The idea hit me today that the enormous problem with holding in modern boxing might be down to refs breaking fighters too quickly. Where once guys would continue to protect themselves when they got close and tangled and fight out, these days they'll usually either clinch or put their arms in the air in anticipation of the inevitable intervention of the over active ref. Obviously the idea of breaking fighters quickly intuitively seems like the way to reduce holding but I suspect its having the opposite effect. This chime with anyone?
Old fights often were dull because of it. I think they need to take points and fine people who hold. The only time holding should be allowed is when you are buzzed. It is the biggest problem in terms of turning people off of boxing. Boxing is all but over, but to postpone the inevitable end commission needs to start getting gangster with fighters. In fact, I would only guarantee 50% of the money and fine up to half for excessive holding.Holding must be weeded out completely.
Clinching should be like downs in football you are allow 4 clinches a round...and the ref should stay out of it....let the fights break each other...after 4 clinches lose a point. So you can win the round but only get 9pts if you clinch too often...
Nope, if the ref doesn't break them they'll sit there and hold each other so long you'd think they were doing the waltz. It's their oppurtunity to take a break and not get hit which this era of fighter abhors. No, a ref who breaks fighters immediately is what is needed.
I don't mind holding as long as Sugar Shane got away with it and beat the living shit out of margarito.
It comes down to the ref. Smoger for example was pretty good at allowing holding when it was obvious the boxers were wrassling a bit to get position to punch. Aggressive holding is OK, hugging for the sake of stifling action less so.
I agree with Free, if you clinch, you're conceding the round by telling the judges, hey I'mma hurtin', it's about time fighters learned to deal with pressure legally, at the moment they've got an easy 'out'. Blocking, counter-punching and fighting in circles is the way to deal with a stronger pressure fighter, if you cant do that, then you're not worthy to be a world champion.
if the referee does anything but take points from the offending fighter, he is only making matters worse. if he breaks them everytime, he's favoring the outside fighter (see Maligniaggi/Cherry). Likewise, if he let's them fight, he's favoring the guy who holds and hits (see Hopkins/Holmes). Either way, it's not fair. I guess there's other scenarios like when an outside guy holds the inside fighter who's just trying to throw punches. to the extent the referee can tell one fighter's holding and the other isn't, he should let the fight go but still take points. That's what always killed me about Ruiz - he'd hold a guy and then if the guy managed to punch him by breaking his hold, he'd act like was done an injustice. Ruiz should've lost every one of his fights in which he did nothing but hold - every fight.
That however is near impossible to do if you fight a short guy who simply rushes inside with his hands on temples and crashes his head against your chest. I think if we had such ruling, the short guys could use the rule to their benefit by forcing the other guy to hold and tangle with them
not sure what old fights you've seen but clinchers like Jack Johnson are the most boring fighters of all time
Therein lies the problem. Fighters clinch for various reasons and sometimes immediately breaking them up actually favors the clincher. Taking off points automatically would seem to be the solution, but that opens up another can of worms. Not every ref is going to penalize it the same. Also this is professional, not amateur boxing. It's not a fencing contest. Infighting is part of the game and it's inevitable when fighting on the inside there will be clinches. I think the best thing to do is start by punishing the worst offenders such as the Ruiz types and it needs to be done earlier in the fight. It doesn't help much if a guy is given two warnings, and then gets a point deducted in the 8th round after he's been holding the entire time.
I don't know the solution but i really do think something needs to be done... even if its just enforcing the rules more and taking more points away during the course of a match. the fact that john ruiz was EVER passed off as a credible boxer, let alone a heavyweight contender, is a disgrace to the sport. i think its long overdue for the sport to evolve in some way, and reducing the amount of clinches in a fight is one of the steps that needs to be taken
Well,.. I know a little something that could be done, when an opponent runs in right about chest level,... dont you?..:crafty:
