wait until after he knocks him out to retire.

 

Put him in there with Ricardo Mayorga.

If his skills aren't good enough to get by Mayorga:

1) He doesn't need to continue boxing
2)He'll get brutally KO'd

So if he wins, he moves on. If he loses, consider him retired and KTFO.

 

He wouldn't stand a chance against Mayorga, pretty much none whatsoever.

 

Everyone would have picked Chavez over Gomez and Baldomir. I still would.

 

Funny you mention Barrera, Morrales, and Marquez...three fighters who will not and should not and are not rated higher than Chavez Sr historically, ability, career, etc..

 

The way he destroyed the legendary Matt Vanda, and the other italian guy, does this re-enforce your opinion that Chavez would beat Baldomir and Gomez?