Career's Ov'r, He's Un'd Rated...

He was stopped by Johnson after he had beaten Jefferson and Rahman. He then went on to become the WBC heavyweight champ, and has avoided Ramonzas dreaded list.

 

Yeah, he wasn't brought in to beat Hasim Rahman or to break the ankle of "Derrick Jefferson I Love You".

Maybe he was simply better suited as the underdog.

 

Agree, Corrales could hit hard and he was very exciting because he could hit but was always vulnerable because of a less than stellar chin

but he gets beaten by an awful lot of 130-135 fighters all time, they dont all do what Floyd did to him (which was just remarkable) but plenty of them get a W just the same

 

bullshit

that weight shit is ridiculous

dude made the weight fine TWO YEARS LATER AFTER BEING IN JAIL

anytime a fighter you dont like wins impressively, you pile up mountains of bullshit as to why the guy won

like your Leonard bullshit

 

because Mayweather didnt ALLOW IT TO HAPPEN

because he was WAY BETTER THAN CORRALES

 

I think Corales had a strong chin. His defense was just so horrible that he used to take tons of flush shots on chops that would put most people down.

 

he got hurt a lot and got hurt by guys who were not big punchers

I think he was tough and resilient, but thats not the same as being able to take a good shot

the fact that he gor hurt a lot helped make him exciting

 

Lol strong chin? That's funny.

 

Yeah...I also think that it was unfair to Maskaev for Rahman to get KO'd by Maskaev and then find, 2 fights later, that Rahman had a title shot in South Africa. You don't bring a guy in to mark time with Rahman, Tua, McCall, etc, unless you think he will be of limited resistance.

 

Maskaev wasn't eligible for consideration on my list.

 

Maskaev was nothing

He got knocked out by Corey Sanders, the fat behemoth journeyman and he was annihlated by gOOFI Whitaker

 

Yeah like I said he was underrated. How do you think he got to be underrated? By beating guys like Rahman and Jefferson all the time? Don't be daft.

 

he was a fairly talented fighter with the chin of a small child

and since when were Jefferson or Rahman anything special? (particularly Jefferson, who has a total of zero meaningful wins... shit at least Rahman managed to ice a ready to be KOd Lennox Lewis with a haymaker and was beating David Tua until he was caught with a cheap shot... and still he's nothing much)

hes not underrated, he shouldnt be RATED period

 

I rate him the former heavyweight champ of the world.

Oleg Maskaev, Former WBC Heavyweight Champeen.

You see....that's Oleg, "former champ" Maskaev.

Put that in your :Lok: and :Lok: it.

 

you ought to rate him the former "champeen" of the WBC

and again, I stand by the fact that if his name were Jamal Jackson and he had the exact same career you wouldn't be mentioning him at all

 

:stir: I remember Cotto groupies overhyping Torres after thier hero wobbled around the ring against him for 3/4's of the fight,... das dey one, das dey one, das dey one,.. he'll rule 140 when Cotto leaves it, he'll rule.

Even though he is still active however, I may have to mention Cotto,.. I think he's a bit underrated due to the fact that his 2 losses,.. have come against a pair of disgraceful cheating scum,... but how the fuck in a sport like boxing can I guarantee that Cotto isn't on something himself.. or has some 'tricks up his sleeve'...so to speak,.. it's a game with virtually no regulation for those sorts of things,.. Arum, and all his fighters do know that aswell as anyone.

 

John John Molina

Most people in USA remember him for his defeats against Oscar De La Hoya, Shane Mosley and Juan Lazcano in his very last fight. The truth is that Molina was a three time jr.lightweight champion with wins against decent opposition like Juan Laporte, Ben Tackie, Tony Lopez, Manuel Medina, Gregorio "Goyo" Vargas, Bernard Taylor, Wilson Rodriguez, etc. He retired with a record of 59 bouts, 52 wins, 33 KOs and only seven defeats (the defeats against Mosley, Garcia & Lazcano occurred when Molina was waaay past his prime and almost shot).

Other two underrated boxers are Fernando Vargas and David Reid. Sure, is now easy to put down these two fighters as mere wannabes and Trinidad's victims, but before Trinidad these two guys captured the attention of many boxing fans and were gracing the covers of Ring magazine and other boxing publications. Sure, they won world titles too soon, too young and couldn't cope with defeat well, but while they have it going, they were pretty good and fun to watch, particularly Vargas who even though was easy to hate, always made exciting fights.

