Rugby Union World Cup 2015

::

Ma North American laddies won 17 tae 10.

SEE YOU!

 

Ah did read the article, last night, thought Ah'd wait a wee while tae reply. Sooth Africa have won it twice in 1995 and 2007. There is an argument they'd be stronger wi'oot the quotas but thet dae need such measures tae force inclusion, in ma opinion.

They were complete bassas and were rightly excluded from international sport fer 3 decades. We've seen whit damage 5 years oot did fer English fitba so fer Sooth Africa tae still be competetive is an achievement. The Sooth Africans alsae used tae have the most corrupt refs, tae the point o' physical danger tae opposition players, and even told the ALL BLACKS no' tae play any aboriginal (e.g. Moari, Samoan, Tongan etc) players during a tour in the sixties, terms which tae New Zealand's eternal discredit, they accepted!

So if Ye dinnae want quotas imposed - dinnae impose yer own!

SEE YOU, Springboks!

 

Quotas hurt sport. Period.

As for the purported logic that the way to fight quotas is with quotas..........well the argument against that is self-evident.

Taken on further,the lunacy of this is magnified by the fact that SQUAD need only reflect a quota, and the team need not.

Over the course of a tournament, this has the dual effect of weakening a team and lending a fairly evident slant to the inclusion, at later stages, of inferior, quota-based talent on the basis that they are only now being drafted as the better players have been broken down by the rigours of tournament.

 

Racism hurts sport worse. Full stop.

Sooth Africa's fat Dutchmen iced the blecks oot fer many a year and noo they must pay the piper. They managed tae be even worse, and fer longer, than the US segregated baseball leagues.

Ah willnae waste any salt on those white buffalo laddies having tae noo address the balance.

 

White South African males, descended as they are from an immigrant farming population are a superior breed of athlete in any event when it comes to Rugby and Boxing in South Africa.


The Dutch are the tallest race in Europe and the World.


The best Black South African they made was a fucking Zimbabwean.

Sanders, Botha, Coetzee and friends didn't make the breakthrough because of some racial assistance laws.

There is ZERO EVIDENCE that the racial profile of the team would have changed one iota without apartheid and the fact that the quota is enforced basically admits that the only way to get them into the team is to let them into the team.

 

Aye, it's just pure luck and coincidence that there have been quite a few world class black players who've played fer Sooth Africa since apartheid went, eh, Ye bam? We'll just havetae take yer take on the White Buffalo being physically superior as EVIDENCE... ::

Here's a wee bit o' relevant history fer Ye:

'From the early years the game had been enthusiastically and passionately adopted by coloured and black populations in the Cape colony, and the Eastern Cape in particular, but rugby organisation (under the South Africa Coloured Rugby Board formed in 1896) and teams were kept segregated with discrimination against black and coloured players and little government funding.

Even before the 1948 elections in South Africa in which the apartheid government came to power and legislated systematically along racial lines, foreign sporting teams going to South Africa had felt it necessary to exclude non-white players. New Zealand rugby teams in particular had done this, and the exclusion of George Nepia and Jimmy Mill from the 1928 All Blacks tour, and the dropping of "Ranji" Wilson from the New Zealand Army team nine years before that, had attracted little comment at the time.'

So no' only were Sooth Africa no' letting blacks play fer them, they wouldnae let other teams either!

Ad wondae hoo Ye'd have felt aboot it if Bokke had said: NO IRISH!

SEE YOU!

 

I never denied they were kept out.................where did I deny that they were kept out.....:scratcher:

What I deny is that their being kept out was why they never made it...........it's like Jamaica had a "Blacks Only" sprint programme....so fucking what ::

 

And where did Ah say Ye were denying that they were kept oot, like, Fergus O'Strawman? ::

Ma problem is wi' yer first statement which seem's tae indicate, backed up ba EVIDENCE o' yer further posts on the matter, that the quota is the reason SA willnae win a 'fucking thing':

This is factually incorrect, since the quota's have been enforced Sooth Africa have won two World Cups and numerous Tri-Nation comps. SEE YOU!

