Best heavyweight reign ever?

Chagaev and Haye did both beat them, but in most case, they were toward the end of their respective career, and every fight was super close (save Ruiz Haye but even in this one, Ruiz had enough success that I would probably pick him in his prime). Plus Chagaev fought Wlad post hepatitis, it's unclear how much it took out of him.

No Ruiz and Valuev weren't any great shake, but their style's would have each presented Wlad with a unique challenge, and both were better than pretty much all the garbage Wlad fought save arguably Povetkin and Chagaev (not Haye imo). And no matter of spinning won't change that during the Klitshko's era, outside if the brothers, they made the most defenses and were constantly ranked in the top 5 moreso than anyone else save maybe Byrd.

 

That's another point, they basically each ''cleaned'' only half of a terrible division

 

Don't agree at all, looking at George's list of Wlad opposition, and it's even worst than I remember. Utter garbage. Guy's like Thomas, Tucker, Tubbs, Spinks,... were much better imo

 

Unlike Louis, Wlad had lots more fat on his record than he had quality, but it should be remembered, that he did have quality. Povetkin and Byrd would beat everyone Tyson beat. Haye and Chagaev would beat most of them as well. The fact that Wlad defended something like eighteen times to Tyson's nine only reinforces that he should be above.

I'm not spinning anything. I'm pointing out that Wlad beat two fighters in unifications who beat BOTH of the fighters you're accusing him of skipping. I have no doubt if Wlad had faced Valuev and Ruiz instead of Haye and Chagaev, his record would be less impressive. And there'd be much more room for accusations if he avoided Haye and Chagaev over Ruiz and Valuev.

Furthermore, when should Wlad have unified? Valuev didn't have a belt in 2007 and neither did Ruiz. They fought for a vacant title in 2008, and Ruiz was 3-3 over the previous four years. Wlad on the other hand, only beat Byrd in 2006, and then tried to unify with Briggs. In 2007, he avenged his most recent loss, then he unified with Ibragimov. After beating Ruiz, Valuev almost lost to a fifty year old Holyfield, then actually lost to David Haye then retired. Wlad was beating top ranked fighters through this time.

 

Povetkin and Byrd woulf beat eveyone Tyson beat ?? While I respect your opinion this is beyond absurd in mine . Tucker, Tubbs, Spinks, Thomas, Ruddock, Golota (not title the past 2 I know). Hell even an old Holmes and Bruno were a cut above Byrd imo.

As pathetic as it sounds, Ruiz and Valuev were much more a staple of the 2000's (post Lewis) hw than Chagaev (especially post hepatitis) and Haye ever were. In fact, they both are amongst the top 5 of that era (at worst top 6). I don't see how you can claim Wlad ''cleaned'' his division considering he never fought those two (nor his brother).

 

Yeah, dont think povetkin nor Byrd would beat all tyson opponents. For all the skills povetkin seems to have, he always looked pretty mediocre once he fought top opposition. I think it would take a miracle for him to survive Ruddock, and id pick Spinks, Tucker and maybe old holmes against him. Byrd was a better fighter, and it's harder to tell how he would do since he had a pretty unique style. Still, don't think hed fair to well against Holmes, who still had a terrific jab.

And i do agree Ruiz and especially Valuev would be much more difficult stylistically than midget Chagaev and Haye (who always seems to be super cautious against tall hw). Hell, most think he lost to Valuev

 

Thinking about it, Byrd lost convincingly to Golota according to most people.

 

Ruiz and Valuev weren't more of a staple during Wlad's reign. Ruiz and Wlad were co champions for SIX MONTHS. That'd be like accusing Wlad of missing out on Wilder. Valuev was co champion for slightly longer, but he was busy losing to fighters Wlad beat or fighting fifty year olds. And I think far too much is being made of the hepatitis thing. He was cleared to fight, I highly doubt he would be if there were severe symptoms. Chagaev didn't look too different vs Meehan, ring rust aside.

Anyway, the point I'm trying to make is that wins over Valuev and Ruiz, aren't as good as wins over two men who beat both. He also happened to take the titles these two had by beating them too as well.

If I went through the individual match-ups, maybe I'd reconsider a couple. Povetkin looks to have the style to beat most, but Byrd may struggle. Then again, I thought there was a legitimate argument for Byrd being up vs Vitali and I'm pretty sure I had it even after eight. I've no doubt he'd be able to beat Tucker, Tubbs and co. It's only Thomas I'd be weary of. I'd absolutely take Povetkin over Spinks and Holmes, though. They looked like decrepit shells vs Tyson, before they were annihilated. Sure, Tyson had something to do with it, but in fairly certain age, injuries and time off had more to it. Spinks looked like shit before Tyson, vs Cooney. The speed advantage Byrd had over Old Holmes, plus being southpaw, would be too much IMO. And I can't for the life of me see Bruno out-boxing Byrd. Furthermore, it's not even just those two standing for Wlad. Pulev and Thompson would beat Berbick and Smith. Haye would beat Bruno, Spinks and Peter wouldn't do too shabby vs most of the lot. Upon reflection, I'd probably rate Thomas slightly higher than I'd rate the rest of them. Pretty sure he was on the heroine by then though.

I will give you Golota, as I forgot they actually fought. IIRC, I actually had that one a draw. Either way, Tyson's initial reign doesn't include Golota, so it doesn't matter anyway.

 

I think Spinks looked pretty good against Cooney. And I'm really surprised you pick Haye against Bruno. I think he can stick his weird jab in Haye mug pretty much at will. And while his chin wasnt granite, i think it's good enough to withstand the occasional Haye bomb

 

I wasn't a fan of either so I can say this without bias, that whilst I think Bruno was the better fighter, I think stylistically I might actually favour Haye. His head movement was actually decent and I could see him slipping Bruno's jab and catching Frank with something he doesn't see coming. Whether he has the balls to do it is another thing, but he definitely has the tools to win that one imo.

 

I don't think it's impossible for Haye to win this, but i see him as a big underdog. Haye looked poor at hw against the two guys who were jabbing him and not coming in directly at him