Ahhh.... it has begun.... the stupidity of casual fans...

That's the most illogical post I've seen you make :scratcher:

 

Sly,

Despite Your Loooooooooooooooooong Winded Attempt @ DEFENDING Floyd, the FACT Is, he CHERRYPICKED the Moment he Arrived @ '47...Superfeather, Lightweight and Super Lightweight Floyd is ABOVE Reproach, but he CLEARLY Became a Cherry Picking OPPORTUNIST @ Welter and Super Welter...

To Suggest Otherwise is an INSULT to the Intelligence of Your Boxing Brethren, Bruh...





REED:zz:

 

Floyd did not clear out any weight class, did he? Certainly not 130, 135 or 140.

Floyd can make a legit claim at being tbe. He had two close almost losses in an undefeated career. I don't think any other undefeated fighter's resume is as good as Floyd's, either.

In many ways, his overall standing could have jumped many places on so many more people's rankings, but he held out for more money against Pacquiao instead of solidifying his resume.
So, I don't care if people underrate him. That's on him.

 

It's not about who Floyd fought, its about who he didn't fight. And many of the ones he did fight were under Very calculated and favorable circumstances.

 

By dive I don't mean something pre-arranged, I mean, making your professional boxing debut against Floyd Mayweather jr,.... :tick: sounds.....weird.

 

REED Doubts it Happens, Personally...

Floyd WILL NOT Engage in Anything OTHER than a Boxing Match (& REED DOESN'T Blame Floyd 1 Bit, Either)...

Beyond That, WHY Would Dana White and UFC Willing GIVE UP Control of THE Most Important and Marketable Fighter in the History of their Organization, in a STACKED DECK Scenario, Co-Promoted by Floyd???...

It Has, and Will CONTINUE to Be Talked @ Length, but REED Can't See it Happening...


REED:Con:

 

Care to explain why you think it is illogical? Or will you just make a snide remark and run away like a certain troll we have here

 

Not with Floys hands+ age. If the unimaginable happens and he breaks both hands on Conors head early on, we could have a match. But its pretty low, like 0.05% or so..

 

'Snide'? :scratcher:


Oh man.... ::

 

We're getting somewhere now....

I'm glad you admit that at the three lower weights he's "above reproach". That in itself should tell you something. Now I don't agree that at 147lb and above he's been a cherry picking dodger..and I will prove my point on that later...but for argument sake...let's assume he has; so that I can address your point.

How many great fighters in history have actually campaigned at 3 weights in the first place? As a fighter moves up in weight the understanding is that he puts himself at more and more of a disadvantage as he's fighting opponents that are naturally bigger than himself. As such the higher he goes the more "slack" you have to cut him in terms of who he fights.

Let me explain:

When Leonard moved up to his third weight class he fought an aging Hagler and that was it. He refused to give this aging Hagler a rematch, even though many felt that Hagler won. Was Leonard criticized for this by fans like you? No. Why? Because it was considered a great feat by itself that he even won a title in a 3rd division. Did Leonard wait there and face Michael Nunn? No. Did he try to fight guys like Nigel Benn or Michael Watson? No. Did people care? no.

Leonard moves up and faces Lalonde!! Not virgil Hill, Prince Charles Williams, or whatever bad boy was up at that weight but Donny fucking Lalonde. Do we care? No. Why? Because Leonard had already proven himself at the lower weights and this was just icing on the cake.

Roy Jones won titles at 3 weight classes: 160,168 and 175. Then he moved up to Heavyweight. At Heavyweight did he fight Tyson? no. Did he fight Lewis? Did he fight Bowe? No...he fought the softest champion there is...John Ruiz. After that fight I distinctly remember you starting a thread titled "Roy Jones is the best fighter in the fucking wooooooorrrrrllld!!" or something to that effect. It was only John Ruiz...but did you care and did anyone care? No. Why? Because winning a title at a 4th weight classes when you are at a clear natural size disadvantage is enough of a feat in an of itself. We all understood that then and we still understand that now.

"However"

Floyd in his 4th and 5th weight classes fight guys like De La Hoya, Canelo, Cotto, Hatton.....who are all significantly better than John Ruiz P4P (and Donny fucking Lalonde), and he's called a cherry picking motherfucker!

Don't you see the inconsistency in this logic? Do you not see the hypocrisy?

And like I said at the beginning : NO FUCKING WAY can De La Hoya, Canelo, Cotto, Mosley, Hatton...just to name five be considered cherry picking...ESPECIALLY De La Hoya and Canelo. Even Cotto and Mosley. Consider Cotto for one second:

Before facing Floyd he had beaten a Shane Mosley who would go on to knock margarito the fuck out a couple years after. He beat a still capable Mosley. Soon before facing Floyd he had also avenged his loss to Margarito. Then After facing Floyd he would go on to knock out Gabrielle Martinez at Middleweight...a guy that had beaten huge Kelly Pavlik and had knocked out steel chinned Paul Williams. So.....contrary to popular fightbeat opinion, the Cotto that Floyd faced was PRIME and formidable and not a soft touch.