As fer yer: 'What I deny is that their being kept out was why they never made it', mince - where's yer EVIDENCE that it wiznae the case? Ah wid suggest tae Ye that EVIDENCE o' there being World Class Sooth African blecks playing in the last 20 years or so wid lead tae a fair assumption that there were other worthy laddies denied fair entry tae the Springboks during the apartheid years, like.

Ye can quota me on the above matter being the case.

 

They won it with Whitey.

No Whitey, no Winny. {See you Winny, see you!!!}

 

Embrace the power of the Orange Protestant Settler, Billeh, embrace it {Just for once like :atu:}

 

::

They had auld Chesterfield, the bleck winger, in 1995, and 9 blecks in the 2007 squad (inc. the incomparable Bryan Habana).

So, cut them some slacky they havetae play blacky (just kilting).

 

Habana was practically untouchable in the 2007 WC, they wouldn't have won it without him.

 

In Ireland, certainly in the past and mostly true at present, the Irish rugby team were largely drawn from certain social strata, which reflected the fact that a small number of private schools acted as hothouses for rugby talent, with the facilities, resources and interest not shared across other parts of the country. My impression is that the SA rugby team were again drawn from a relatively small number of private schools, which until recently and still are to a large extent populated by white afrikaaners. That will change over time, and it may be possible that it will become a street game in South Africa, which will change the demographic further. There is certainly institutionalised racism at play, though I would doubt there is an equal or better panel of black players who are being excluded for that reason.
Incidentally, the reasons stated at the start of post are largely why I don't give a fuck about the Irish rugby team and their faggoty "Ireland's call" anthem, the alickadoos, the polished "on message" marketing speak of most of their players, as well as sponsors drawn from financial services and other blue chip companies...not for me.

 

White Daddy, Don't Be Maddy!!!

Also..............England won that game, try should have been given, but Paddy robbed them.

<iframe width="854" height="480" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/o_j2s4HKckA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

SEE YOU SPECSAVERS SEE YOU TMO

 

Yet..........Ireland have consistently been one of the better teams in the game. punching way beyond their weight, and O'Driscoll was regarded as a knacker from the Northside when he went playing Rugby...........:dunno:

The story about the quotas shits on every other win bar 2007 and 1995............because it creates this figment that South Africa were operating at half-strength or worse. Can't have it.

 

Regarded by whom as a knacker? He comes from the mean streets of Clontarf ffs, its giving prominence to the opinion of a tiny number South Dublin dwellers who all live within 10 miles of one another and send their sons to rugby schools.

 

He said it himself.............in one of his books no less.

When he went playing soccer, he was a posho from Clontarf.

When he went playing Rugby, a knacker from the Northside.

In a way, regarding the other stuff, you kind of make my point.

Yes, there may well be, out there in Knacker-Ville, an unearthed Rugby diamond or two BUT it seems that the genotype of Los Poshos is producing enough talented players to suggest that they may actually be, at some level, predisposed to producing the goods.

I know the Dutch South Africans, Australians and New Zealanders all have in common an immigrant, agrarian and {dare I say it} physical background which is Worlds apart from the Public School ethos of Rob Andrew, Will "Poke Your Highness" Carling etc.

If you take the best, whittle out the Chaff with a round the world boat ride that leaves you with only the baddest and the best, then breed them........you will get some fairly hardy bucks.

The Dutch in South Africa are a good example. A lot of the British casualties during the Boer War were caused by teenaged Dutch who had been raised in the farming and rifle-bearing traditions of their forbears.

