The time for GGG to move up to 168 has come!

agreed 100% about HBO being the culptrit, disagreed about moving at 168 lbs not being the answer. Sure, super middleweight ain't jacked with talent. But I'd much rather see GGG fight Jack, Degale, Bute or the Dirrell bros over the Tureano Johnson and Dominic Wade of the world. And if he really is a natural mw, he could alway's come back to 160 lbs if Canelo ever decides to man up. Cause as of now, not only do I barely have any interest in GGG career (and I used to really like him) but he's also racing against the clock as time is definitively not on his side

 

Sure, because the margin between each weight division (all 17 of them) is such that no fighter should agree to move up a whole 8 lbs to challenge himself alm:. Not surprising boxing is in the shitter if its fans have this state of mind.

 

but would any of those guys actually fight him? there's guys like that at 160 who just won't fight him.

 

That's only because they aren't true middleweights or just happen to have other plans that year.

 

IF HBO shell out the money, I'm sure they would. Most of these guy's don't sell (or at the end of their career in Bute case). A win over GGG would do wonder for their career and is probably the biggest money fight for them too.

 

If by November Canelo hasn't fought or signed to fight GGG we can call him Chicken Ginger. After all, Oscar is his promoter.

 

bute is with haymon, dirrell brothers are with haymon, jack is with mayweather jr. none of those guys fight on HBO.

Golovkin already KOd bute when it meant something

 

It was already shown to you that they did some business together. But it seem that youll use this lame excuse as long as it enable you to defend these crappy matchups, for god knows what reasons,

 

golovkin vs jack, dirrells or bute are crappy matches.

 

And GGG vs Monroe and Wade WEREN'T???::...

Triple G vs ANY Of Those 3 is On Par w/the Lemieux Fight AT WORST, Which was GGG's Only PPV Headliner...



REED:hammert:

 

For the 500th Time, This is a Messageboard of Boxing FANS Discussing the Sport...Not Really Sure Why you PERSIST In Referencing the Business Side, as If It Justifies Anything...





REED:hammert:

 

Soon GGG can has cars. :bears:

 

Amen. The guy is hopeless. He acts like hes taking a cut out of fighters purse. Who care how much they make if they are fighting no hopers. Not to mention that anyone who claim that Degale, the dirells or grove are not compelling opponents for GGG is hypocritical to say the least, since they would be by far his best opponent.

 

History (on Fightbeat) has proven that if a dominant fighter moves up to face bigger fighters in the attempt to challenge himself and remains equally dominant at the higher weights regardless of how many divisions up he goes, fans will still criticize him and say that he fights bums. So why bother? Boxing fans reward guys that lose and struggle they hate guys that dominate.

 

That's a SMALL % of Boxing Fans You Speak of Though...

In the Case of Roy Jones (1 of THE More Hated Fighters in Boxing Messageboard History), Moving Up from Supermiddle and OWNING Lightheavy SECURED his Legacy...He was a Natural Supermiddle, who had Difficulties Getting Meaningful Fights @ the Weight (Post-Toney), So he Went UP a Class and Dominated a Division Full of Naturally LARGER Men...

That's PRECISELY the Dilemma Laying in GGG's Lap...

Sure, Roy Still Had his Haters, and Those SAME People Said he'd Never Even FIGHT John Ruiz, Nevermind BEAT Him...Obviously, Roy QUIETED the Majority of his Doubters that Night, in a Way He WOULDN'T, Had he Not Taken the Risk...

Floyd's Legacy and Net Worth WOULD NOT Be What it is Sans Moving Up in Weight...Imagine if Pac Fought No Higher than 135???...What if Duran NEVER Left 135???...

For Better or Worse, Multi Weight Champions are Treated More FAVORABLY, Historically Speaking (Excluding Heavyweights, Of Course)...Moving Up in Weight is the PATH to True Greatness, Particularly When You LACK "Names" in your Current Division....

If GGG's Unwilling to Agree to a Canelo Catchweight, he Simply HAS to Move Up, for the Sake of his Legacy...





REED:hammert:

 

No they will only criticize him if he doesnt fight the best availables oppositions in that weightclass

 

I said it cuz illuminati mentioned if golovkin is getting 3 to 5 million for these bums he has no incentive to face alvarez

 

I never agree with Neil, but here, I agree with him 100%.

