I know some of you don't pay attention to compubox numbers and my myself i try not to, but even when i disregard compubox i felt castillo won. Anyway the compubox numbers were: 173 Castillo 66 Floyd Floyd won a UD 115-111 115-111 116-111 The whole HBO crew had it for Castillo, with Lederman's card reading 115-111 for Castillo. Not to mention it was Castillo who was the champion and the challanger is supposed to take it from the champion right?
yeah, I thought Castillo won 7-5. He should have stepped it up sooner thoguh, he basically gave the first 4 rounds away. It's not liek Floyd was doing anything special early, but Castillo did almost nothing.
Castillo did crap in the first 4-5 rounds, and Compubox means little. Are you going to follow a system that says Mayweather landed 220+ punches on De La Hoya, Oscar 260+ on Trinidad, and Trinidad 160+ on Oscar?
If fighter A outlands fighter B in one round 20-5, then fighter B outlands him in the next three rounds 6-2, the compubox shows edge to fighter A 26-21, while fighter B wins the fight 39-36
"Not to mention it was Castillo who was the champion and the challanger is supposed to take it from the champion right?" one of my pet hates in boxing.....going into the fight, everything is even...(or supposed to be at least)....if the fight is a draw, the champion keeps his belt....thats the advantage he has as a champion....at no point should the fact that he is the champion influence the scoring
I hate that shit too. I get it from a lot of old timers especially. When the champion enters the ring, he is no longer the champ IMO. He has to fight to regain that belt just as hard as the challenger has to fight. Sup Adam
Bingo! A genius walks among us. :clap: :: This is what I always say. It's not that punchstats are entirely useless (though their usefulness even diagnostically is debatable)....it's that you do not score fights by stats. You score by round. That makes all the difference. Peace.
26-23, and 39-37, but points well taken. sorry, i just have this thing with numbers. consider it part of the "jake rules" :: I had the first fight a draw, 113-113. there are some fights, though, where punchstats do tell the story when the judges didn't. for instance, to this day, I still can't see how Morales beat Espadas the first time they fought (2001), and the punchstats support the popular opinion on how that fight should've turned out. whereas, you take a fight like Pavlik-Taylor, where jermain was up on the cards prior to the stoppage AND had statistical advantages across the board, yet most thought Pavlik was winning the fight up to and including the stoppage.
Are we going to have to start calling you AnALjaKe from now on? :: True on the inconsistency of punchstats...at the end of the day fights are scored by round and punchstats cannot account for the "cleanness" with which a punch lands, force, level of power in a punch (jab or powershot), etc. ANd I do think that often partially blocked/deflected blows get counted. There is also obvious human error there (then again, that exists in all of judging/scoring :: ). It is simply a fun diagnostic, sometimes useful, no more. Should NEVER be used to score a fight. Peace.
Anyway, as already mentioned, Floyd won the first 4 rounds. NO WAY Castillo won 7 of the next 8!! :nono: Floyd also won the 8th, 10th and 11th. There may even be another in there somewhere too.
Never let it be said that you aren't a wise man Mr. Jake. I had it a draw as well. Most who scored the fight for Castillo did so due to erroneously scoring the 9th round (I believe it was the 9th, could have been the 10th) for Castillo. Floyd lost a point for using his elbow which SHOULD have made it a 9-9 round. Those who wrongly scored the fight for Castillo made it a 10-8 round which helped him pick up the point he'd lost previously.
My biggest problem with punchstats - and I probably shouldn't be saying this since they're partnered with the site Cupey won't let me mention here - is that I've literally watched their reps look, here, there and everywhere but in the direction of the ring during a fight. Granted, I know their focus is on the main event. But when I see stats for fighters past fights, that took place in undercard bouts, my money is on their casually watching the fight (at best) with little substance/accuracy behind the numbers. Even for the fights where they are allegedly paying attention, how often is the case where most of us are seeing one fight, the announcers another, and the punchstat guys something different altogether? Plus what they classify as power punches covers way too much (and this is basically an extension on what you mentioned). If a conventional fighter throws anything other than a left jab, it's considered a power shot, and ditto for a southpaw throwing anything other than a left jab.
True, a slapping left to the body is in the stats the same as a perfect fight hand on chin. Also when a guy paws with his left, that can be no punch of five jabs depending on the guy who counts them. To understand how unreliable punchstats are, all we have to do is to look amateur fights and their scoring. I have seen fights where one judge has scored it about 16-12 while the other guy has it 5-4 ans stuff like that. That difference comes in four two-minute rounds with judges being at ringside and being responsible for their work. Then change it to 12x3 min rounds, the stat guys sitting 60 ft away from the ring and not caring how they do...
Ding, ding! I've been preaching this for years. It would be great if everyone understood it. As to PBF-Castillo I (for you and Musze) - I had it 114-113 for Mayweather. In the 8th round, Castillo won it but was docked a point for hitting on the break. In the 10th round, Floyd won it but was deducted a point for using the elbow. I had it 6-5-1 for PBF. Peace.