 

I thought the same at the time, in hindsight it's hard to confirm either way. I have to say SA were the better team and the best in the tournament overall, I don't begrudge them that win although it would have been an amazing story if England had managed to come back from the abyss and retain the trophy

 

And therein lies my point, the shadow of an England team taking the tourney by storm, dumping out the hosts and then going life-and-death with Quota South Africa......there's a bit more to winning than making sure everyone gets a chance to play ::

France had shit on New Zealand but couldn't buy a yard of ground from the English {albeit property prices are massive ::}

 

To be fair they totally annihilated us in the pool stage, 36-0 or something

 

You say they are "predisposed", I say the Irish case shows that where interest and resources are concentrated or restricted to a select group, and coaches and selectors are also drawn from said group, there will of course be an inclination not to look outwards. You put it down to brawny boers who eat steaks, I suggest its well-fed boers who are fed steak daily early on when their talents emerge or appear promising. I don't think the outcome would be much different for black South Africans who were pushed through the same system, in fact the rising number of black players coming from private schools would confirm that. Either way, I agree and don't think the situation is comparable with the American baseball leagues from the early 20th cen.

 

What aboot flabby retired boxers with a paunch and a penchant for golf :dunno: ::

What's his secret ............

You have to want to pick that ball up and go for it.........you can't feed that.

 

Listen laddie, Ye and me have never had a cross word. Ah havetae respect the fact that Ye are the owner o' a prood, cucumber sized (on the slack!) whallaper but Ah cannae believe Ye've had the gall tae slaughter ma 'baseball apartheid' analogy.

Ah think we need O'TK tae mediate befoor this escalates intae a fully blown fyewd, like.

:up:

PS - AH boggin' love 'Ireland's Call' and always sing along wi' it. SEE YOU!

 

I still remember when Ireland's call was launched by Phil Coulter [shudder] and the fat singer who 'starred' in the commitments film. I understand its a gesture to the Ulster brethren who might have felt uncomfortable about the language [Gaelic] and blood sacrifice nationalist lyrics of our national anthem [although that discomfort is probably equally felt among plenty in the Irish rugby community], but like all such gestures, its cringe-inducing and anaemic, I find it laughable when I see a shower of Irish jessies in the crowd crying and bellowing out asinine lyrics like "Hearts of steelAnd heads unbowing, Vowing never to be broken, We will fight, until We can fight no more, From the four proud provinces of Ireland".

Re South African rugby, I can't say because I don't really know, but I'd say the number of existing elite black rugby playing saffies is still a small number, because the game in south africa still hasn't been embraced as a game like soccer by the common man, and because the hothouses of excellence are still the largely white private schools

 

Well, Ah cannae ask fer a more honest reply than that.

Ah hear whit yer saying. Rugby is still seen as 'the man's' game in Sooth Africa and it wiznae unknown fer the blacks tae openly saepport teams like New Zealand whenever they played the Boks as some sortae protest against the poower that was. Ah alsae see yer point ref private schools as they alsae continae tae be the soource o' mostae the English players (and Ireland's too, ba the soonds o' it). If there aren't too many blacks attending private schools in SA, there will naturally be a v limited soource and the fact that there may be untapped talent in the main populace is o' no use whitsoever and is a moot point. Ah dig whit yer saying.

Incidentally, looking forward tae playing the Sasnachs tomorrow?

 

I had a laugh at Gatland's Mourinho-esque comments that whoever loses tommorow, they will face entering the world cup having experienced two consecutive losses to home nation teams...his comments do ring true though, it would be a bit of a blow for either Ireland or England....honestly, I have a niggling feeling that Ireland have peaked 6-12 months too early, that it will be a disappointing tournament. What do you think yourself?

 

Ah read yer post and agREED on all points.

Apart from the odd blip here and there, Ireland have had the rub on England fer many a year since 2003 and have stuck more moral sapping losses on the Sasnachs than even New Zealand and Sooth Africa have during that period.

They are a bogey side fer England and have matched the English strength and alsae ootwitted them in the breakdoons in the majority of recent encoonters.

Ah thought the loss of BOD wid have more of an impact then it did. Ireland are still in good shape and wi' far less players tae select from.

Having written all that, Ah believe England will win tomorrow at home - based on Ireland's performance against the Welsh.