 

So you're saying to avoid being criticized for weak opposition GGG should move to a weak division and dominate it and the evidence that this will end the criticism and secure his legacy is... Roy Jones. Hmm.

Floyd became a star when he moved up to fight DLH. The closest thing to a DLH for GGG is Canelo. Not any of these obscure Eurasian negroes.

 

With boxing in the state it is in circa 2016, does it really matter if Golovkin needs to 'cement a legacy'?
Does anyone really care about legacies anymore?

REED mentions Duran, Jones Jr, Mayweather Jr and Pacquiao - but the latest of those guys who 'made it big', were 'names' in the way Golovkin is now, back in 2002-05.
My point is, this is 10-12 years ago when boxing was far more relevant than it is today. You still had household names who were active in divisions from Bantamweight all through to Heavyweight.
Now, you have very little...so, as boxing has somewhat diminished in popularity and importance.....surely so does a 'legacy'? :dunno:

 

Yeah, it's not just that titles don't mean as much. Being a world class boxer isn't as prestigious as it used to be. They're like "sub-athletes" or something to most people.

Plus the bar has been set so low you see young fans calling guys like Sergio Martinez a "great" fighter because he beat two guys people had heard of and made like 4 successful defenses of his HBO contract. The idea that GGG can prove greatness by beating Badou Jack and James DeGale is insane but that's how desperate we are to see something relevant.

Back in the day Thurman, Brook, Garcia, Spence etc would've had to fight by now and get things sorted because there was a large paying public to demand it and there were enough worthwhile match ups being made that the public didn't have to settle for watching some guys that may or may not be good bashing up random guys for years on end. Theyd fight it out and produce a legitmately accomplished fighter or fill out undercards for a few grand.

The goal for most boxers nowadays seems to be to become a minor attraction and ride it til the wheels fall off.

 

Good post.
Exactly my point.

 

If you want to argue that boxing meant more 10-12 years ago, then I would say titles mean even more today for boxers to be relevant and make money. I don't really agree with the premise, but I don't care to dispute it.

Charles Martin is a millionaire for one reason and it sure as fuck isn't because his boxing ability ensured it.

To the same point, GGG is far better off cementing his legacy as a middleweight champ until, and unless, something much bigger awaits him at a higher weight. Legacy creates interest and as he nears Hagler and Monzon defense numbers, GGG is certain to draw bigger numbers than he otherwise would. This is amplified by having HBO pulling the wagon.

Plus, Hagler is best known for beating guys moving up in weight (Hearns and Mugabi) and losing to a guy moving up in weight (Leonard). GGG is in a similar position because the names below him are much bigger than the names immediately above him. Also, the two greatest prizes for him would be Pacquiao and Floyd, both of whom are still possible, if not likely.

 

Oh, I could definitely see Pac-GGG happening. And look! There's Papa Smurf!

 

You think it doesn't?
You have arguably the best defensive fighter of all-time coasting his way to victories and unabe to stay out of the limelight cos he's bored.

You have a multi-weight champion still involved in utterly meaningless fights as he decided when to enter politics.

The Heavyweight division: ::

That leaves you with a couple of Eastern European guys who look good but can't be judged because they don't fight anyone / can't fight anyone and only hardcore fans are aware of them.

 

It's just more of the same when it comes to boxing fans. The Golden Age Fallacy. Now, the mid-00's are getting it. It never stops.

If you want to make the argument, use objective facts. Let's hear about boxing revenue, televised fights, etc. Good luck.

 

No-one uses revenue or televised fights when gauging boxing 'popularity'...unless you're a business-stats freak.
How many people in the 1950s had televisions?
How many people now shell out for PPV?
How many boxers are actually 'known'?

 

i agree with mike. they have been saying "boxing is dead compared to 10 years ago" for as long as i remember.

but the facts just don't support it. not sure why people are always led to believe it though.

one thing is, there has not been as much boxing on network tv as there is now in a long time. obviously, that has different significance than it would have a decade ago though (more channels now; network tv no longer dominant, etc.).

 

That's for sure. While boxing is not all that presently, it is not as bad as a few immature persons claim it is.

 

Talent wise i agree, this is no golden age but they are quality fighters in the bunch. Still, i can't think of a time were the top fighters avoided each others so much. Look at all the talent at 147 yet they rarely fight each others, they'd much rather milk their minor celebrity status vs the bum brigade