 

David Reid was garbage

 

Vargas was a very good fighter at his peak, Reid didn't really impress me.

 

Jj molina was a lot further down the road to shot after mosley ripped him in half

 

He was way past his prime when he fought Mosley. Even in Puerto Rico no one was giving him a chance to win that bout and Mosley was not a superstar yet.

 

Vargas was slow, stupid, and suffered from recurring obesity.

 

Vargas was an exciting fighter who did a lot young & developed quickly. I tend to think of Vargas as a little under-rated historically, yes --- I say a little, because he did lose his most telling bouts, but he also won some great scraps against quality opposition at a very young age, & I'm someone who places a lot of value in that.

Since he's only remembered as a bridesmaid to Trinidad, De La Hoya, & Mosley, yes, I would say he won't have quite the legacy he should, & this comes from an open critic of Vargas, the man.

 

I think Vargas always lacked a quart of speed, both upstairs and down. His pre-Tito wins of note were against guys like Ross Thompson, Winky Wright {he arguably lost that fight and seemed clueless for large parts of it on how to deal with Wrights style}, Yory Boy Campas....who had one decent win on his entire ledger, and of course Ike Quartey, who was inactive and past his best.

I do think Vargas would never have reached the levels of guys like Oscar or Tito no matter how slowly he was brought along. He lacked the size and punch of Tito, and the finesse and handspeed of Oscar.

I do think, however, by way of agreeing with you, that losses to guys like Mayorga and Mosley when Fernando was waaaaay past his best, and was struggling with weight and injury issues, have caused him to be regarded, unfairly, as some total non-achiever. That and the steroids thing.

 

I hear you...I just put more stock in those victories early in his career, I think. Sure, it's true Quartey's best days were behind him, but Vargas was a very young fighter. Even though he is a contemporary in historical terms, it's almost unheard of for fighters today to be signing fights against the guys Vargas was at comparable --- or even considerably more advanced --- stages of their career. Look at Andre Berto today. Berto is a good, capable fighter, & I have time for him, but some thirty bouts & five or six years into his career, he still hasn't faced anyone like this, & that's the norm.

In his thirteenth fight, Vargas faces & beats Campas? Defeats Wright in his sixteenth? Bout number-seventeen is against Ike Quartey, & he wins that, too? I think that's pretty impressive, personally. They threw Vargas to the wolves in match-making, & he acquitted himself in fine fashion, even if you felt he narrowly lost any of those bouts. About lacking speed --- it's true. Every fighter lacks something, though, even most of the greats had at least one fairly obvious short-coming.

Vargas will never be remembered as a truly great fighter, & I wouldn't argue he deserves to be, but I would say he won't get the respect, historically, he's entitled to. With that said, it is difficult to feel much sympathy for a character like him.

 

I just don't think he beat Wright.....and I think Campas might well make it on to one of your "worst of all time" lists...::...MY God...a short armed, slow, face-first brawler, the very antithesis of the Wright who "beat" Vargas.

As for the early {chronologically speaking} nature of these fights......we could make an argument that the fatally-flawed David Reid must be up there too, by way of his beating Boudouani and winning a title so early in his career.

 

I don't think he beat Wright either, but it was a close fight, which in itself is very impressive at that stage in his career. As was the win over Quartey, who was still very capable. Vargas acquitted himself exceptionally well against a prime Tito as well, all this within what, 21 fights? That is crazy in todays safety first, cautious matchmaking world. Reid may have won a belt in double quick time, and the Boudouani win was a very good win, but his competition (outside of Tito obviously) doesn't compare.

 

Speaking of Jirov and his career being ov'r, supposedly he says he wants to return to cruiserweight...and fight a "name".

Haven't seen him fight in a while (he's had one fight since 2007, a two round TKO last October).

 

good post. anyone with the audacity to say that Reid, an Olympic Gold Medalist and world champion, is garbage, is simply a fucking idiot - a real opinionate asshole idiot.

 

as a pro? he was FUCKING GARBAGE

he was carefully manuevered into a "championship" ... he was absolute SHIT as a pro... his GREATEST VICTORY was against KEVIN KELLY, who isnt even the best known GUY NAMED KEVIN KELLY who ever boxed

he struggled in every one of his 5 or 6 fights against NOBODIES before he fought Trinidad

He had a decorated amateur career... which means NOTHING in this discussion

he was absolutely UNREMARKABLE in every conceivable way as a pro

that said... he was still better than Cintron