So the realm of Floyd's cherry picking according to your assertion is becoming smaller and smaller upon closer analysis.

 

I agree with teh consensus on one thing though: This is a nonsense fight. Floyd should have picked a better fight to get his 50-0. He shoud have challenged "One Time" or something.

 

Here's the Problem, Sly...

@ his "4th Weight Class", Floyd was Facing SMALLER MEN the Majority of the Time...In the VAST MAJORITY of his "Welterweight" Fights, Floyd Fought Guys who Eventually MOVED UP to that Weight Class AND were Shorter in Height and Reach...

Let's Go Down the List...

Sharmba Mitchell - Smaller Man, Best Years @ 140...
Zab Judah - Smaller Man, Best Years @ 140...
Baldomir - Shorter Man, Shorter Reach...
Hatton - Shorter Man, Shorter Reach, Best Years @ 140...
Marquez - Jumped Up 2 Weight Classes to Face Floyd, Who INTENTIONALLY Violated the Mandated Catchweight, Paying a $750,000 Penalty in Route to this MISMATCH...Fought as LOW as 126...

Shane Mosley - Was Brought In as a SACRIFICIAL LAMB for Margarita, but Of Course Floyd Jumped @ the Chance to Face Mosley AFTER the Threat of Margarita was Removed...

Victor Ortiz - Got the Floyd Fight by Virtue of Beating Andre Berto...Best Years @ 140...

Miguel Cotto - Smaller Man, Shorter Arms, Shorter Reach, Began Career @ 135...

Robert Guerrero - Like Ortiz, ONLY Got the Floyd Fight Because he Upset Berto...Began Career @ 126...

Marcos Maidana - Shorter Man, Shorter Arms, Best Years @ 140...Wouldn't Allow Maidana to Wear his PREFERRED Gloves...

Manny Pacquiao - Scared SHITLESS of Facing Him When the Fight was @ it's APEX, Despite the FACT Manny Began his Career @ 106...Considerably Shorter in Height and Reach...

Andre Berto - After Trying for YEARS to Get the LIMITED Berto in the Ring, Floyd Finally Succeeded...Shorter Arms, Shorter Reach Though...


Granted, Floyd Faced DeLa @ '54 and Had NO Size Advantage @ All...Against Canelo, Floyd was Taller, Had a Looooooooonger Reach AND he Made Canelo Fight @ a Catchweight...

Stylistically, it Would've Been NICE to See Floyd w/a Tall, Southpaw like Paul Williams....A Tall Banger Like Margarito, who he Probably COULDN'T Hurt...Or and Athletic, Southpaw Like Sergio Martinez...

It's NOT a Coincidence that the VAST MAJORITY of Floyd's "Welterweight" Fights were Against SMALLER Men, Bruh...

If You Want to Get Deeeeeeeeeeeeeep w/the Shit, Let's Get to the Very BOTTOM of the Matter....







REEDopcorn:

 

It would have been nice to see prime Jones fight Darius, Calzaghe, Jirov and a prime experienced Bernard Hopkins also. As a Jones fan I received those arguments constantly as I'm sure you did. How do you answer those now?

But I digress...

Floyd fought who was available and viable at the time. Williams and Margarito were not viable opponents when he was seeking a fight against Oscar De La Hoya.....in the same way Chris Byrd wasn't viable when Lennox was seeking a fight against Mike Tyson. After returning against Hatton...Mayweather could only fight who was available at 147lb at the time and guess what...they were mostly guys his height and below. By the way.....Welterweights in 2017 are still pretty much his height and below....just look at Garcia and Thurman, for example. You can't blame a man for fighting teh available opponents. Which taller fighters did he avoid?

You bring up Margarito constantly. When was he this big threat to Floyd. I'm sure that you...knowing Maregarito's style, speed and defense....would pick Floyd to have beaten him 100x out of 100. It would have been a clinic. After that mismatch people would have been criticizing Floyd for fighting a face first mexican with no hand speed and no defense.

Search your feelings, you know it to be true! (Vader voice)

Williams...would have presented Floyd with unique challenges I'll give you that. But tell me...when was Williams in a position to be a Floyd opponent? From what I recall, it was only during the period of time that Floyd was going after De La Hoya and then retired (a well earned retirement I may add....5 titles in 5 weight classes).

 

Someone tends to forget Floyd REEDtired to not have to fight the guys we wanted to see him fight.

 

No, that's revisionist history. He retired...because he was frustrtaed with teh criticism he was receiving, particularly from Larry Merchant, about how boring his fights were. Baldomir was called out as an extrememly boxing title fight and that was followed by the De La Hoya fight which Larry called out as having two boring fights in succession. Mayweather had a mini meltdown after that and soon after announced his retirement.

But again....why didn't Leonard received teh same criticism when he retired after Hagler only to come back against Lalonde?

 

he REEDtired after the Hatton fight.

Your theory is Floyd REEDtired because of merchant's comments.

