I want to see Tyson vs Wlad

Oh really? And how many offensive forces has Wlad faced in the last 5 years? Its easy to look unbeatable when none is attacking you, or punching back.

The bottom line is... theres no way Wlad is NOT gonna get tagged by a young Tyson. And when he does, his long history indicates he wouldnt handle it.

BTW - you're clearly a hypocrite by saying Wlad is a different fighter now, yet in the same sentence listing the Quick Tillis fight. Mike was still pre-prime when he fought Tillis.

 

Right, so five years ago all heavyweights in the world made an agreement not to attack Wlad and instead let him dominate fights as he pleases. Yes, sounds reasonable.

Sure, Wlad has not faced many great offensive machines, who have not been found. However what should be remembered is that it was not Brewster's aggression that toppled Wlad, it was that Wlad attacked him and ran out of gas. When has he done it since?

Against Wlad Tyson would have to reach with his punches a great deal and that reduced his effectiveness (the reason why he couldn't KO guys like Tucker and Douglas who used the distance well). Sure, Tyson does have a punch to hurt Wlad, but then again Wlad had everything over Buster Douglas, a man who practically dominated Tyson and was not known for his chin

 

What the hell does this even mean?

America needs to get its head out of its ass and stop electing socialist incompetents to office for "hope and change".

I don't know of any Americans who really want Mike Tyson to come out of retirement, or who really care that Wlad KO'd "American" Eddie Chambers yesterday. As you are aware, so few Americans even care that the fight wasn't even shown on American TV.

"Uganda needs to get its head out of its ass." <- I don't need a reason to say that, it just looks good.

 

I'd like to know whether or not people believe that Wlad's success (and Vitali's frankly) is due to their skill and/or physical advantages or because their opponents are generally stupid, unprepared, and not all that good.

I am serious about this. I realize this discussion has taken place a million times before with regard to other fighters who make their opposition look bad. But in this case I think it is more tangible because this is a time where the heavyweight division is terribly weak. Almost nobody disputes that.

Watching Chambers get trounced yesterday made me think about all the things he could have done to make the fight better. But he didn't do any of those things. He was not prepared to do those things. After some success in the first round, Chambers badly lost the 2nd round as Wlad adjusted. After that, Chambers did not adjust for the next 10 ROUNDS! He kept doing the same things, and got pummeled and KO'd. Even an idiot could see after round 2 that Chambers was DONE unless he made some changes.

I would like to add that many, many fighters have Charlie or Bert or some guy they call "Quacky" in their corner. They have these people because they grew up with them, and they trust them, and because they like go to Taco Bell with them. But when these fighters are losing, and get back to their corner, the advice they get goes along the lines of:

"You gots to get this guy!! Get him!! You gettin' hit! He tired! Come on!"

Or similar. Teddy Atlas may be a crap trainer, but at least when his fighter comes back to the corner after a bad round, Atlas tries to give him pertinent technical advice. Like "he's tagging you with that right hand too often - you need to keep more distance and step in with your jab when you get close. Then right back out!" Look at the Pac/Clottey fight. In that case, Clottey actually did go out and get a new trainer instead of having Stu in the corner. And even then, all he got was "You are losing! You have to let your hands go! Punch him!".

Yes, it was honest. But was it helpful? I think that what we are seeing (and it's most noticeable amongst heavies right now due to Wlad/Vitali) is not only less talent in some divisions of boxing... but we are seeing the manifestation of less knowledge in the gym and in the corners. I think the people who understand how styles fit together like pieces of a puzzle are all but gone. There are very few trainers who can analyze what is happening and develop a good, concise, effective counter plan.

So these guys are going into championship fights with people who only know the very basics of the game, along with maybe a few training tips they picked up that will help their guy jump rope better. Their fighter then gets by on fundamentals & talent alone until they fight someone really good, and then they lose in epic fashion.

