Negative boxing "expert" forum

I'm forwarding this topic that was started on another forum, because I think we can address it too.. Here is what they had to say:

Maybe the reason they say boxing is dying is related to the negative attitude of the people that come on here and degrade fighters they don't know anything about. For example, Jesus Ruiz might not deserve a title shot but he can fight. He has a punch and came up short against good competition. Who are these self-absorbed internet boxing experts that come on here and put down boxers that spend countless hours training and fighting for lousy money? I would rather see a guy like Jesus Ruiz give it everything he has than watch a lazy guy like Tarver squander his talent. This is just an example.

 

In all of his wins, Ruiz faced six opponents with +.500 records. His wins came against fighters whose combined record is 77-83-13

Just because he's a hard worker doesn't mean he deserves his shot over more worthy fighters.

 

That Jesus Ruiz is the one that winds up fighting Dawson takes a lot of of the wind out of the sail - or in this case being sale, since Shaw and Team Dawson were trying to sell everyone on the fact that nobody wants to fight him.

That's my biggest beef w/ Ruiz getting a shot. That and it - along with Tarver-Muriqi - will be televised on Showtime. A very shitty night of boxing for a network who in recent years prided itself on "great fights, no rights." This card reeks of personal favors, which denies them the right to talk shit about HBO, even if only for a month.

 

seriously. Ruiz is pretty bottom of the barrel. so it's not a good example to make the point.

and besides, the way i look at it, fighters should be grateful we're interested enough to waste our time discussing how crappy they are.

people do the same thing in all sports. how many times have you heard someone scream about how badly a certain pitcher sucked? or a quarterback?

i think it's just being a sensitive ass-kissing bitch to take the stand that all fighters deserve our unconditional admiration. fuck that. i'm a sports fan. not a groupie. if they're professional fighters and they suck? that's just how it is.

 

IMO boxing is not dying .. :dunno:


Don't believe the hype ..:nono:
This "boxing is dying" crap is being blown way out of proportion ..

 

It looks like a card HBO would do to waste a TV date and set up Tarver/Dawson.

Tarver is probably the worst fight besides Briggs, that Dawson could take. Tarver will knock him out with as single punch much like Eric Harding. Tarver will lose badly until he catches Dawson, then his lights will go out and Tarver can go out on top. :cheer: :cheer:

 

Yeah, boxing is dying because people criticize it on message boards.

It has nothing to do with too many divisions, too many titles, too many PPV's, not enough good fights on free TV, overpriced PPV's, stacked undercards being a thing of the past, corruption, bad judging and officiating, good fights not being made, a piss poor heavyweight division, inability to create new stars, etc, etc.

If people would just stop talking bad about boxing online, the sport would be back to it's glory days!


TFK

 

What I have found out during the years is that most boxing "experts" really don't know anythign about boxing.
I think that people that constantly criticize the sport need to move on somewhere else since they don't care for it, like Howie Cosell (another know-nothing and one helluva advertisement for birth control) eventually did in his miserable career.

 

Cupey this was a stupid topic at Boxingrecs and it is stupid here. aNY DECENT FIGHTER doesn't care what fans think. They pay the fighter's bills. If you want to see Cupey owned, look for this topic at Boxingrecs. CUPEY is the Rubio MHS of their board.

 

I actually think it's the opposite. Athletes/celebrities in general (though boxers in particular, for the sake of this discussion) are too used to being surrounded by yes men that the slightest bit of criticism (justified or otherwise) sets them off.

Floyd, for example, is the first cat to say "I keep it real", yet doesn't want to hear anyone's REAL opinion, unless it's 100% flattery.

Further proof that the pen is mightier than the sword. That's my take on the state of the game today.

 

we can't all be groupies like you Karl. the sport needs objective viewers too who don't base their preferences on the amount of access a fighter gives them, or whether or not he's will to spar with them.

 

oFF TOPIC.....The pen is mightier than the sword is the worst cliche in the English language. It is 100% false. Would you rather someone right Jake is a douche or shoot you in the head. Violence is always mightier than the written word. Sorry, just one fascistas perspective.

 

I really wasn't referring to fighters, Jake.
There are experts such as Al Bernstein and Gil Clancy that I enjoy listening to that don't knock the sport constantly, unlike some loudmouths and know-nothings out there is what I meant.
I also think Bob Papa is turning into one helluva commentator and did an outstanding job last Saturday night on HBO, and what a refreshing change from that idiot stumblebum, Larry Merchant.
Most of these "heroes" on the web really don't know much about boxing at all, IMO.

 

Well, when I'm the colour guy on HBO you won't have to worry anymore. I will bring vast knowledge to the broadcast.

 

I know what you're saying - I'm just saying that fighters today seem extremely fickle. They want endless coverage, but it has to all be of the congratulatory mode.

I don't necessarily disagree with you on the critics, and I'm right there with you in believing that Bob Papa is one of the best in the business (he's my personal favorite announcer, for what it's worth - both boxing and for the NY Giants :bears: ). But the topic seems to suggest that FANS are too hard on fighters, which is the point I was addressing. As Double L said earlier, it's no different than any other sport. Hell, look how many people refuse to accept the fact that Barry Bonds is one of - perhaps THE - greatest baseball players ever, and that Aaron's record will most likely be shattered by the All-Star break. Ichiro received far more criticism for slapping singles than credit for breaking the single-season hits record.