Got it.

 

I'm guessing because beating Hagler would be like Floyd beating GGG. You get a lot of free passes after something like that.

 

He announced an official retirement after the De La Hoya fight. After the Hatton fight he took a break. Its been a while and so if my recollection is incorrect I'm happy to be corrected. I don't think he was ducking Cotto, Williams or Margarito. Up to that point it wasn't in Floyd's history to duck fighters so why would he start then? It's not logical.

 

Yes, a man is entitled to free passes after facing and beating teh lineal champion in his 3rd division. I agree.

I disagree that Leonard facing Hagler is the equivalent of Floyd facing GGG though. Floyd started out winning titles at 130lbs and Leonard started out winning titles at 147lbs. 160lbs for Leonard is not the same as a 160lbs for Mayweather. Leonard's equivalent of GGG would have been Michael Moorer at 175lbs.

 

Wrong again.

Up until 2002-2003 you'd be hard pressed to find anyone with issues with Floyd's record. It was the Castillo fight that changed him.

secondly, did you say he 'retired" for 6 months to fight Hatton to then take an 18 month break?

methinks you're confusing retirement and a break.

 

You know what. Fuck Floyd.

he's irrelevant and I'm glad he's gone.

Biggest chickenshit "great" fighter ever.

As much as I hated DLH I can't give him shit about his record. In fact, Oscar did the opposite...as he got older and made more money he faced better fighters and made every effort to challenge himself.

 

DLH also took a blatant dive against Hop, so can't him tooooo much credit.

 

Anyone BUT Sly Can Easily Discern Floyd "Retired" After the Hatton Fight to Allow Margarito, Cotto, Sugar Shane and Tall Paul to Face Each Other...

Floyd Took the Path of LEAST Resistance, Inviting Marquez Up to a Catchweight he Had NOfuckingINTENTIONS of Honoring, Instead...








REED

 

Retirement is when you announce it. How long it lasts is another issue. Floyd announced his retirement after Oscar. Hatton happened to goad him back into the ring after calling him out in the ring after the Castillo KO.

After Hatton Floyd said he's taking a break. He always implied that he would return eventually. How long that break lasts...is irrelevant.

 

I'm not a mind reader so I don't know what was going on in his head...and neither are you or anyone else. It's all assumption and conjecture. All we can go by is what the man said...and that's that he was taking a break. We are all arguing as though it's a fact that he ducked those fellas......but it's no fact. He took a break. I don't know how the same guy that challenged himself against Corrales, Castillo and De La Hoya would suddenly run scared from Margarito and Cotto. Makes no sense.

Besides he eventually fought teh same Cotto, he fought Mosley after Shane looked like a killer against Margarito...and jumped into the ring at a post Floyd interview and called him out. Floyd has never shown any sign of ducking fighters. That's ludicrous. Shiiiiiiiiiiit...at almost 40 years old he decided to rematch Maidana, who came the closest to ever beating him. That's not a ducker.

 

No, it's CRYSTAL Clear to Anyone NOT Man Crushing on Floyd...

If You HONESTLY Wonder WHY You've Been Given the Floyd Nuthugger Tag, Look Nooooooo Fuuuuuuurther than This Very Thread, Brother Sly...

You LITERALLY Insinuated Floyd "Retired" Because Larry Merchant was Being MEAN to Him...

WOW!!!...REED was FIRMLY Attached to Roy's Sack, but THIS is Some Next Level Nuthuggery...





REED::

 

The Floyd "nuthugger" tag is stuck to me regardless of what I do....so I'm not trying to remove it. I'm just trying to show that most Floyd criticism regarding his career is unfounded. It's hypocrisy. Yes Floyd retired teh first time because he was tired of the criticism and the Merchant thing was the icing on the cake. I remember. It's a fact.

 

So, by Your OWN Admission, Floyd Retired Because a 5'5, Geriatric DRUNKARD was Mean to Him, yet You CAN'T Bring Yourself to Acknowledge Floyd CHERRYPICKED his Way Thru '47???...

Even AFTER REED Broke Down EACH Guy he Faced @ the Weight for You???...

Does that REALLY Seem "Logical" to YOU, Since You Persist in Throwing the Word Out There???...

The Floyd "Nuthugger" Tag is YOUR Cross to Bear Because of the Lengths YOU CHOOSE to Go to, in Defending Him...

There's NO Absolving Floyd for Retiring After the Hatton Fight, Only to Return Against JM Marquez, While Cotto, Margarito, Mosley and Williams Fought EACH OTHER for Welterweight Supremacy, Bruh...

That WASN'T a Mere Coincidence Either...




REED::

 

Exactly.
And at the constant hyping of DLH as a dangerous foes. DLH at the time was clearly on the decline and was more interested in snorting coke. He was nothing more than a part time fighter. Only a few DLH lovers were interested in that fight. Didn't even bother to watch it since the result was such a foregone conclusion

 

Yeah, only a few people interested in DLH/Floyd. That it set ppv records, etc. No big deal.