Sugar Ray Leonard: an appreciation.

Greatest P4P fighter ever?

I think so.

Let's discuss.

 

i have him right behind Ali as my fav of all time..

no doubt.. he is at or near the top p4p

 

Right on, LOK.

Sugar Ray Leonard:
* Olympic champion
* five-weight world champion
* flamboyant yet incredible boxing technician
* great chin, single-minded, awesome handspeed and very underated power
* took over boxing when Ali retired and drew larger audiences - reignited the public’s interest with boxing.
* superb finisher, able to pick fighters apart, working on their weaknesses, exposing any flaw in their technique - if you were a brawlers, boxers or sluggers.
* fought everyone and ducked no-one
* ruled in an era where the 147-160lb was at it's strongest

There's really no contest.

 

That's basically true however he was quite an opportunist when it came to his opposition.

 

My fucking ass. Don't get me start on Leonard winning both the Super MW and LHW title at a catch-weight against Donnie LaLonde.

Is there another example in boxing history of belts from 2 different weight classes being on the line in one fight.

Fought everyone? Who did he fight during his multiple retirements? Where was he from 1984 to 1987 when Mike McCallum wanted his ass at 154?

Also, didn't he lose the biggest Welterweight fight of his career against a former lightweight?

Leonard was a great fighter and won some big fights, but lets be honest in recollecting his career.

 

I hate Ray Leonard as much as I hate any fighter. My favorite Leonard bouts are the Norris and Camacho fights.

With that said, if he were around today in his prime...there wouldn't have been a DLH, Trinidad, Mosley or Mayweather.

He would have beaten them all.

Take all the best qualities of all those guys, all those qualities Ray had.

 

Yeah, that was a great big sham. :nono:

 

He never fought Pryor. Otherwise, I love SRL....they just need someone else to host the contender.

 

Ray Leonard is the man:bears:

I also agree with Musze that he would have beaten all of the guys he listed.

 

McCallum is the one that always irks me. The guy was the top Jr MW from 1984 to 1988 and none of the "Big 3" (or 4 if you include Hagler at 160) every fought him.

I know there was this reason, or that reason, or eye injury or another fight lined-up, but I say bullshit. Don't call yourself a 5 weight class Champion if you didn't face the guy that was knocking everybody out for 4 years in one of those divisions.

 

I wish he was around today so he could make Marg look like the limited sloth that he is.

 

:bears:

The major gripe I have with SRL is the McCallum avoidance, as I do with the other 'names' of that era.

To truly be 'the best', you have to fight and beat 'the best' (or at least those widely regarded as perhaps being 'the best'). McCallum most certainly fits into that category.

MTF

 

I made this same thread about a year or two ago.

IMO Ray Leonard matches up faorably with 99% of fighters ever. Not only does he have the resume to be the "greatest" he has the skills to be called the "best"

Oh and I hope he dies of a testicular tumor

 

This thread is tailor-made for one of Free Ike's epic anti-Leonard rants.

 

you can despise Ray Leonard all you like, but his record is pristine

 

I still think the stoppage of both Benitez and Kalule were too premature and the 'Draw' in his second bout with Hearns was bullshit as well as his 'win' over Hagler.:flip:

 

So, it takes just ONE avoidance to tarnish an incredible career/resume?
Wilred Benitez
Roberto Duran
Thomas Hearns
Marvin Hagler

I'll take any of those guys over Aaron 'Totally Overrated' Pryor and Mike McCallum any day:
1 - Pryor's entire career is based on one fucking fight against an aging blown-up featherweight.

2 - WTF should Leonard come out of retirement and tough it out against a young McCallum and see a $10mill payday against Hagler go down the drain?

Not only was Leonard the best boxer of his era - he was the smartest.

 

You gotta be fuckin kiddin me! Benitez and Duran would have got thier asses kicked by McCallum at 154. And McCallum arguably beats Hearns as well. The only one from that list that definitely beats McCallum is Hagler.

Pryor is my boy, but I agree he's a bit overrated. I seriously doubt he could have beaten Ray. Leonard was too big for him. McCallum on the other hand, would have posed a real threat to Leonard.

 

On paper yes. Ray is obviously the "greater" fighter. However if he were to try fighting all the guys from 147 De La Hoya, Quartey, Trinidad, Whitaker, Mayweather, then go to 154 and take on Vargas, Tito, Winky and then onto 160 to fight Pavlik or Hopkins.

I don't see him going through the entire list of fighters without a single blemish on his record.

 

I won't bite.

 

From 147-154 he'd beat them all. I honestly cant see any one of those guys listed being able to pull off what Duran did to Ray.

At 160 a PRIME Hopkins would be a real threat to him. And Jones would have beaten him handily at 160. Pavlik? I'm not sure. Kelly has yet to fight anybody with the speed, and skill set of Leonard. But then again, outside of Floyd and Roy, theres NO current fighter who had the talent and skill set that Ray had.

 

In a single mythical matchup against just about all of those guys you'd have to favor Ray. (with the exception of the middleweights)

All i'm trying to say is that if he fought each and every one of them in his career he would have been in some tough fights and have at least one notch in the loss column.

 

I know one fighter who would NOT notch a victory over a prime Ray........... Terry Norris.:flip:

 

leonard would've fucked pavlik up and served him like donny lalonde.

he loses to hopkins and jones at 160 though.

 

That loss could have been at 160, not below. None of those guys had any advantages over Ray. Ray was technically brilliant, had a good chin and balls. If you hurt him, he became more dangerous. if you were beating him, he could come back and knock you out. None of the guys mentioned can lay claim to more than one of those qualities.

Plus, with Hopkins...the best Bernard could have done is maul him. Seeing that Ray and Jones are roughly the same height...if Ray had his legs under him, I can see him winning an ugly decision. Plus, Bernard can't handle handspeed. ray would have that all day long on him.

I'd have trouble with Ray beating Pavlik simply because Kelly is so damn big.

 

is pavlik much bigger than the 168 or 175 version of hearns? or say, donnie lalonde?

 

Ray never fought the 168 or 175 pound version of Hearns. He also never fought the 175 pound version of Lalonde. Yet he was still knocked down a collective 3 times by those guys.

 

well hearns rematch was for a 168 title although they weighed in as middleweights.

lalonde fight was at 168/175. i think they weighed in twice.

either way, pavlik was nearly knocked the fuck out by JT. leonard would've finished him.

 

Nah, Ray made Lalonde come all the way down. But it was for both titles.

 

well regardless, 168 is a higher weight than 160. lalonde was a title holder at 175. is pavlik bigger than him? ray was also much smaller against lalonde and despite the knockdown, he still fucked him up and finished him cold.