It's in every sport. Boxing just happens to be the one sport where fighters are forced to double as salesman. And a lot of them need to get thicker skin. That's the bottom line.

 

I agree totally.

 

Then why are so many athletes threatened by writers/journalists, when a grand total of zero (journalists) have a shot in hell if it were to come down to a physical altercation?

 

Gil Clancy and Larry Merchant are the same person. Except Merchant is straightforward about people's perception, while Clancy does nothing but talk about olden days. Its peopel like Clancy and other "it was better back then" guys that make the sport seem to be in bad shape.

The best need to fight the best, and thats it...which is something any person can figure out. the Colts would not be considered the best footabll team in the world by beating the Oklahoma Sooners

 

]
agREED - almost 100%. Substitute Clancy with Bert Sugar and I'll give it my full blessing

 

Well, Gil is correct about the good old days.
I never said the sport was in bad shape, it is mainly people that have no background that say that.

 

they are the anus and taint of opinions

 

They'd be more threatned if you broughT a .30/.30 and aimed it at them. Athletes are spoiled cunts. I had a friend who got a full ride for playing Volleyball, the lowest rung of sports. The guy did whatever he wanted. People took care of him. Even at low levels, athletes are surrounded by yes men. I am not saying the pen has no power, but write what you want about me, if you try to break my arm, I would be upset. The pen has less power and to me that point is undisputable; hence, my revulsion to that silly cliche.

 

Does this rule not apply to Floyd Mayweather ? :dunno:

 

You are out of your fucking mind about Clancy. The guy is a wealth of knowledge. Bert Sugar is nothing more than a repressed homosexual, specifically a repressed homosexual with a fetish for black penis. This is why he always has a large cylindrical object of darkish brown hue in his mouth. He also makes ridiculous assertions on people's greatness. Clancy was the best color commentator in the HISTORY OF BOXING. SIT ON THAT AND SPIN.

 

analogies and inference are not ur strong suit

 

dsimon writes:

I can see Karl's point of view and yours as well. For example, I like Ike, but the ease with which he can get on here and say things about a fighter like CAstillo is disturbing to me.... albeite I support his right to do it. On the other hand having a critical eye makes any endevour worthy. When every palooka is the next Jack Johnson we have a problem.

I don't agree with you about Floyd Jake. I think that if you look at Floyd carefully you can see that his boys support him unconditionally as peers and many in the know say he could be a great, there is also a tendency for the establishment as a whole to critiscize him and make him feel like he should be doing more than he is doing.

Lets look at Tyson back in the day and Floyd. Nobody questioned Mike's greatness, nor his abilities. He knocked people out so he was carte blanche. Floyd doesn't fight that way and people often demand that he fight more aggressively and make him feel inadequate.

I predict this: Oscar won't press Floyd half as hard as Baldimore. And because Floyd doesn't KO people that will be Floyd's inadequacy as well.

 

I'm not a big fan of it, or any other cliche for that matter. But it is applicable to celebrities. Sad but true. Therefore, no real comparison to, say, someone hurting your feelings or mine.

 

A fan can say anything he wants. I think writers should be held to a higher standard. They are trying to cover and continue the interest in a sport. Although, my favorite sport's writer is T.J Simers. He hates boxing but he his friends with DLH. He calls OSCAR A FLATHEAD which I don't get but yesterday he wrote 2 paragraphs on how flat and odd Oscar's head was. :: :: I don't know if you guys know of Simers but he really pushes it. Kobe Bryant tried to get him kicked out of the Lakers press corps because Simers said Kobe quit last year in the playoffs. He was threatend physically by Raul Mondesi, Kevin Brown , Gary Matthews Junior (Simers told him to grow up because he was silent on HGH charges:: :: ) and Jeff Kent. He pushes it but he is a columist for the Los ANgeles Times, not a dickhead with a email account and a stupid screen name like me.


If you guys are interested, I will type in his last article. Or if any of you have the online times account display it. He called Floyd a little shrimp and went on and on about what a cunt Floyd is and how Leanard Elerbee is like his protective fighter. It is about as much shit talking you will ever see in a legit media outlet. It was decent smack for fightbeat.

 

If his friends gave a shit about him they would've warned him before offering the self-proclamation as the "50 Cent of Boxing" ::

I know there's a lot of unwarranted criticism (writers demanding Gatti-Ward (though they really mean Corrales-Castillo I) in downing a perfect, though less crowd-pleasing, performance) in the media. Some people take it too far, and there's no question that there's a certain clique of print writers who will beat to death the same agenda, even when non-applicable. But the shit I take issue with is fighters/fight personalities getting pissy with constructive criticism/objective viewpoints.

That's why I say what I said before. It's also why I don't do anywhere as many interviews as I used to; I generally have a very low tolerance level for bullshit as it is, and the more you talk to people in boxing, chances are the more they are lying to you. Of course there are exceptions, just like there are exceptions to the perception that most writers offer an uninformed opinion.

 

Who's Jesus Ruiz, John's little brother?