Antonio Tarver: Eyes open or closed?

This age old myth has never truly been decided either way. Jones fans claim it was pure luck, that his eyes were shut and he swung for his life. Tarver's fan (Valdarver) claims it was a pin-point, crisp shot to the chin, set up beautifully by a master technician.

Who's right?

:dunno: Discuss.

 

:laughing:








:flip:

 

:CalvinBrock:

 

I suspect that he may have blinked.
Accordingly, the decision should really be over-turned

 

This was THE most lucky punch in the history of boxing. Milkdud's eyes were closed as he kinda flinched.. afraid to get hit.. he just wildly thru and it was like winnin the lotto!!

 

Well considering that his eyes were indeed closed and the punch landed perfectly on the vulnerable area of the jaw I can see how people called it a fluke.......but nonetheless he threw it.

I find it funny though how people claim Roy was chinny because that home run of a punch would've dropped a horse.

 

But would it have dropped a horse? How do you know? Tarver's landed those kinds of punches against all kinds of opponents. I can only really recall poor Johnson being totally fucked up by him.

 

dsimon writes:

To truly answer this question we have to see how the punch was set up and understand Roy Jones foible as a fighter.

Tarver previously had only hit Roy substantially on the ropes (first fight). Tarver made a real effort to get to Roy and actually press him prior to cornering him. He did this knowing that Roy could conceviably counter him. So in my mind Tarver deserves credit on this account... he set Roy up for the punch and he didn't wait for Roy to get cornered to unload the punch.

It turns out, despite the excuses by the legion of his fans, that Roy was seriously vulnerable on the chin. I cite Johnson's victory to establish this fact. So Tarver's punch did not have to be outstanding to have its desired effect, Roy is Chinny and would have been vulnerable to a big punch (Lou DEvalle style) any time in his career.

 

Tarver caught Roy with a perfect shot. He was too patient for his own good in the first fight and worried about Roy's countering, but this time around he got to him with a great shot.

I very rarely buy into that "lucky" punch stuff, unless it's a case like Tua-Rahman I where the punch shouldn't have counted. You train in the gym to exploit mistakes and do maximum damage. That's what Tarver did.

 

Even more proof that he got clocked by 1 good shot.

 

Here is the logic of calling Jones chinny.....


He never got hit in his career, anyone could have done it :notallthere: .

He got hit by Devalle good, but the KD from a partial slip didn't happen. Therefore he is chinny :notallthere:

Tarver didn't hit Roy the first fight :notallthere:

A clean shot when you are looking away with no defense and don't see it coming should make you blink, not fall down :notallthere:

Tarver hurt Roy again in the third fight but Roy withstood it and came back, therefore he is chinny:dunno: :notallthere:

 

No such thing as a lucky shot. Doesn't matter if it's Rahman on Lewis, or Toney on Nunn.

I would never call Tarver a "master technician", but he meant to lay out Roy with that shot and aimed it perfectly.

 

Wurd.

 

When a pro gets hit cleanly from a punch they didn't even have a chance to flinch on, it is at least fortunate? :dunno:

 

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I see where you're going with this, but I'd still shy away from calling a punch like the one Taver landed on Roy "good fortune."

The exchange in the corner went like this:

Roy attempts a counter-right cross which is short.

Tarver partially evades the punch, and you can see Tarver's left hand is already "cocked", meaning he's anticipating that Roy is going to fall back.

Roy sees that Tarver is going to launch his counter-attack and even puts his right hand up to block, but unfortunately Roy's chin was still out there.​

Nothing in that sequence struck me as "lucky" or "fortunate." It's about as "lucky" a punch as a chess player check mating an opponent with a pawn. It seems incredible, but it can happen. It just takes planning.

 

He ducked his head in order to avoid the counter, and may have closed his eyes, but he knew where he was going, and what he was doing. What's interesting is that RJJ could've gotten out of the way of the punch - except that he himself was trying to land a shot. I'm not sure if he saw the shot coming or not, but I think he did - I think he just got greedy in there, which is definitely strange for RJJ who usually was not greedy enough.

 

Roy looks away out in the audience, backs up to the corner, looks away and throws a shot without covering up or getting out of the way. I'd say that is fortunate for Tarver he didn't have to fight another round and Roy didn't make the 10 count and Jones didn't defend the shot in any way shape or form. You don't like the definition of the word, get a petition going to Webster :dunno:

 

Well if you meant that it's fortunate that "Tarver won" in Tarver's case, doesn't that go without saying for any fighter who wins a bout? :dunno:

 

We are talking about a punch landing that wasn't seen and ending the fight with minimal effort.

 

dsimon writes:

Roy definitely thought Tarver came to play patticake again. But Roy's strategy of engaging Tarver by going back to the ropes backfired. Tarver hit him before he got to the ropes, he set him up knowing Roy would try to get to the ropes, so Tarver was quite deliberate in this regard.

Roy didn't get up cause he couldn't cause Roy's chin was/is not that good. You can spin it any way you want but that is the truth. Tarver has never been a particularly strong puncher, neither has Johnson been a particularly strong puncher.

 

If his chin wasn't that good, in 150+ fights in pro and amateur it would have happened before he was prime mid thirties. I'm not the one spinning anything here......

 

Tarver fucked up griffin and Eric harding

 

i think tarver is definitely a big puncher. what's weird is how RJJ took all of tarver's best shots in the first fight, but was KTFO in the second.

 

....and took his shot in the third fight and stayed up, OH BUT WAIT!!!!! He has a weak chin!

 

That's skill.

 

Yeah, but, but, but, Roy never got hit clean.......the second fight wasn't a lucky punch! :: Logic always gets shot down when you try to bash a fighter.

 

Thta's one lucky punch :dunno:

 

dsimon writes:

Roy was good enough not to let it happen. I mean Roy was a great fighter his talents were undeniable, but his chin was never exposed until a fighter who ko'ed 18 out of 28 opponents caught him with a solid punch. The next guy he fought read the blue print and did the same thing. To me this tells me that Roy could compensate for his weakness when he was on top of his game but not later down the line. Did his chin get bad with age? Possably, though not probably.

 

dsimon writes:

Roy took nothing much from Tarver. He was set up against the ropes the first fight, protecting his head through the flurries. I doubt he got caught clean with one good shot all night that first fight... everything was deflected a bit at teh very least. Tarver is a good all round fighter but he is not a big puncher. 18 Ko's in 28 victories.