I look at Floyd Mayweather, and I don't see many openings. I don't see many holes in his style, and it would no doubt be tough to prepare for a fight with him. But with Wlad.... I see a lot of openings. I see a lot of ways that he can be countered, but you can't do it by just standing in front of him and waiting, or by blindly coming forward all fight swinging your arms.

So is Wlad just that good? Or are most of his opponents just that bad or that unprepared?

 

It's due to a combination of factors, as is always the case when an individual fails at a given task. One of the unmentionables is that these guys believe they cannot lose to whitey. When it starts to happen, they are often completely demoralized as they watch the impossible become very very real. Years of Afro-centric sympathies suddenly provide very little in the line of a defense against an opponent who is better, bigger, and nowhere near as collapse prone as was first believed.

See point 1. Because people believe the division is "terribly weak" they then take that mistaken belief and apply it right across the board. If the division is weak, the belief holds, that the K-bros must also be weak. Which they are not. Outside of Ruiz, the Klitschkos are the last existing link between the current division and that of Lewis, Holyfield, Botha, uhhh.....Vaughn Bean....uhhh...uhhh...and other great fighters from the last 20 years.

As stated...Chambers was getting ready for Wlad to unravel, to fall apart, to QUIT...to just get tired and fall over. Chambers has spent his entire pro career being told that this is an inevitability, that it always happens...it must happen. The fact that the man never quit in his life and that 2 of his 50+ fights have seen him run out of steam, both on occasions when there were other factors at play, seems lost on people like Chambers. Remember Kevin Johnsons old saying about how to beat Wladimir? "Just tap that chin" Okay.

Agreed. It was the same when Williams fought Vitali, it seemed that Sterling McPherson was as unconvinced of Dannys talents as anyone else was, hence the desperate need to "keep him in the fight", so to speak. And, it reflects what I stated above, that these dudes are shocked by how the brothers do not roll over in submission. Williams himself said afterward that he was "surprised by how good Klitschko was". Well....he shouldnt have been. He should listen less to the afro-centric sentiments of the papers and the media men and look more at his opponents record.

True, in part. Take for example David Haye. Every second word out of his mouth is....... athleticism....he is the better.... affleet. He actually parodies the very things that make it hard for him to beat either Klitschko...the stance, the jab, the timing, the patience, the deliberate build-up, the late, strong finishes of both brothers. There is, it seems, a palpable lack of acknowledgement on his behalf, and that of his trainer, as to what a real world-class fighter is about. It is not about afleticism or being "ripped" or being "shredded" or having less fat, or any of this shit. Remember Jeff Lacy and his Sports-Illustrated 6 Pack of the Year". Remember that shit?

 

Alot of opponents state what they've got to do against him, and it makes sense in theory,.. but thier problem, thier HUGE problem has always been that quick, blinding, vicious, and endless pole-vault to the head,.. it probably hurts even more than it looks,.. and if that's not enough to contend with, they begin to have extreme anxiety about the flashing and murderous straight right behind it,..which they may have experienced once before like Chambers did in round 2,.. so they sit back in a protective shell, while they're feeling that ram-rod crunch, crunch, crunch, crunch on the outside,.. and hope for him to get close enough to counter with something explosive,... but it doesn't happen,.. they just freeze up waiting.

Essentially, I believe it's Wlad's monsterous power, that detters the game plan, once they taste it, I think they feel they could be finished at any second, so they're shut down in a defensive ball trying to preserve themselves for the miracle that they can counter with something big, but he never comes into thier range, and his punches hurt so much from the unreachable fringe.

It is a nightmare style,.. extremely difficult to solve this.

 

You got some good points here and there,..

........but careful Irishman,... *twist* *twist* *pshhhhh!!* .... I dont want those trigger itchy mod's to take you away again,...

 

Tua vs wlad :bears:

 

If Prime Tyson were to fight Wlad right now, I think Tyson would taste Wlad's power first, and he would be discouraged.

 

Audrey harrison v Wlad :laughing:

 

At this point in time I think Darryl Tyson would fare better than Mike Tyson. In fact, I'll go as far as to say I think Cicely Tyson would do better than Mike Tyson.

TFK